Snoopy/Dale unofficial patch

So, not automated warehouse sell they increase taxes? That make automation unusable.
I am sorry, but you should consider the fast that it was ommitted by reason or fix automation to avoide overflow warehouses.
You can not have one with out other and I do not undestand how you can insist of adding this BUG which make part of the game unusable!
For god sake stop DAMAGE the game!

I don't see how it makes automation unusable. I've played MANY games, with colonies of up to 15 cities, and never had a problem with overflow. Oh, and yes I do use wagon automation and don't use excessive micro-management. You're not using warehouse expansions to avoid tax increases are you? You realise they hurt you more because of the double grab before you get your profit (warehouse cost and King's tax taken out)? I don't rely on that form of trade, and you shouldn't either.
 
As I beleive has been mentioned elsewhere when using this patch your starting ship has no units in it!
 
I don't see how it makes automation unusable. I've played MANY games, with colonies of up to 15 cities, and never had a problem with overflow. Oh, and yes I do use wagon automation and don't use excessive micro-management. You're not using warehouse expansions to avoid tax increases are you? You realise they hurt you more because of the double grab before you get your profit (warehouse cost and King's tax taken out)? I don't rely on that form of trade, and you shouldn't either.

The thing is Dale, and this is no complaint, because really appreciate all your efforts to make people enjoy this game more, but sometimes it feels like you're taking it personally when people bash the game. You have to understand that it doesn't matter if YOU have problems or not; If other people have problems, then a mistake has been done in the development.

I produce Ship-Of-The-Line in one city and produce tools and muskets for it in another city. It consumes 300 tools and 300 muskets (a full warehouse expansion) the very turn that it gets completed. Please tell me how I'm supposed to use the automated transports to synchronize this without suffering from overflow. I'm sure you can't, because it's impossible without micromanagement. Even if you somehow manage to get the perfect balance, what happens when you start producing cannons in that city instead?

This is one of these things that shouldn't even need to be discussed. There should be a simple way to frequently provide a Ship-Of-The-Line producing city with tools and muskets, without having to worry about overflow. If there isn't, then the developers have done a huge mistake. To quote Murphys Law: If anything can go wrong, it will.

What some doesn't seem to understand, is that Firaxis job is:

1: Identify the customers
2: Determine the customers requirements
3: Determine how the customers requirements will be met
4. Make the game

For example, if the majority of the customers want the FoY, then Firaxis should include it.

Since many of the regular customers are unhappy with a lot of features in the game, the project is clearly a failure so far. Claiming that they just have to adapt and learn how to play the game is just a waste of time. What we need to do is to define the problems and make Firaxis understand that they have to do better if they want to keep their customers.

The problem with this game is not that people don't like the new features. The problem with this game is that the AI, game balance, features and replayability are far worse than the original. Compare this with Civ II for example. How many people would prefer Civ I? Not many I'd say, because Civ II was clearly an improvement. This is not the case with Col 2.
 
Just tried this patch, same here no unit's in ship! after buying 3 from home?

I just had the same problem, every time I start a game my ship has no units on board. I thought it was something wrong with my install, so I completely reinstalled Colonization, re-applied the patch, and have the problem again.

I'm running Vista 64, if that might make a difference.
 
The thing is Dale, and this is no complaint, because really appreciate all your efforts to make people enjoy this game more, but sometimes it feels like you're taking it personally when people bash the game. You have to understand that it doesn't matter if YOU have problems or not; If other people have problems, then a mistake has been done in the development.

You must have misunderstood me. :) I'm not taking this personally. I'm disagreeing with the statement that making warehouse expansion trade count as trade makes automation unusable.

I'm disagreeing being what I fixed has nothing to do with automation. Even without the fix I generated the exact same thing occurs. The bug fix does not change how people play.

With the bug fix or without the bug fix, wagons will still cause an overflow. With the bug fix or without the bug fix, trade still occurs due to the overflow. With the bug fix or without the bug fix, wagon automation isn't properly balanced. With the bug fix or without the bug fix, you still pay 50% for the use of the warehouse expansion and then pay the King's taxes on top of that.

