WW2-Global

IarnGreiper said:
Removing the prerequisite would lead to unrealistic results in the pacific when the USA can again buy all units right where they need it.

IarnGreiper,

Yes, this is no doubt a problem the removal would create.

Rocoteh
 
Despair888, IarnGreiper, ComradeDavo,

Thank you for reporting city-razing by AI.

Your information is important.

Rocoteh
 
IarnGreiper said:
BTW Rocoteh would it be possible to add some tobacco to Bulgaria and Turkey. I only have late 1830s figures for Germany but these countries seemed the main source of tabacco before and during the war.

IarnGreiper,

Its a good idea.
I will implement it in version 2.1.

Rocoteh
 
DrNick,

Thank you for the report.

"So. Germany and Italy are knocked out about turn 25, 1941. A few turns later I make peace with Japan after conquering all Japan mainland Asia cities." DrNick

That is a very good result!

"BTW where is the Katyushka? Did I miss it late in tech tree?" DrNick

No. I will include it with the next graphic update.

"By week 52, 1941 I have all of Eurasia and 2/4 of Africa. IN order to avoid razing too many cities in the poorest part of Africa I made temp peace with the allies and demanded a bunch of pop1 cities from the decimated French. After a few turns I will renew my conquest of the Allies and I have been building some naval forces for the invasion of britain. More soon...." DrNick

This looks very interesting!
Welcome back with more repoerts.

Rocoteh
 
Rocoteh, I think you should give Germany a someway type of scientific boost, since they had a technological advantage throughout the war in most scientific areas. They should start either with more techs or have a possibility to get new techs faster than the other nations, since stealing tech is no longer possible.

Adler
 
Adler17 said:
Rocoteh, I think you should give Germany a someway type of scientific boost, since they had a technological advantage throughout the war in most scientific areas. They should start either with more techs or have a possibility to get new techs faster than the other nations, since stealing tech is no longer possible.

Adler

Adler,

Yes, I intend to rework techs available at start for Civs with
regard to version 2.1.

Rocoteh
 
BTW I tried a game with more aggressive AIs. First I started the game with maximal aggression level and in the second stage I manually increased aggression for all nations which entered the war early (Germany (however played by me), Belgium, France, GB, Italy).

I refrained from giving the SU more aggression since they already declared war on Axis or allies or even both very early.

Here is my report for the most aggressive game:

Report from the Hauptquatier, Spetember 1939

Initial operations went well. However we kept Belgium as a buffer between the Wehrmacht and the French army which made the French fruitlessly atting the bottleneck near Stuttgart. The Luftwaffe used a lot of reconnaissace and destroyed all enemy units on the move who dared to leave air superiority zones. At the end of September we control Poland, continental Greece, Yugoslavia, Denmark, Sweden and Norway. Italy viciously attacked Marseille and moved quite an army to Greece only to see the Wehrmacht patroling the streets of Athens.
In the med sea, Italy is having bad times especially as the Brits and French seem to move their whole navy there. However the Duce managed to grab Cyprus from the British.
 
IarnGreiper said:
BTW I tried a game with more aggressive AIs. First I started the game with maximal aggression level and in the second stage I manually increased aggression for all nations which entered the war early (Germany (however played by me), Belgium, France, GB, Italy).

I refrained from giving the SU more aggression since they already declared war on Axis or allies or even both very early.

Here is my report for the most aggressive game:

Report from the Hauptquatier, Spetember 1939

Initial operations went well. However we kept Belgium as a buffer between the Wehrmacht and the French army which made the French fruitlessly atting the bottleneck near Stuttgart. The Luftwaffe used a lot of reconnaissace and destroyed all enemy units on the move who dared to leave air superiority zones. At the end of September we control Poland, continental Greece, Yugoslavia, Denmark, Sweden and Norway. Italy viciously attacked Marseille and moved quite an army to Greece only to see the Wehrmacht patroling the streets of Athens.
In the med sea, Italy is having bad times especially as the Brits and French seem to move their whole navy there. However the Duce managed to grab Cyprus from the British.

