SGOTM 13 - One Short Straw

OK, I plan to attack both St. Petes and Moscow on T+3. Each landing party will consist of 3 galleons loaded with 4 trebs and 5 maces.

I will upgrade the two 4/2 EP maces to C1/Medic I to speed up the healing.

The mace near Amsterdam will go into Amsterdam this turn because it is possible that a barb could be on the road two tiles outside the city in the fog and capture it IBT. He will stay and act as military police until another unit can take his place.

I will bring the GG to a safe place (Amsterdam?) until he can be brought to the front.

Did I miss anything important?
 
Well, here's one suggestion:
Let's just join the GG now and take Medic III.

It won't be of use prior to the war but given the choice between the messy logistics later (which will likely cause us further delays in the war), I'd rather just use it now if the choices are between:
a) Using it later on a Future Medic III + 2 upgraded Trebs
and
b) Using it now on a Medic III + 1 upgraded Treb

The upgraded Treb could take City Raider III and First Strike I.

The tricky part is that we will either need 3 Medic units or the Medic III will have to be in the south, since we want to promote 2 Medic I units on the current turn (T + 0), while we will need a Medic I unit in The Hague on the following turn in order for Treb 5 (Paris)--who is SE of The Hague right now--to be able to heal before the war.

The northern Medic I (Maceman 10) can't be in two places at once, meaning that either Maceman 6 becomes our Medic III (and thus we'll have a Medic III and 2 Medic Is) or else the southern Medic I (Maceman 9) will have to become the Medic III.


I don't really care where the Medic III goes, but before you go saying "but, but, I wanted it to be in the north near Moscow," consider the fact that the alternative is to DELAY getting the Medic III until several turns from now, so you won't even have it AT ALL for the first part of the war, let alone in your ideal location.


Note that I do not support using the above reasoning to justify a T + 2 attack.
 
Whip pig-fish! Feel free to bombard/attack Moscow/St. Pete as you deem fit on T+4/5 since we're pretty much committed to attacking on one of those two turns anyways.
 
Each landing party will consist of 3 galleons loaded with 4 trebs and 5 maces.
Moscow should get 5 Trebs unless I miscounted the number of Trebs, since +1 Treb can Bombard or attack but +1 Maceman can only help in an odd situation where Cathy has "just enough" units to mess with us, but if she has that many defenders, we're likely going to spend a second turn Bombarding anyway, making that additional Treb more valuable and giving us a chance to reinforce the attack with additional unloaded Macemen, if necessary (say, if she has a stack of 12 units there).


Did I miss anything important?
T + 0: Stopping the auto-movement of the units to the E + E of The Hague, so that you will have maximum flexibility with which units to use for the GG.
 
shyuhe said:
Whip pig-fish!
How soon are we to attacking the east?

Whipping Pig + Fish should happen on T + 1 unless we are currently whipping our last round of units for the eastern front, since whipping on T + 0 only loses us Commerce but does not gain us Food (and thus does not gain us Hammers).
 
I'd be shocked if Moscow has more than 4 units.
Regardless, it still has the messy at-least-60% Cultural Defences plus a City Wall that halves the effectiveness of Bombardments, making +1 Treb more important there, particularly in the first landing before she could feasibly get a Castle built (unless there is one there already and our map hasn't updated the fog of war). Even if there is a Castle there already, +1 Treb is better.

5 Trebs to Moscow they go!
 
Don't forget that beyond Medic and City Raider units, it is nice to have Combat-promoted Macemen, so that City Raider II and City Raider III units don't come up as the "top defender" due to having an equal defensive value but a higher amount of Experience Points.
 
I didn't make the trade. We hadn't talked about it before so I left it on the table. If Cathy is researching Drama now, let her waste her time.

Both Moscow and St. Petes are ours (plus the GLH, Parthenon and ToA) at the cost of one mace at St. Petersburg. If I remember correctly, I've only moved the units that were needed to take the two cities, which were both weakly defended. This leaves us flexibility as to what to do next. The save will be uploaded shortly.

T195 - Cathy learns Compass and Currency and Willem learns Literature.

T196 - Cathy builds the Parthenon in Moscow.

T197 - Izzy founds another city!! Izzy learns Currency.

T198 - Catherine gets a GS in St. Petes, which we destroyed. Vicky learns Compass. Willem learns Currency. Catherines gold goes from 110 to 0 (assume to have been used to upgrade some units...).
 
Save uploaded.

