[Religion and Revolution]: Horses Produced on Plots

Yes this is much better, well done.

Great. :)
I hope everybody is now satisfied with this feature.
(I acutally like the new version much more myself.)

But after Ray's changes this rocky island can now be self-sufficient in horses for wagons (see Eskimo settlement image). By moving 60 horses into the warehouse this activates the potential to produce just 1 horse per turn, but this is enough to keep the island in wagons.

You are really producing 1 horse per turn ? :eek:

I mean, I know how this number is generated ...
(Only 60 horses in storage, no appropriate buildings, no specialist, no improvement pasture, no bonus, no river, ...)

But why have that effort for 1 horse/turn and not simply hurry production ? :confused:
(Which would buy the horses needed for the wagons.)
 
OK this post deals with getting a lot more horses per turn

Previously the most horses per turn was 16 - see City 1 and City 2 pre.

Now I am not limited to bonus tiles, and can produce horses from more tiles, if there are horses in the warehouse. However, I think there might be a bit of a bug here, perhaps we are breeding the same horses twice (but we can come back to that).

City1 pre.JPG

City2 pre.JPG

In theory I should be able to make more horse pasture here with my pioneers. I could at one settlement but not at another. I think this is a bug I mentioned already.
City1 Pioneers no horse pasture.JPG
 
However, I think there might be a bit of a bug here, perhaps we are breeding the same horses twice (but we can come back to that).

This is not a "bug". :)

I have been thinking about it, too, but it is simply too much effort to prevent.
(And also something AI would not understand, if I coded it differently.)

Let us live with that and argument:
Horses simply have more space (pastures) and can breed better then. ;)

In theory I should be able to make more horse pasture here with my pioneers. I could at one settlement but not at another. I think this is a bug I mentioned already.

That might be related to the logic I have coded yesterday.
I will check. :thumbsup:

Edit:
Are you sure, you still have enoug gold ?
 
Seems I can only add three images at a time.

Anyway - I am not sure this is intentional, but the horse production increases from 16 to 24 by just having another rancher in the garrison. This is a bit unusual, perhaps they should be attached to the stable / ranch building and generating a food cost at least (not just in the garrison).
City1 RancherinGarrison.JPG

Then if I add a colonist as a rancher on a tile the production goes to 28,
Then 32 if I replace the colonist with the expert rancher.
Then 40 when my pioneers finish making the farm into horse pasture.

All up I have gone from producing 2 x 16 = 32 horses per turn to producing 72 horses a turn in about 6 turns. I already had everything I needed 2 spare ranchers, plus the horses in the warehouse, plus the cleared land. Both my horse settlements were producing around 50 excess food a turn already, so they could easily give up another tile to horse production.

I think the concept works now, well done Ray.
 
Anyway - I am not sure this is intentional, but the horse production increases from 16 to 24 by just having another rancher in the garrison.

Ah ok, now I understand. :)
(I thought you were talking about 2 ranchers working on 2 plots.)

This is definitely a bug. :thumbsup:

I think the concept works now, well done Ray.

Thanks. :)

I will check (and fix) the 2 problems you reported. :thumbsup:

-> rancher in garrison
-> buidling improvements sometimes not possible
-> building improvements possible, when it shouldn't be
 
Edit:
Are you sure, you still have enoug gold ?

Well perhaps I could afford to hurry a wagon!

I am letting this game run on for a long time, I want to attack the Portuguese when they get very strong and see how the musketman firing is working now.

The Dutch AI won their WOI very quickly without even losing a city. In fact I haven't seen the AI lose to REF in R&R yet. I think the musketmen firing might be making a difference.
 
Ah ok, now I understand. :)

-> buidling improvements sometimes not possible

And sometimes possible when they shouldn't be - like horse pasture on tiles with ore / forest, and no food, and even on peaks I seem to recall.
 
The Dutch AI won their WOI very quickly without even losing a city. In fact I haven't seen the AI lose to REF in R&R yet. I think the musketmen firing might be making a difference.

We will take care of balancing, don't worry. :thumbsup:
 
And sometimes possible when they shouldn't be - like horse pasture on tiles with ore / forest, and no food, and even on peaks I seem to recall.

That is why (alpha-)testing is important. :)

I did these things pretty fast yesterday night (when I was tired from work) and probably did some mistakes.
However, if somebody like you tests and reports bugs, I will fix them. :goodjob:

Edit:

Food is no condition for the improvement.
(It should simply be flat tiles of Terrains Grasland, Prairie and Savannah.)

Forest, does not matter, because it is removed, when the improvement is built.
(Just the same as with Farm.)
 
-> rancher in garrison
-> buidling improvements sometimes not possible
-> building improvements possible, when it shouldn't be

Sorry agaro, I cannot very any of these problems. :confused:

The feature is working just perfect for me, just as it is implemented.

-> rancher in garrison: does not influence amounts of horses at all
(Eventually you got confused because of building bonus ...)

-> improvement: I was always able to build or not allowed to, as it should be.
(The rule is simple: flat tiles of Terrains Savannah, Grassland, Prairie. Terrain-Features or Yields don't matter.)