IarnGreiper,

Thank you for the report.

This sounds very interesting.
I am looking forward to hear about your conclusions.

Rocoteh
 
Hi Rocoteh, fine to see you back. For this ultra high aggression game I think it´s to early to make comments, but from my other games here are my conclusions about AI aggression, sorted by country:

USA is loosing performance by increased aggression because they have no early objectives in the war and tend only to expose units.

GB is performing better when aggressive, besides the North Sea where they are even more prone to step into the Kriegsmarine ambushing them from ports and minefields. Even if not historical accurate I would recommend moving British capital ships from the British islands to others theatres of war. They are simply not useful in preventing Operation Sealion or Weserübung and should not be sacrificed this early in the war.
In general I am confident to say GB Ai benefits from more aggression.

Italy is performing even more stupid with higher aggression. In general they tend to loose if Germany does not support them like they performed in realm life. Maybe even removing Tirana would actually help them since they maybe would stop to move half of theif forces to the Balkans which get under German control even if Germany is AI controlled.

The Su is benefitting from higher aggression but this is because they have too much units useful for offense and some of their potential victims are too weak (Persia and British India for example).

French are doing ok, especially when Germany is not attacking them for some time.
 
IarnGreiper,

Thank you for the comments.

"USA is loosing performance by increased aggression because they have no early objectives in the war and tend only to expose units" IarnGreiper

I think you are right.

"GB is performing better when aggressive, besides the North Sea where they are even more prone to step into the Kriegsmarine ambushing them from ports and minefields. Even if not historical accurate I would recommend moving British capital ships from the British islands to others theatres of war. They are simply not useful in preventing Operation Sealion or Weserübung and should not be sacrificed this early in the war.
In general I am confident to say GB Ai benefits from more aggression." IarnGreiper

In version 2.1 I plan to place coastal tiles around Britain that will cost 10 MP
to enter. That should make Sealion harder. Germany will probably only have 2
special transports until fall 1940.

"Italy is performing even more stupid with higher aggression. In general they tend to loose if Germany does not support them like they performed in realm life. Maybe even removing Tirana would actually help them since they maybe would stop to move half of theif forces to the Balkans which get under German control even if Germany is AI controlled." IarnGreiper

That is a very interesting idea. I will consider it for 2.1.

"The Su is benefitting from higher aggression but this is because they have too much units useful for offense and some of their potential victims are too weak (Persia and British India for example)." IarnGreiper

I will avoid high aggression for Soviet-AI.

"French are doing ok, especially when Germany is not attacking them for some time."
IarnGreiper

That is good.

Thank you and welcome back.

Rocoteh
 
Rocoteh I fear those tiles will cripple the British navy as well leaving them exposed to the Luftwaffe finishing them off.
 
Report from the Hauptquatier, early October 1939.
We are preparing for operation Sealion before Fall Rot (invasion of France). The British airforce has been destroyed by aggressive air and sea bombardments. Right now the Luftwaffe is clearing the countryside from any British ground forces. The plan is to establish a bridgehead with minimal ground forces, using the Luftwaffe to pave the way. Bergen has become the home port of the Kriegsmarine now enabling operations at the Scotish coast.

The Italians are giving us more and more headches. They attacked Turkey now and wasted quite a few units on their defenses without visible gains.
Meanwhile the French started sieging Milan. In the highly defensive terrain there they seem to have a superior position. We highly recommend the Duce to stop counterattacking.
In Egypt they managed to capture Al Alhamein for a weak but lost it afterwards. Finally they captured Greece.

PS: S Boots based in Amsterdam are far too strong against London.
 