Here is your Session Turn Log from 310 AD to 370 AD:

Spoiler :
Turn 194, 310 AD: You have trained a Maceman in Iron. Work has now begun on a Trebuchet.
Turn 194, 310 AD: Victoria converts to Christianity!
Turn 194, 310 AD: Gottfried Leibniz (Great Scientist) has been born in Lisbon (Joao II)!
Turn 194, 310 AD: Christianity has spread in Maastricht.

Turn 195, 325 AD: You have trained a Galleon in Pig Mmm Fish. Work has now begun on a Barracks.
Turn 195, 325 AD: Catherine has completed The Parthenon!

Turn 196, 340 AD: Paris has grown to size 6.
Turn 196, 340 AD: Paris can hurry Maceman for 1? with 26? overflow and +1? for 74 turns.
Turn 196, 340 AD: Gold has become happy.
Turn 196, 340 AD: Marble has grown to size 4.
Turn 196, 340 AD: Marble can hurry Trebuchet for 2? with 38? overflow and +1? for 85 turns.
Turn 196, 340 AD: Gold will grow to size 4 on the next turn.
Turn 196, 340 AD: Stone will grow to size 4 on the next turn.
Turn 196, 340 AD: Iron will grow to size 4 on the next turn.
Turn 196, 340 AD: You have trained a Trebuchet in Marble. Work has now begun on a Maceman.
Turn 196, 340 AD: Isabella has founded Valencia in a distant land.

Turn 197, 355 AD: Paris can hurry Trebuchet for 2? with 46? overflow and +1? for 73 turns.
Turn 197, 355 AD: Gold has grown to size 4.
Turn 197, 355 AD: Gold has become unhappy.
Turn 197, 355 AD: Gold can hurry Galleon for 2? with 40? overflow and +1? for 99 turns.
Turn 197, 355 AD: Stone has grown to size 4.
Turn 197, 355 AD: Stone can hurry Galleon for 2? with 42? overflow and +1? for 31 turns.
Turn 197, 355 AD: Iron has grown to size 4.
Turn 197, 355 AD: Iron can hurry Maceman for 2? with 20? overflow and +1? for 55 turns.
Turn 197, 355 AD: Amsterdam has become happy.
Turn 197, 355 AD: Rotterdam will be pacified on the next turn.
Turn 197, 355 AD: Isabella has 60 gold available for trade.
Turn 197, 355 AD: Rotterdam will be pacified on the next turn.
Turn 197, 355 AD: Catherine has 110 gold available for trade.
Turn 197, 355 AD: Joao II has 110 gold available for trade.
Turn 197, 355 AD: Ragnar has 50 gold available for trade.
Turn 197, 355 AD: Isabella has 60 gold available for trade.
Turn 197, 355 AD: You are the worst enemy of Willem van Oranje, Ragnar.
Turn 197, 355 AD: Catherine is the worst enemy of Victoria, Isabella.
Turn 197, 355 AD: Willem van Oranje will trade Theology
Turn 197, 355 AD: Catherine will trade Cow, Sheep
Turn 197, 355 AD: Will Sign Peace Treaty: Ragnar, Willem van Oranje
Turn 197, 355 AD: Deal Canceled: Open Borders to Catherine for Open Borders
Turn 197, 355 AD: You have declared war on Catherine!
Turn 197, 355 AD: Catherine refuses to talk.
Turn 197, 355 AD: Marble will grow to size 3 on the next turn.
Turn 197, 355 AD: Pig Mmm Fish will grow to size 4 on the next turn.
Turn 197, 355 AD: You have trained a Trebuchet in Paris. Work has now begun on a Maceman.
Turn 197, 355 AD: You have trained a Galleon in Stone. Work has now begun on a Maceman.
Turn 197, 355 AD: Al-Razi (Great Scientist) has been born in St. Petersburg (Catherine)!