Maybe there is just some confusion because I did not yet explain properly how it works. :dunno:
 
Sorry agaro, I cannot very any of these problems. :confused:

The feature is working just perfect for me, just as it is implemented.

-> rancher in garrison: does not influence amounts of horses at all
(Eventually you got confused because of building bonus ...)

-> improvement: I was always able to build or not allowed to, as it should be.
(The rule is simple: flat tiles of Terrains Savannah, Grassland, Prairie. Terrain-Features or Yields don't matter.)

Maybe there is just some confusion because I did not yet explain properly how it works. :dunno:

That's interesting. I usually do a few different checks before I report anything. For example I sent a rancher to my other horse producing settlement to see if issue was replicated, and it was the same as soon as he got to the garrison (no change to any building at the same time, or any other parameter, maybe a few more horses in the stable, but I am already over max beneficial levels).

I could send you more screenshots to verify / explain in more detail, but I don't think that is the issue if you are saying it doesn't happen to you.

Perhaps we have different versions of the Mod? My process is to sync SVN to a set of folders on my PC (using tortoise), then I resync the R&R folder to the R&R mod in MyGames folder. I haven't had problems with my internal syncing software before, except that it doesn't like path names over 250 characters long. But maybe this is where the problem is.

There was a day where Tortoise kept telling me there were errors, but eventually I got a clean run, so I presumed everything was in sync again.

So I'll clean out all the files in the R&R mod folder in MyGames, then copy across the full latest version, and see if that changes anything.
 
@ agaro:

2 things are extremely important:

1. Start testing with new games every time changes are done.
2. Keep your mod folder and the repository copy separated.

Both things have caused many problems in the past if not done like that.

Otherwise I really don't know why you should have these problems and I don't.
Of course it is also possible, that I did a mistake in testing. :dunno:

Please test again. :thumbsup:

So I'll clean out all the files in the R&R mod folder in MyGames, then copy across the full latest version, and see if that changes anything.

Do not simply copy the local copy of the SVN repository to MyGames. :thumbsup:
Use "Tortoise SVN -> Export" to get a copy without SVN-data and put that one into MyGames.
 
Ray,

Just to let you know the horses mechanic seems to work fine now. I haven't found any issues, although there are still a few things I want to check / confirm.

One thing is that the horse production rate increases seems to increase in steps, rather than a uniform constant percent. For example once I had 42 horses in the warehouse and was producing 2 horses per turn. Then I added 10 horses from a wagon, so I had 52 horses in the warehouse, and started producing 4 horses per turn. I am guessing the formula changed once I passed 50 horses.
Anyway this isn't a problem, just perhaps something to clarify in documentation.
 
Just to let you know the horses mechanic seems to work fine now. I haven't found any issues, although there are still a few things I want to check / confirm.

Ok, great. :)

Androrc will also be happy to hear that.
(He implemented the core logic for "Rebuild Horses with Percentual Breeding".)

One thing is that the horse production rate increases seems to increase in steps, rather than a uniform constant percent. For example once I had 42 horses in the warehouse and was producing 2 horses per turn. Then I added 10 horses from a wagon, so I had 52 horses in the warehouse, and started producing 4 horses per turn. I am guessing the formula changed once I passed 50 horses.
Anyway this isn't a problem, just perhaps something to clarify in documentation.

This is probably related to the way bonusses are calculated / added.
(River, Bonus Ressource, ...)

There is nothing coded concerning certain thresholds (>50, > 100, ...)
 
I am not sure if people realise. But you can settle on the bonus horse square, then that central square will start producing horses when you have horses in the warehouse (plus you still get the normal food as well).
In fact if you build a stable / ranch this might be the most productive use for a central settlement square, because normally they only produce small quantities because they cannot be improved.
 
I am not sure if people realise. But you can settle on the bonus horse square, then that central square will start producing horses when you have horses in the warehouse (plus you still get the normal food as well).
In fact if you build a stable / ranch this might be the most productive use for a central settlement square, because normally they only produce small quantities because they cannot be improved.

Confirming that if you build a ranch or stable you get the increase in number of horses per turn increased (using only the central settlement square).
- however adding an master rancher to the settlement somewhere doesn't do anything.
So if you can manage it, and put a lot of horses in the warehouse this will be the most productive central settlement square you could have.

I don't mind this continuing, but I think it needs a formal decision ... it feels like a bit of an exploit to me. It is a bit inconsistent, for example if you settle on a forest (or bonus lumber square) the forest disappears and is replaced by some other yield. Perhaps that should happen if you settle on a bonus horse tile?
 
I've read through this thread and I still cannot figure out how to make horses. I have improved a tile that has horse bonus on it with "Pasture". In the city screen there are no horse icons when the tile is worked. I tried putting a rancher to work on that tile and still no love. I built a stable and still no joy. Looked at Clopedia and read this thread and I'm pretty confused. Can somebody point me in the right direction???

Thanks

EDIT: Nevermind, I figured out that I needed to seed the city with some horses to get it started.

Thanks again and awesome mod!
 
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