IarnGreiper said:
Report from the Hauptquatier, early October 1939.
We are preparing for operation Sealion before Fall Rot (invasion of France). The British airforce has been destroyed by aggressive air and sea bombardments. Right now the Luftwaffe is clearing the countryside from any British ground forces. The plan is to establish a bridgehead with minimal ground forces, using the Luftwaffe to pave the way. Bergen has become the home port of the Kriegsmarine now enabling operations at the Scotish coast.

The Italians are giving us more and more headches. They attacked Turkey now and wasted quite a few units on their defenses without visible gains.
Meanwhile the French started sieging Milan. In the highly defensive terrain there they seem to have a superior position. We highly recommend the Duce to stop counterattacking.
In Egypt they managed to capture Al Alhamein for a weak but lost it afterwards. Finally they captured Greece.

PS: S Boots based in Amsterdam are far too strong against London.

"Rocoteh I fear those tiles will cripple the British navy as well leaving them exposed to the Luftwaffe finishing them off." IarnGreiper

IarnGreiper,

Yes, you are right. However this can be solved with a "ignore move cost"
flag for the new tile with regard to British ships.

On the playtest:

This will be a very early Sealion!

French forces at Milan. A very bad start for Italy.
Concerning S-boats and London:

Its possible I will add some minefields near London.

Thank you and welcome back.

Rocoteh
 
Oh I didn t know about that flag.

On the playtest. Both early sealion and French at Milan are results of the decision of min to avoid the confrontation with French ground forces. Whith me unreachable the French have only Italy to attack. And with nothing other to do for the Luftwaffe my fighters and bombers are free to pave the way for Seelöwe.
 
IarnGreiper said:
Oh I didn t know about that flag.

On the playtest. Both early sealion and French at Milan are results of the decision of min to avoid the confrontation with French ground forces. Whith me unreachable the French have only Italy to attack. And with nothing other to do for the Luftwaffe my fighters and bombers are free to pave the way for Seelöwe.

IarnGreiper,

I see. That is an interesting strategy.
Looking forward to follow how it turns out.

Rocoteh
 
Update report from the Hauptquatier:
We established an initial beachhead in England in early November. With our extremely limited transport capacity we landed some SS troopers with German 88 and Flak support in the countryside. With this tactic we can bridge more troops a week. When we have amassed enough forces we will take down their cities.
update: During november we crushed most military opposition of the Tomies, in Dezember we cracked down the resistance in the cities and took Ireland.
Istambul became part of the Reich as well as Ankara. The Bolchevists invaded Persia but made few ground since the beginning of their offence in late November. Thailand lost a city to the Tommies and one to the Chinese.
Italy managed to capture St Johns while the Kriegsmarine kept the British Navy busy. However we don t think they will have a happy new year over there when they see films of the French shelling Rome on the Wochenschau.
With the British capital moved to Calcutta, the Tommies are most likely to fight the Russian Juggernaut during the months to come.
 
Having played many games of the 1.8 and 1.9 versions I didn't think that 2.0 would differ greatly. I was wrong. Rather than give a blow by blow playtest report I thought I would highlight what appear to be the significant differences.

Germans V2.0 - Emperor

Playing as the Germans I haven't noticed any significant negative impacts. Only the loss of trade has made maintaining order in conquered island territories a challenge. Since no significant units can be built there long range planning has to go into any assault. This is not a bad thing. Anything that requires the human to strategise further IMHO is good.

The Italians seem to be unusually aggressive from a naval perspective. They have conducted no less than 4 amphibious assaults on Edinburgh. The fact that they were all unsuccessful is par for the course since the Italian AI only ever attacks with two units. The increased aggression and good use of naval power is different. They successfully took Gibraltar but unfortunately it was raised due to an unsuccessful US attack and subsequent successful British counter attack. Consistent building of DD Flots and not loosing their Cruisers has the Italian AI waging an interesting war with the French DD Flots. They fight over control of the sea gap at the bottom of Sicily. With evenly matched win/losses. As usual though the Italian land forces AI is hopeless and does nothing but get in the way.

