Hiawatha & Cathy are still Runaways!!

They expand to 7 and 10 crappy cities and their science rate plunges. They then runaway in a downward spiral and into the ground where my X-COM soldiers mop 'em up!!! mua-ha-haha

I love BNW!! Goodbye city spammers and the tyranny of backstabbing AIs

... except the one-city-challenge style is ridiculous and weak (large swathes of the world uncolonized by the 1900's, really?), and the highly expansionistic AIs like Catherine are consequently generally more successful than the rest of the silly AIs whose scripts mean they'll sit in their three pitiful cities waiting to die a slow and excruciating death. Expansion wasn't killed off by BNW at all; the entire community is overreacting to the "Oh my GOSH! 5% science penalty!!!" that only really serves as a slight limiter to expansion rather than an actual barrier, much the same as the culture penalty.

- but yeah, the AI could still use a hand with some of its city placement spots, though BNW and updates have certainly improved things.

Strategist83 said:

... except the one-city-challenge style is ridiculous and weak (large swathes of the world uncolonized by the 1900's, really?), and the highly expansionistic AIs like Catherine are consequently generally more successful than the rest of the silly AIs whose scripts mean they'll sit in their three pitiful cities waiting to die a slow and excruciating death. Expansion wasn't killed off by BNW at all; the entire community is overreacting to the "Oh my GOSH! 5% science penalty!!!" that only really serves as a slight limiter to expansion rather than an actual barrier, much the same as the culture penalty.

- but yeah, the AI could still use a hand with some of its city placement spots, though BNW and updates have certainly improved things.

Click to expand...

Yes, the 5% science penalty is arguably only a "slight limiter" (although I'd argue it's more than "slight"), but add that on top of a nerfed Ceremonial Burial, steeper Happiness penalties, and weakened Happiness buildings. They all coalesce to make tall play almost unilaterally better than wide play.

I always wondered if I could spam settlers to found cities in bad spots (snow, tundra, no resources) and then gift them to other civs right after their founding to crash their science/unhappiness.

It seems Suleiman is a bit like that too as well....

In a very early BNW game I set up my capital, because I had quickly found Solomon's Mines and I was playing as Spain, very near to Cathy. And I decided to immediately be merciless..... I let her live, but try as she might, she could not get even a second city founded...the first few settlers I took as workers...the rest were eliminated....

Nasty, yes.....but I still had those nightmare memories from G&K of her going crazy with her expansion.... Hiawatha still expands, yes, but he does seem much more subdued in BNW....

[Aside: When I play as Spain I'll now resist placing my first settler too quickly....I'll look around for a while...sometimes even up to eight moves before settling to see if I can find a suitable wonder...... and, of course, I sometimes run into barbarian camps, which usually ends the game...though they don't always grab the settler...and sometimes I can cover quite a bit of ground before I have a problem.]

Elz Majesto said:

They expand to 7 and 10 crappy cities and their science rate plunges...

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I'm not finding that the science penalty affects the AI much on immortal and diety. They can plop a city on a snow tile surrounded by tundra and have it 10 in like 8 turns.

kamikazees said:

I'm not finding that the science penalty affects the AI much on immortal and diety. They can plop a city on a snow tile surrounded by tundra and have it 10 in like 8 turns.

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Yea, I noticed that too...my hunch, is Order tenet and then some trade routes to prop the city with food...

Cathy also build the great wall and takes the tradition opener every game she appears, meaning you have wait until artillery to deal with her... where is that Russo-Japanese war cartoon... I can't find it, but it is Russia as a huge octopus devouring the world with a samurai sanding over Korea cutting a tentacle off... And just like that guy, you need artillery to back you up.

In my current game in a span of about twelve turns Cathy got Petra, Hagia Sophia, Djenne, and Borobudur. Like she was popping a wonder every three turns.

I would like to know how she can do that, even with AI bonuses (immortal).

I...I have a runaway AI Byzantium in my game. IDK even.

Xiao Xiong said:

In my current game in a span of about twelve turns Cathy got Petra, Hagia Sophia, Djenne, and Borobudur. Like she was popping a wonder every three turns.

I would like to know how she can do that, even with AI bonuses (immortal).

Click to expand...

horse tiles?

darden said:

I always wondered if I could spam settlers to found cities in bad spots (snow, tundra, no resources) and then gift them to other civs right after their founding to crash their science/unhappiness.

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They just get razed.

I've captured cities and traded them for cash to the AI. A few turns later I've seen the AI raze the city to the ground, presumably because it's realised it's in the same boat.