Turn 198, 370 AD: Marble has grown to size 3.
Turn 198, 370 AD: Marble can hurry Maceman for 1? with 24? overflow and +1? for 98 turns.
Turn 198, 370 AD: Pig Mmm Fish has grown to size 4.
Turn 198, 370 AD: Pig Mmm Fish can hurry Galleon for 2? with 28? overflow and +1? for 84 turns.
Turn 198, 370 AD: Utrecht will be pacified on the next turn.
Turn 198, 370 AD: Rotterdam has been pacified.
Turn 198, 370 AD: The Hague will be pacified on the next turn.
Turn 198, 370 AD: You are the worst enemy of Catherine.
Turn 198, 370 AD: Your Trebuchet 8 (Stone) has reduced the defenses of St. Petersburg to 42%!
Turn 198, 370 AD: Your Trebuchet 9 (Gold ) has reduced the defenses of St. Petersburg to 34%!
Turn 198, 370 AD: Your Trebuchet 10 (Marble) has reduced the defenses of St. Petersburg to 26%!
Turn 198, 370 AD: Your Trebuchet 1 (Paris) has reduced the defenses of St. Petersburg to 18%!
Turn 198, 370 AD: Napoleon OSS's Maceman 1 (Marble) (8.00) vs Catherine's Longbowman (8.58)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Combat Odds: 27.7%
Turn 198, 370 AD: (Plot Defense: +18%)
Turn 198, 370 AD: (Fortify: +25%)
Turn 198, 370 AD: (City Defense: +45%)
Turn 198, 370 AD: (City Attack: -45%)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Catherine's Longbowman is hit for 19 (81/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Napoleon OSS's Maceman 1 (Marble) is hit for 20 (80/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Napoleon OSS's Maceman 1 (Marble) is hit for 20 (60/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Napoleon OSS's Maceman 1 (Marble) is hit for 20 (40/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Catherine's Longbowman is hit for 19 (62/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Napoleon OSS's Maceman 1 (Marble) is hit for 20 (20/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Napoleon OSS's Maceman 1 (Marble) is hit for 20 (0/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Catherine's Longbowman has defeated Napoleon OSS's Maceman 1 (Marble)!
Turn 198, 370 AD: Your Maceman 1 (Marble) has died trying to attack a Longbowman!
Turn 198, 370 AD: Napoleon OSS's Maceman 4 (Stone) (8.00) vs Catherine's Longbowman (5.31)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Combat Odds: 93.3%
Turn 198, 370 AD: (Plot Defense: +18%)
Turn 198, 370 AD: (Fortify: +25%)
Turn 198, 370 AD: (City Defense: +45%)
Turn 198, 370 AD: (City Attack: -45%)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Napoleon OSS's Maceman 4 (Stone) is hit for 18 (82/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Napoleon OSS's Maceman 4 (Stone) is hit for 18 (64/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Napoleon OSS's Maceman 4 (Stone) is hit for 18 (46/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Catherine's Longbowman is hit for 21 (41/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Napoleon OSS's Maceman 4 (Stone) is hit for 18 (28/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Catherine's Longbowman is hit for 21 (20/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Napoleon OSS's Maceman 4 (Stone) is hit for 18 (10/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Catherine's Longbowman is hit for 21 (0/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Napoleon OSS's Maceman 4 (Stone) has defeated Catherine's Longbowman!
Turn 198, 370 AD: Your Maceman 4 (Stone) has destroyed a Longbowman!
Turn 198, 370 AD: You have captured St. Petersburg!!!
Turn 198, 370 AD: Your Trebuchet 2 (Gold ) has reduced the defenses of Moscow to 48%!
Turn 198, 370 AD: Your Trebuchet 5 (Paris) has reduced the defenses of Moscow to 40%!
Turn 198, 370 AD: Your Trebuchet 6 (Stone) has reduced the defenses of Moscow to 32%!
Turn 198, 370 AD: Your Trebuchet 7 (Paris) has reduced the defenses of Moscow to 24%!
Turn 198, 370 AD: Napoleon OSS's Trebuchet 3 (Paris) (4.00) vs Catherine's Longbowman (3.31)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Combat Odds: 80.9%
Turn 198, 370 AD: (Plot Defense: +24%)
Turn 198, 370 AD: (Fortify: +25%)
Turn 198, 370 AD: (City Defense: +45%)