The Finns are doing remarkably well and not only hold their own against the 1939-1941 Soviet Union but also managed to take Archangle and another city just south of Leningrad. Admittedly I was attacking the northern Soviet cities at the time so they were possibly preoccupied. Once the SU was driven back to the Urals I gifted Murmansk, Kem, Leningrad and some other city to them. Their economy bounced back to the point where they became a good producer of infantry and tanks and actively persued our enemies. They even brokered a ROP deal with the SU thus allowing them to attack the UK in India and Persia.

The Japanese are another story entirely. Unlike 1.8 and 1.9 where the Japanese conquered with ease, 2.0 is the Japanese worst nightmare. 1939-1941 go well for them and they conquer all of China bar one city for each of the chinese nations. This seems to exhaust their resources though and the British and French always manage to mount a significant counter attack from the south driving the Japs almost out of China. In my last two 2.0 playtests further pressure is added by the Japs losing the southern most city in their home island and the northern most city in the home island to a two pronged US amphib assault. The Japs then concentrate on recapturing these cities. At great cost the northern city is recaptured but the US seems to be able to reinforce the southern city somehow and mount constant infantry attacks. The US airforce also moves in and bombards the hell out of any nearby city/unit.

The US seems incredibly aggressive and the AI is remarkably astute. Twice assaulting Crete with multiple tanks and a good destroyer screen cost them heavily. They got distracted from Crete when I took the Canary Islands and switched focus. I lost the Canary Islands to a heavy marine assault. No less than 6 marines and 6 tanks plus 4 DD Flots! It took a bit to pry them out and they continue to attack with quality, mounting significant raids every 10-15 turns. In the Pacific theatre the US is equally aggressive with multiple DD Flots and new build Carriers taking an active hunter killer role. All the BB's and Heavy Cruisers are sunk in the initial phases by the Japs but the US produces large numbers of DD Flots in their stead. This is probably a good representation of history though. The Japs were driven out of New Guinea and the Phillipines very early on and are continually assaulted on the home Islands. The US AI is very naval and amphib oriented. Impressive!

The Soviets are not really aggressive and haven't declared war on me until midway through 1940 every time. Their tech advances at the standard pace but they don't really seem to do much at all. Fighting is all or nothing. Big SOD's all attacking in key points but once defeated and minimal numbers of offensive units remain they always seem to broker peace with one of my allies thus stopping me from the continuous war I long for! They most certainly don't seem to attack the Japanese land forces in the East but take an active but ultimately pointless submarine war. I have noticed that they are prone to going to war with the UK etc. quite often. I put it down to the old submarine bug but could be wrong.

The UK is very effective at sea. Her heavy naval units are an annoyance but are usually dispatched by the end of 1939. Perhaps a relocation to the central Atlantic to give them some longevity? Once sunk DD Flots are then produced on an enormous scale. The UK land AI is equally impressive and does very well in Africa and China. I even found the UK conducting amphib attacks out of Australia on my German colonies in occupied Dutch East Indies. The Australian infantryman is very impressive especially when his hat falls off in his death throes! I haven't seen them attack before as the AI never seemed to use them in earlier versions. Additionally the Matilda II seems to be the weapon of choice for the African and Asian theatres being used relentlessly in those attacks.

The French once pushed out of Europe concentrate on producing DD Flots and punching it out with the italian navy and anyone else they can find in the Med. Their land infantryman is only occassionally seen.

The Turks remain as always impassive however their defences are formidable to the point that even when the SU declared war on them didn't really make a dent. As the Germans I had a crack at them myself and was amazed at how tough they are to conquer. Of course once the fortresses are dealt with they really don't have much of a fight in them but at least it delays their subjugation until a time when the human player can afford it (later rather than straight up).

All up most of the AI seems to be a lot more competitive (apart from the Japanese) I think that this is trade related. Removing prerequisities for building certain units might even this up again and give the Japs their groove back. They certainly need something since a lot of their original power in earlier versions was island based.
 
