SGOTM2 Germany - Team scout

How are we fixed for troops? I'm a little worried that we're vulnerable. We need to make sure we stay on the best of terms with Russia and France.

Don't empty their treasuries completely in tech trades (if you bankrupt a civ they can declare war on you just to get out of the GPT...)

I think we should build some rifles, with an eye towards upgrading to Infantry. We need to inventory our obsolete units and either upgrade them or (SLOWLY) disband them. I'd like a small squadron of roughly 1-2 dozen cavalry to skirmish in the defense, just in case. We need to continue building Galleons, because ship chaining is regarded as an exploit under RBCiv rules... if we ever have to fight a war overseas, we will need lots of transports. Better to upgrade than to build... because of the tech pace, our shipyards will need to build destroyers when Combusion becomes available.

Believe it or not, we might actually need Marines in this game. The AI seems to like researching Amphibious Warfare...so when we get close to Fission, we may want to see if that tech becomes available for trade...

If France gets the UN and we can't secure RoP with Russia, we might need to go AROUND Russia... If the UN gets built overseas we might want to consider a real "Blitzkrieg". Take a coastal city on the opening turn of the war and proceed inland immediately with Panzers...

We need to devote some careful thought to endgame, it is drawing near. Mutual Protection Pacts can make it touchy. We might be forced to declare war on somebody and wait for them to come after us first, to avoid a dogpile on us....

i thought it was a typo, heaven knows I make enough of them, especially in my posts in the history forum...

I once called the great JC "Juli Caesar"

My post above was @ Mistfit's, but Scout got in there too quick

@Scout's...

Yeah, we will need more military soon, I can just sense France becoming alarmed at the gpt deals and our tech dominance.

Also I would ask this - is it time we started "grooming" France as the UN builder? You know, preferential tech gifts etc? Late on, we should avoid giving Fission to anyone but France. I think that Joanie will want the UN enough not to trade that tech away. If we have left everyone else one or two techs behind, the game might be over before the other continent even has Fission...

"Grooming France"... I like that idea. What do the rest of you guys think? I wonder if Tal might have hit on something here...

Anonymous Quote

The first 10 - 12 techs we get, sell to everyone we can, for as much as we can (With the F.P comming online there is no reason we shouldn't be able to be 1st to every tech in 4 - 5 turns a pc.) Once we get to the last 3-4 techs of the era stop selling them.

Once we get to the modern era try to get to Fission 1st (this should be no problem either) at that point gift France everything up to and including Fission to give her a head start on building the UN.

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This is a quote from someone a few pages back.

So yeah I think it's a dandy Idea

Anonymous quote indeed!

My post was more about the timing (i.e. is there anything we can do now?), but I got carried away a little and that meaning seems to have vanished!

Edit: having re-read my post, I realise it was also a veiled reference to Scout's worries about naval forces... i.e. if we make sure France has it, we shouldn't need too many!

It's scary how worthless that above post of mine was! Still, Scout liked it, so that's something!

Will the AI build the UN even if they know they won't be calling for a vote. Example: will France build the UN even if they know that we are the biggest and best liked civ out there.

I believe so, if only to control it...

I can honestly say that I have never played a game in which an AI has built the UN.

I thought I'd take a moment to inject a little humor in here. Background: From time to time, another team leader and I have had (non-spoilered) communications on various topics. Occasionally we will discuss SGOTM2, and exchange... "politely worded cheap shots".

Here's his latest:

other team leader said:

Your team obviously has a cunning plan for a late spurt to wipe us all out

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And my reply:

scoutsout said:

Yes, our plan is nothing short of brilliant. After figuring out Mad-Bax doesn't care for Ramen Noodles, we came up with a better bribe to get MB to turn this into a PBEM. You will all be receiving your copies in e-mail on July 13. Your turns will begin as the leaders of Burgundium, having just built the UN in your capitol. Our Panzer Stacks of Doom will be parked just outside the city's gates.

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what is a pbem?

Mistfit said:

what is a pbem?

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"Play By E-Mail". Turn based multiplayer that became available with Play The World.