Turn 198, 370 AD: (City Attack: -175%)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Your Trebuchet 3 (Paris) has caused collateral damage! (2 Units)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Napoleon OSS's Trebuchet 3 (Paris) is hit for 18 (82/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Catherine's Longbowman is hit for 21 (79/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Catherine's Longbowman is hit for 21 (58/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Catherine's Longbowman is hit for 21 (37/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Your Trebuchet 3 (Paris) has withdrawn from combat with a Longbowman!
Turn 198, 370 AD: Napoleon OSS's Maceman 3 (Paris) (8.00) vs Catherine's Axeman (5.18)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Combat Odds: 95.0%
Turn 198, 370 AD: (Extra Combat: +10%)
Turn 198, 370 AD: (Plot Defense: +24%)
Turn 198, 370 AD: (Fortify: +25%)
Turn 198, 370 AD: (City Attack: -45%)
Turn 198, 370 AD: (Combat: -50%)
Turn 198, 370 AD: (Combat: +50%)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Napoleon OSS's Maceman 3 (Paris) is hit for 16 (84/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Catherine's Axeman is hit for 24 (67/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Napoleon OSS's Maceman 3 (Paris) is hit for 16 (68/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Catherine's Axeman is hit for 24 (43/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Catherine's Axeman is hit for 24 (19/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Napoleon OSS's Maceman 3 (Paris) is hit for 16 (52/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Napoleon OSS's Maceman 3 (Paris) is hit for 16 (36/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Catherine's Axeman is hit for 24 (0/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Napoleon OSS's Maceman 3 (Paris) has defeated Catherine's Axeman!
Turn 198, 370 AD: Your Maceman 3 (Paris) has destroyed a Axeman!
Turn 198, 370 AD: Napoleon OSS's Maceman 2 (Marble) (8.00) vs Catherine's Axeman (5.18)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Combat Odds: 95.0%
Turn 198, 370 AD: (Extra Combat: +10%)
Turn 198, 370 AD: (Plot Defense: +24%)
Turn 198, 370 AD: (Fortify: +25%)
Turn 198, 370 AD: (City Attack: -45%)
Turn 198, 370 AD: (Combat: -50%)
Turn 198, 370 AD: (Combat: +50%)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Napoleon OSS's Maceman 2 (Marble) is hit for 16 (84/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Catherine's Axeman is hit for 24 (67/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Napoleon OSS's Maceman 2 (Marble) is hit for 16 (68/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Catherine's Axeman is hit for 24 (43/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Napoleon OSS's Maceman 2 (Marble) is hit for 16 (52/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Catherine's Axeman is hit for 24 (19/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Napoleon OSS's Maceman 2 (Marble) is hit for 16 (36/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Catherine's Axeman is hit for 24 (0/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Napoleon OSS's Maceman 2 (Marble) has defeated Catherine's Axeman!
Turn 198, 370 AD: Your Maceman 2 (Marble) has destroyed a Axeman!
Turn 198, 370 AD: Napoleon OSS's Maceman 6 (Marble) (8.00) vs Catherine's Longbowman (2.91)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Combat Odds: 99.7%
Turn 198, 370 AD: (Plot Defense: +24%)
Turn 198, 370 AD: (Fortify: +25%)
Turn 198, 370 AD: (City Defense: +45%)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Napoleon OSS's Maceman 6 (Marble) is hit for 19 (81/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Catherine's Longbowman is hit for 20 (5/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Catherine's Longbowman is hit for 20 (0/100HP)
Turn 198, 370 AD: Napoleon OSS's Maceman 6 (Marble) has defeated Catherine's Longbowman!
Turn 198, 370 AD: Your Maceman 6 (Marble) has destroyed a Longbowman!
Turn 198, 370 AD: You have captured Moscow!!!
 