IarnGreiper said:
Update report from the Hauptquatier:
We established an initial beachhead in England in early November. With our extremely limited transport capacity we landed some SS troopers with German 88 and Flak support in the countryside. With this tactic we can bridge more troops a week. When we have amassed enough forces we will take down their cities.
update: During november we crushed most military opposition of the Tomies, in Dezember we cracked down the resistance in the cities and took Ireland.
Istambul became part of the Reich as well as Ankara. The Bolchevists invaded Persia but made few ground since the beginning of their offence in late November. Thailand lost a city to the Tommies and one to the Chinese.
Italy managed to capture St Johns while the Kriegsmarine kept the British Navy busy. However we don t think they will have a happy new year over there when they see films of the French shelling Rome on the Wochenschau.
With the British capital moved to Calcutta, the Tommies are most likely to fight the Russian Juggernaut during the months to come.

IarnGreiper,

Thank you for the report.

I think this playtest will show that changes have to made with regard
to Britain. It remains to be seen if the new coastal tiles and limited
number of transports for Germany (until fall 1940) will be enough or
if other changes also must be done.

It will be interesting to follow how many turns it will take for you
to occupy Britain.

Thank you and welcome back.

Rocoteh
 
Hornblower,

Thank you for your comment on version 2.0.

"Playing as the Germans I haven't noticed any significant negative impacts. Only the loss of trade has made maintaining order in conquered island territories a challenge. Since no significant units can be built there long range planning has to go into any assault. This is not a bad thing. Anything that requires the human to strategise further IMHO is good." Hornblower

Yes, I think that is right.

"The Italians seem to be unusually aggressive from a naval perspective. They have conducted no less than 4 amphibious assaults on Edinburgh. The fact that they were all unsuccessful is par for the course since the Italian AI only ever attacks with two units. The increased aggression and good use of naval power is different. They successfully took Gibraltar but unfortunately it was raised due to an unsuccessful US attack and subsequent successful British counter attack. Consistent building of DD Flots and not loosing their Cruisers has the Italian AI waging an interesting war with the French DD Flots. They fight over control of the sea gap at the bottom of Sicily. With evenly matched win/losses. As usual though the Italian land forces AI is hopeless and does nothing but get in the way." Hornblower

It will be interesting to see how the removal of Destroyers-Flotillas in version 2.1
will change AI:s naval building strategy.

"The Finns are doing remarkably well and not only hold their own against the 1939-1941 Soviet Union but also managed to take Archangle and another city just south of Leningrad. Admittedly I was attacking the northern Soviet cities at the time so they were possibly preoccupied. Once the SU was driven back to the Urals I gifted Murmansk, Kem, Leningrad and some other city to them. Their economy bounced back to the point where they became a good producer of infantry and tanks and actively persued our enemies. They even brokered a ROP deal with the SU thus allowing them to attack the UK in India and Persia." Hornblower

I think the above is very good, since often AI-allies causes much trouble.

"The Japanese are another story entirely. Unlike 1.8 and 1.9 where the Japanese conquered with ease, 2.0 is the Japanese worst nightmare. 1939-1941 go well for them and they conquer all of China bar one city for each of the chinese nations. This seems to exhaust their resources though and the British and French always manage to mount a significant counter attack from the south driving the Japs almost out of China. In my last two 2.0 playtests further pressure is added by the Japs losing the southern most city in their home island and the northern most city in the home island to a two pronged US amphib assault. The Japs then concentrate on recapturing these cities. At great cost the northern city is recaptured but the US seems to be able to reinforce the southern city somehow and mount constant infantry attacks. The US airforce also moves in and bombards the hell out of any nearby city/unit."
Hornblower

This is interesting. Maybe Japan have to be stronger in 2.1.