But putting the bug fix in does NOT make wagon automation unusable. It is exactly the same whether the bug fix is in or not.

As for wagon automation, and the amount of trade from the warehouse expansion, that's a BALANCE issue. Balance, because there is a need to balance how much is sold compared to how much is dumped and how much is brought to the warehouse. This bug fix patch is NOT about balance issues. It is about pure BUGS. Trade not being counted as trade (to the seller, buyer and the game itself) is a bug that is now fixed.

I produce Ship-Of-The-Line in one city and produce tools and muskets for it in another city. It consumes 300 tools and 300 muskets (a full warehouse expansion) the very turn that it gets completed. Please tell me how I'm supposed to use the automated transports to synchronize this without suffering from overflow. I'm sure you can't, because it's impossible without micromanagement. Even if you somehow manage to get the perfect balance, what happens when you start producing cannons in that city instead?

This is one of these things that shouldn't even need to be discussed. There should be a simple way to frequently provide a Ship-Of-The-Line producing city with tools and muskets, without having to worry about overflow. If there isn't, then the developers have done a huge mistake. To quote Murphys Law: If anything can go wrong, it will.

What some doesn't seem to understand, is that Firaxis job is:

1: Identify the customers
2: Determine the customers requirements
3: Determine how the customers requirements will be met
4. Make the game

For example, if the majority of the customers want the FoY, then Firaxis should include it.

Since many of the regular customers are unhappy with a lot of features in the game, the project is clearly a failure so far. Claiming that they just have to adapt and learn how to play the game is just a waste of time. What we need to do is to define the problems and make Firaxis understand that they have to do better if they want to keep their customers.

The problem with this game is not that people don't like the new features. The problem with this game is that the AI, game balance, features and replayability are far worse than the original. Compare this with Civ II for example. How many people would prefer Civ I? Not many I'd say, because Civ II was clearly an improvement. This is not the case with Col 2.

You said it yourself in the final paragraph: AI, game balance, features and replayability. They are NOT what this bug-fix patch is about. This bug-fix patch is to fix the BUGS, not balance issues.

BTW, if you would like to try my and Snoopy's BALANCE mod, then have a look at our PatchMod which is in the creation sub-forum. You'll also find some other modders are also publishing their own BALANCE mods to provide other solutions to the BALANCE issues. :)
 
I have to agree with what Dale said, basicly the game just wasn't incrementing counters correctly. Fixing that won't have an effect on the AI of Trade Route Automation.
 
Just tried this patch, same here no unit's in ship! after buying 3 from home?

This only occurs when overwriting the vanilla files. It does not occur when played as a mod.

I've removed overwriting from the install instructions till it's worked out. Just install as a mod for the time being. :)
 
Okay everyone, stop poking Dale.

He doesn't have time to spend on here arguing; he's too busy keeping up with his numerous patches and mods, alright?
 
I have to agree with what Dale said, basicly the game just wasn't incrementing counters correctly. Fixing that won't have an effect on the AI of Trade Route Automation.


LOL!
How automatical sales overdamped by automation limber for 0.5 gold + taxes counting as a trade with king for tax purpouse issue does not effect ballance?
Seens trade effected by number units sold, not profit, it is VERY MACH BALLANCING ISSUE!
 
Sure, any balance issues with regards to trade and taxation increases remain, but as far as I'm concerned, Dale's logic is sound in that any trade being taxed by your King is clearly being traded in Europe, and should therefore be counted that way. Does counting this trade change the balance *slightly* ? Yes, obviously, but when you're trading by the thousands with your ships, the few dozen units that your warehouse expansions sell will be making a minimal difference, and honestly, this should seriously not be your primary [or secondary, for that matter] method of trade.
As far as profit vs. number of units sold goes, which one would your King have greater visibility on?
If you're getting gyped because you're having a fire sale, that's your problem; he would only know that tonnage coming in from the New World is up this quarter.
 
You still missing main point. Warehouse overflow happened because of using Trade automation.
Fact that warehouse overflow how effect taxes make trade automation unusable!