I didn't make the trade. We hadn't talked about it before so I left it on the table. If Cathy is researching Drama now, let her waste her time.
No worries either way. She'll pay us Gold by way of us capturing her Cities. Messing around on the trade screen right before a war can be dangerous, anyway... if you accidentally accept or give a gift, then the war could get prevented for 10 turns.



Both Moscow and St. Petes are ours (plus the GLH, Parthenon and ToA) at the cost of one mace at St. Petersburg.
Nice work!


T196 - Cathy builds the Parthenon in Moscow.
Ha! Clearly, she was not building Longbowmen or Castles ^.^

Gifting Aesthetics and converting her to be a Pacifist seem to have been successful choices for us.


T198 - Catherine gets a GS in St. Petes, which we destroyed.
Oh well. We're not going to Space and Flasks won't help us avoid a Strike. Worst case she could have Lightbulbed a tech, so killing it was a good call.


Catherines gold goes from 110 to 0 (assume to have been used to upgrade some units...).
I think the real reason is as follows:
Turn 198, 370 AD: You are the worst enemy of Catherine.

Your Worst Enemy will "hide" more of (all of?) their Gold away from you. Even your best friend of an AI will hide some of their Gold total, but to a lesser degree.
 
Looks good! I love our battle record so far :lol:

The only issue I see for the next few turns is whether we want to attack Yaroslav now, or hit it with reinforcements later and just sail by it. I think we should set sail to raze it now, as it's only going to be a thorn (and Cathy has yet to revolt into slavery!).
 
I'm going to have to end my very exciting 5-turn turnset. My daughter's birthday is tomorrow and I was reminded that have quite a few things to do to get ready for the party.

Who's up?

Regarding Yaroslav, I'd be inclined to skip it and push on. Cathy is severely weakened after losing her top two cities. Isabella is expanding quickly and we need to think about slowing her down. I say we push west with both stacks. We should be able to pick off Yaroslav later in the game with later troops coming out of Willem's core cities, Moscow and St. Pete.
 
The only issue I see for the next few turns is whether we want to attack Yaroslav now, or hit it with reinforcements later
Hit it now. It's located on a Hills square, so if we can take it down before a lot of defences go up, all the better.

Also, we can't make it to the next City with 10 movement points from Galleons, so we'd lose a turn in sailing anyway. We might as well "spend" that turn landing next to Yaroslavl'.


(and Cathy has yet to revolt into slavery!).
She is still in Pacifism, too, which means that she COULD revolt at any time, but if she doesn't, then we will be happy, since she'll take her time building defences. If she revolts, we will be happy, too, since that should mean 1 or 2 turns of Anarchy for her where she is, once again, not building defences.

We should probably keep an eye open for potential Civic swaps with other AIs, although there probably aren't going to be that many AIs happy enough with us in the future for it to matter. :lol:



Our Medic III unit is still Medic I but has 14 Experience Points (so it can be and likely s should be promoted to Medic III on the curren turn) and it is near Moscow! Okay, well, that situation works (we probably wanted it there more than in the south anyway).


Our troops could march towards Yarosavl' via land or could load onto Galleons and unload using the same number of turns. Is there a difference? Will the AI be less "threatened" if our units are hiding in boats instead of showing up in an AI's fat cross?


If we were to sail some of our northern Galleons around to the north towards Yaroslavl' in plans of picking up units after the Yaroslavl' City destruction, would we send all 3 of them or just 2 of them, while leaving 1 more for collecting reinforcements from around The Hague's area?


Should we sink Willem's Trireme, now that our Cultural Borders have expanded over top of a pillageable Fish Resource? Probably yes, since we have Galleon nearby that can't be used for anything else for a little while, right? I mean, the nearby Citiy Raider II unit looks like it is headed towards being a temporary Military Police unit in Utrecht, at least until a replacement unit is whipped out of Utrecht, which could take a couple of turns to get ready.


What's the overall plan for our western forces? Destroy Cathy first? Would we then kill off Willem and capture Ragnar's Ivory City? I fear destroying Willem's City on Ragnar's island if we don't capture Ragnar's Ivory City, as we don't want Ragnar to expand to further Cities. Would we leave Willem alive and just go after Isabella?

I would think that it would be worth completely killing off Cathy as a priority, to avoid her trading-around or Feudalism or at least providing piggyback research on that tech for the other AIs.

Ragnar does not have Hereditary Rule yet, but once he gets it (which he'll probably be forced to self-tech), you can count on him beelining Feudalism (it's very high on his tech priority list).


No one is getting Ivory in trade, but Isabella, unfortunately, is getting a Horse Resource from Joao. It might not actually be a bad idea to bring a few War Elephants along in the war against her, which gives us a stack defender that is just as cheap as a Pikeman, can actually contribute to attacking a City that is empty of Spears/Pikes (whereas a Pike won't help that much in this area), is pretty much equivalent versus Horse Archers as a Pikeman (i.e. awesome versus them), and can also defend against Macemen and Crossbowmen and Longbowmen... meaning that War Elephants can easily become Military Police units in our first few captured Cities from Isabella (i.e. the equivalents of Cathy's Moscow and St. Petersburg).


So, I'm still leaning towards:
1. Mostly finishing off Cathy
2. Completely finishing off Cathy while taking down Ragnar's Ivory City
3. Possibly ignoring Willem but possibly taking him down if we're in position to do so without expending too many turns--I'd at least like to destroy his City that has 2
Settlers in it and is set to steal Utrecht's Clam Resource, although leaving him a tiny City on Ragnar's landmass is not a bad idea (especially if we take the time to pillage his Fish Resource there soon)
4. Going after Isabella
5. Going after Ragnar
6. Finishing off Willem if we haven't done so already


As for the eastern front, I would tend to favour:
1. Vicky
2. Joao


Joao has been preparing for a war, so I'd say that we'd want to take our initially-small force to first destroy Vicky. By then, we should have additional troops to be able to more effectively take on Joao.