"The US seems incredibly aggressive and the AI is remarkably astute. Twice assaulting Crete with multiple tanks and a good destroyer screen cost them heavily. They got distracted from Crete when I took the Canary Islands and switched focus. I lost the Canary Islands to a heavy marine assault. No less than 6 marines and 6 tanks plus 4 DD Flots! It took a bit to pry them out and they continue to attack with quality, mounting significant raids every 10-15 turns. In the Pacific theatre the US is equally aggressive with multiple DD Flots and new build Carriers taking an active hunter killer role. All the BB's and Heavy Cruisers are sunk in the initial phases by the Japs but the US produces large numbers of DD Flots in their stead. This is probably a good representation of history though. The Japs were driven out of New Guinea and the Phillipines very early on and are continually assaulted on the home Islands. The US AI is very naval and amphib oriented. Impressive!" Hornblower

Yes, I agree. This is very positive. Still one problem remains with AI and
amphibious operations: The ability to sustain large scale attacks over a long
time period.

"The Soviets are not really aggressive and haven't declared war on me until midway through 1940 every time. Their tech advances at the standard pace but they don't really seem to do much at all. Fighting is all or nothing. Big SOD's all attacking in key points but once defeated and minimal numbers of offensive units remain they always seem to broker peace with one of my allies thus stopping me from the continuous war I long for! They most certainly don't seem to attack the Japanese land forces in the East but take an active but ultimately pointless submarine war. I have noticed that they are prone to going to war with the UK etc. quite often. I put it down to the old submarine bug but could be wrong." Hornblower

I think you are right. Its probably the submarine bug.

"The UK is very effective at sea. Her heavy naval units are an annoyance but are usually dispatched by the end of 1939. Perhaps a relocation to the central Atlantic to give them some longevity? Once sunk DD Flots are then produced on an enormous scale. The UK land AI is equally impressive and does very well in Africa and China. I even found the UK conducting amphib attacks out of Australia on my German colonies in occupied Dutch East Indies. The Australian infantryman is very impressive especially when his hat falls off in his death throes! I haven't seen them attack before as the AI never seemed to use them in earlier versions. Additionally the Matilda II seems to be the weapon of choice for the African and Asian theatres being used relentlessly in those attacks." Hornblower

Maybe a relocation of the British fleet could work. However the problem remains:
"Spend the forces fast" seems to be the basic naval AI strategy.

That is a long way from the defensive "force in being" thinking that
most navies followed in reality, at least with regard to its capital ships.

"The French once pushed out of Europe concentrate on producing DD Flots and punching it out with the italian navy and anyone else they can find in the Med. Their land infantryman is only occassionally seen." Hornblower

Again: Version 2.0 will be the last one with the Destroyer-Flotilla.

"The Turks remain as always impassive however their defences are formidable to the point that even when the SU declared war on them didn't really make a dent. As the Germans I had a crack at them myself and was amazed at how tough they are to conquer. Of course once the fortresses are dealt with they really don't have much of a fight in them but at least it delays their subjugation until a time when the human player can afford it (later rather than straight up)." Hornblower

I think the above mentioned is positive.

"All up most of the AI seems to be a lot more competitive (apart from the Japanese) I think that this is trade related. Removing prerequisities for building certain units might even this up again and give the Japs their groove back. They certainly need something since a lot of their original power in earlier versions was island based."
Hornblower

That is right. Changes will be made with regard to Japan.

Thank you and welcome back.

Rocoteh
 
Rocoteh said:
IarnGreiper,

Thank you for the report.

I think this playtest will show that changes have to made with regard
to Britain. It remains to be seen if the new coastal tiles and limited
number of transports for Germany (until fall 1940) will be enough or
if other changes also must be done.

It will be interesting to follow how many turns it will take for you
to occupy Britain.

Thank you and welcome back.

Rocoteh

I guess I may still take Wick or Edinburgh extremely early with just my little paratrooper and the Luftwaffe. However the English cities require at least naval resistance if you plan a long war with endless resistance.
However since Germany can t rush units by cash taking Wick or even Edinburgh won t turn the tide of war.
 
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