Got some good news guys....................... my diseth has ariveth! [dance]

Will be checking out the save within the hour, barring intallation time.

scoutsout said:

Your turns will begin as the leaders of Burgundium, having just built the UN in your capitol. Our Panzer Stacks of Doom will be parked just outside the city's gates.

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You almost gave the game away!

In fact, isn't that our plan??

Sorry for the double

Great news GK!! Welcome back fully! Sorry to hear about your house getting burgled - that absolutely sucks

Good to hear GK

Here are the available trades at from the last post

When did we get Military Tradition? I don't recall seeing that in the logs...

NP raised a good point with respect to France and her lack of coal. Do we want to exploit that? My initial inclination is to sell is cheap. This will make her less inclined to attack us, and get her going on the rails she'll need for a nice productive city to build the UN in...

Also, we might want to think about gifting England and China to parity. Gifted techs make for HUGE boosts in AI attitude...

Sanitation... we probably need to be prepared to self-research sanitation. Maybe if we hold off on trading any more monopoly techs we can research Sanitation and/or Replaceable Parts and trade for Corporation.

Mistfit said:

Out of curiosity sake what happened to the previous palace prebuild in Koni - it got changed to a factory? Did we gain that much from the factory that we could afford to waste the turns of the previous pre-build? Please don't take offense to this question I just would like to know your thought process here to better my game.

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Yes, and yes. US costs 800 shields, while a factory costs 240 shields and increases the city's shield output by 50%. So if you do the math, building the factory first brings the completion of the Wonder closer--only by a little (the relevant ratio is 773/800, I think), but then you have the factory as well as US at the end of the process. Of course, this assumes that there's no loss of shields involved in the switch from pre-build to factory, which there wasn't in this case; Konigsberg only had about 100 shields accumulated at the time.

No offense taken--I'm glad to explain my logic, when it exists.

On the (completely unimportant) issue of your eleven-turn round, you numbered 1010 AD correctly as turn 9, but then numbered 1020 AD as turn 11.

Scoutsout, are you sure that the RBCiv exploits list applies to this game? I thought we were only limited by the GOTM list--although it's hard to know, since the potentially relevant posts are scattered all over the place. It's vital that we should get this straight, since ship chaining is allowed by the GOTM list, and would save us a lot of time if the UN ended up on the other continent.

I'm not completely against helping the French get the UN when the time comes, but why are we so locked into that idea? Our protege civ doesn't have to be strong overall to build the UN, it just needs a few good cities, and the Russians--the closer Russians--satisfy that requirement.

Northern Pike said:

Scoutsout, are you sure that the RBCiv exploits list applies to this game?

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I'm 100% sure. SGOTM1 was played "according to (Mad-Bax's) interpretation of RBCiv rules", and I have not seen anything that indicates this has changed. Ship-chaining is, IMO, one of the most important differences between the GOTM rules and the RBCiv rules. Ship-chaining is also one of my favorite things to do... I think if I go through the trouble and expense of all that planning and pre-positioning, I ought to be allowed to do it...doing it right does take some effort of its own... but the RBCiv crowd regards it as an exploit.

Northern Pike said:

I'm not completely against helping the French get the UN when the time comes, but why are we so locked into that idea?

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We're not at all locked into that idea... and you're right, it would be WONDERFUL if it was built in Russia. It's just that the French tend to be a late-game powerhouse...

If we were to gift all the AI to perfect parity, and do nothing to "groom the French", my money would be on France to complete the UN.

Having said that, I wonder if we ought to groom Russia instead....

(Edit: In my first post to the thread I put a lot of 'rules' stuff in there... there's a paragraph on RBCiv with links if anyone cares, and there's a paragraph in there where I discuss ship chaining and palace jumping...)

I don't have the time to look into it right now, but the fact that we're both remembering SGOTM1 references to the RBCiv exploits, rather than anything explicitly said about this game, makes me suspicious. We need to pursue this issue--or better still, are you lurking, Mad-bax? Karasu?

I stand corrected. In this post Mad-Bax clearly states that we will be playing according to GOTM rules.

Ship chaining is in. My apologies.