We might just end up razing some of Vicky's Cities, but we'll see about that possibility when the time comes.
 
I'm for taking out Yaroslav plus the southern gems city ASAP, and then turning the southern armada towards Madrid (hill). We need to start cutting her down in size. The northern armada can raze a few more of Cathy's cities before it catches up to the southern fleet.

We should eliminate Willem using new troops from his cities + Cathy's cities. Those can either reinforce the Izzy front (if necessary) or set sail against Ragnar.

We should raze most, if not all of Vicky's cities. We should also raze any of Cathy's cities on the north side of that peninsula as they're too far to contribute troops conveniently.

Who's taking the save?
 
I'm for taking out Yaroslav plus the southern gems city ASAP
Makes sense.

and then turning the southern armada towards Madrid (hill).
That's a decent idea... even if Isabella gets Feudalism while we are on the way there, she likely won't have upgraded all of her Archers yet and it will be good to take out Hills-based Cities before she starts spamming defenders.

It does suck that we don't have any anti-Horse-Archer units, so we should probably build a Pikeman or two out of Willem's Cities as a relative priority, with the aim of taking 1 or 2 along with us to Isabella. I'd also like to build another couple of Galleons... even if we only launch towards Isabella with an initial wave of 3 Galleons, it will be nice to have reinforcements arriving shortly thereafter.


We should eliminate Willem using new troops from his cities + Cathy's cities. Those can either reinforce the Izzy front (if necessary) or set sail against Ragnar.
As I said, I only feel comfortable with eliminating Willem's City on Ragnar's landmass if we also capture Ragnar's nearby Ivory City, as Willem's Ivory City seems to be having the effect of blocking Ragnar from spamming additional Cities. Us owning Ragnar's Ivory City should have the same effect on Ragnar.


We should also raze any of Cathy's cities on the north side of that peninsula as they're too far to contribute troops conveniently.
Is it really so far to walk along a road for 2 turns before loading into a Galleon on the southern shore? I figure that it will be nice to have a "concentrated area" of captured Cities, so that we can limit the number of Galleon chains. Since we'll likely want a Galleon chain stemming from that continent anyway, why not get a few more units out of said continent?

I would be more inclined to raze Cathy's off-continent Cities for this very reason.


Who's taking the save?
Uhhhh, Saturday evening would be the earliest that I could pick it up. If there are no takers by then, then I guess that it will be me.
 
Yaroslav is way too far. The city west of Moscow, we can keep (blanking on the name). I'd check our economics before we decide though, as we're going to have to start razing pretty soon.

I can pick it up tonight and start formulating a short PPP. I think it's mostly troop logistics. We should be ready to sail for Vicky in another 3-5 turns so I will try to post a PPP through that so that I can play those turns late tomorrow. Then I can pass it off to Dhoom.

One quick question -- do we want to split our Vicky stack to hit London + her western city at the same time? If we do that and keep her western city, it will make a short canal around that stupid peninsula towards London.
 
A few quick notes that I forgot about:

I didn't give our Medic III unit its promotions yet as there was no healing required and I wanted to be able to promote the unit had Cathy decided to attack the stack and the Medic III took some damage. I had the Medic III unit go to Moscow because we knew St Pete was weakly defended but had no idea what we'd see in Moscow.

I worked the capital's cottage for one turn just to make bbp mad... :D Actually, the city governor worked that tile and I didn't notice until the next turn.

I wouldn't split our southern stack when attacking Vicky unless we can get a peek inside Madrid first to see how well it's defended.

If we want to take Yaroslav first, I would march on it. If we sail there, it's possible that a unit or two of hers could slip past us and head for Moscow, meaning that we would have to leave more city defenders there.

Cathy has a wandering spear and axe west of Moscow/St Pete. Keep that in mind if we move units out of Moscow/St Pete. Also, if Cathy does have an SOD, I would expect it to show up in the next turn or two. With how weakly defended her first two cities were, she must have some units somewhere... Watch for Cathy to get Civil Service as that would enable her to upgrade her units to maces.

EDIT: I didn't realize that civs could "hide" gold from us. I thought that whatever they have would show up on the trading table, just like for techs, even if they wouldn't trade them before the war, all of a sudden are on the trading table. I've never heard of this "hide" gold thing.
 
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