But I give up.
Why the hell I try to explain thinks if autor take attitude: " Hey I did not kill this man, I just run him over with his car. Read coroner report, he died from inturnal bleeding."
 
You still missing main point. Warehouse overflow happened because of using Trade automation.
Fact that warehouse overflow how effect taxes make trade automation unusable!

But I give up.
Why the hell I try to explain thinks if autor take attitude: " Hey I did not kill this man, I just run him over with his car. Read coroner report, he died from inturnal bleeding."

This form of trade was not counted as trade. That's a bug which is now fixed.

As for your argument you seem to be making a mountain out of a molehill, consider this:

If it takes 2000 total trade yield before the King changes taxes (which is the type of figures we are talking about), then how many turns at 10 units of goods warehouse expansion sale-off are required before the warehouse expansion is directly responsible for a tax increase?

I hope you can do the maths: 2000 / 10 = ........... turns :)
 
Hey Dale, I just downloaded the bug fix patch and there is a problem.

When I started the game there are no Units on my ship. I sail right to Europe and in the Europe Screen the Units were in the ship, but then when I sailed right back to the New World, the Units did not appear any where, not as Cargo Buttons, not in the right click list, and I was unable to drop them off by dragging the ship onto land.

At some point, I'm unsure exactly when, I my origional two Units were lost, because the ship's hold was empty when I then sailed back to Europe. I then put a Unit on my ship from the dock and when I sailed again to the New World, that Unit also was vanished to some limbo.

I attached some Screen Shots to this post to show you what it looks like. Any idea what could be causing it?

EDIT: Attached Screen Shots removed.
 
Ok, did a little testing and after a bit of winmerging all the changed files (for no apparent reason it would appear), I did some commenting/uncommenting of changed code and narrowed it down to this line.
Code:
	// PatchMod: Berth Size START
    int iCargoSize = getUnitInfo().getBerthSize();
    // PatchMod: Berth Size END

If you change that line to...
Code:
    int iCargoSize = getUnitInfo().getRequiredTransportSize();

The game will function like normal.

EDIT: Excess stuff removed. :goodjob:
 
Ok man, sorry to spam your thread like this, but I got the mod combined with my personal mod and was all hyped to spend the night playing a game when this problem popped up.. So its been my focus for the night.

First, I gave each UnitInfo an iBerthSize tag of 1 and every Unit having the tag defined fixed the problem and the game worked normally.

Also, I think this...
Code:
// returns false if the unit is killed
bool CvUnit::setTransportUnit(CvUnit* pTransportUnit)
{
	CvUnit* pOldTransportUnit = getTransportUnit();

	// PatchMod: Berth Size START
    int iCargoSize = getUnitInfo().getBerthSize();
	if (iCargoSize < 1 || iCargoSize > getUnitInfo().getRequiredTransportSize())
	{
        int iCargoSize = getUnitInfo().getRequiredTransportSize();
	}
    // PatchMod: Berth Size END
..would be saffer. Just in case some one enters an iBerthSize larger then the iRequiredTransportSize, or lower then 1.

Anyway, my game works now. I'm off to play a game. :king:
 
Hey Dale, I just downloaded the bug fix patch and there is a problem.

When I started the game there are no Units on my ship. I sail right to Europe and in the Europe Screen the Units were in the ship, but then when I sailed right back to the New World, the Units did not appear any where, not as Cargo Buttons, not in the right click list, and I was unable to drop them off by dragging the ship onto land.

At some point, I'm unsure exactly when, I my origional two Units were lost, because the ship's hold was empty when I then sailed back to Europe. I then put a Unit on my ship from the dock and when I sailed again to the New World, that Unit also was vanished to some limbo.

I attached some Screen Shots to this post to show you what it looks like. Any idea what could be causing it?

EDIT: Attached Screen Shots removed.

Was this using the patch over the original files? I could only repeat this problem when running the files over the original. I've never had this occur whilst running as a mod.
 
O, I would never over write the origional files. I simply unziped the mod, put it in my mods directory, and started the mod.
 
Shyte :(

Okay, I'll see what's going on. Sorry everyone.
 
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