Replayability and the tech tree: suggestions on varying one's tech path?

Grotius

Prince
Joined
Jan 7, 2002
Messages
409
Hi all,

I am enjoying BNW, though I'm still learning its new features. I'm wondering whether folks have suggestions on how to vary teching from one game to the next. I still have my vanilla-Civ-5 habits of beelining for techs that multiply science, like the National College. I played G&K intensively for a few weeks, but then I found myself doing the same science thing, game after game. (I usually play on Emperor.) I did this regardless of what type of victory I sought, since staying tech-competitive deters enemy aggression etc. This made the game feel less replayable.

Any suggestions on how to vary one's teching to keep things fresh? Perhaps a less tech-focused win is possible now in BNW?
 
Like Civ IV, I mainly research techs based on my surroundings. That way the techs I research feel meaningful instead of just getting one so I can get to the next. Or further on I may make short term goals and research based of of those.
 
I think it'd be fun if the tech tree had some ability to randomize for this reason, even just a little, or maybe have tech trees with minor changes for each civ :goodjob:

I always find myself doing more or less the same thing too, and between science boosts going for wonders.
 
Makonnen91, I also do the same. Otherwise, I could be ignoring early techs that would allow me to start reaping the happiness from luxuries.
 
What would help you is picking a civ that requires a different style and trying to maximize their style.

You could pick the Assyrians and be lessfocused on science, since it's ok to be behind.
 
I think it'd be fun if the tech tree had some ability to randomize for this reason, even just a little, or maybe have tech trees with minor changes for each civ :goodjob:

I always find myself doing more or less the same thing too, and between science boosts going for wonders.

The tech tree has minor changes for each civ, in that some techs are more valuable for some civs than others because a UU/UB/UI becomes available with a certain tech, or they have other effects that combine well with their UA.

To the OP:

Try playing a game without bee-lining. Force yourself to pick the tech from the cheapest techs that are available that is best for your situation at that point in time.
 
Thanks for the replies. Calouste, I'll try that. Thanks.

And yes, in future iterations of Civ, I'd enjoy a bit more variation in tech trees from one to the next. Wouldn't have to be much -- just enough to shake things up a bit. Actually, I liked the system in one of the early Master of Orion games, in which certain techs just never appeared in any given game.
 
I echo Calouste, trying different Civs and thus prioritizing different techs is a good way to open the game up. I also just say "this game I'm opening Piety" even though I think Tradition is best for myself and the size of maps I play on.

That said I really opening Archery then Writing.
 
I've found on Emperor I can usually vary the tech tree quite a bit and still catch up to the AI by mid-Rennaissance. If I go straight to Writing->Philosophy->Civil Service->Education then they never have a chance.

So I generally pick a couple 'off the tech path' techs to work towards and then backfill to Education when done with my other techs. This lets you play towards 'flavor' and still doesn't leave you hopelessly behind. Besides, I like to be on the back foot for the beginning of the game as it generally makes the rest of the game more fun.
 
Thanks for the replies. Calouste, I'll try that. Thanks.

And yes, in future iterations of Civ, I'd enjoy a bit more variation in tech trees from one to the next. Wouldn't have to be much -- just enough to shake things up a bit. Actually, I liked the system in one of the early Master of Orion games, in which certain techs just never appeared in any given game.

I've pretty much stopped bee-lining in my games because I find it more fun without it. I'll still skip over techs that don't give me an immediate benefit though, like Optics when I'm landlocked or Iron Working when I don't have Iron and are not interested in the Colossus or the Heroic Epic. But other than that, it's more fun to decide between say picking Horseback Riding because you need a Caravansary to improve your trade routes (which means you'll build a unit to hunt barbs to protect your trade route) or picking Optics because there is a decent city spot with some Sea Resources (which means you'll build a Settler), rather than just going for Philosophy every single time.
 
i have found instances where i took a different path than philosophy early for the national collega for ex, also forgoing on loosing the time to build it like the great library and not go for tradition early, and rather expand fast and really try to get lot of poppulation fast to make up for the shortfall of not having the national collega by rapid expansion and building the national college later. there are ways to make up for what you misss per turn by notbuilding the national college early. Im trying strategy's with rapid expansion and civs of 8 city's rather than 4 using liberty and i have some progress and succes.

One way is to consider how fast you can grow people to make the national college more meaningfull, afaik it gives a bonus to research all over the civilization thus while it might be build at some later point, if one at that later point is at a significantly higher poppulation with more city's than the one that waited and took time/effort to build the national college first, then that might make up for the shortfall among other things. (just having grown more in general by then)
This might imply aresearch more oriented towards quick expansion and growth and very bend on getting quite a few settlers and workers very fast.

There are other ways to get more science by expanding. there is the messenger of the gods pantheon that gives +2 science for every city connection. The maya's have a shrine that produces 2 faith and 2 science which might prompt one to consider having more early city's with one of these in it.

Then there is the koreans, maybe with them rather you might like to beeline for currency most of all while expanding, and try to get techs asap that gives you specialists buildings as every specialist gives an added 2 science. it might allow the koreans to expand and take a different research path leading rather to wonders like the hanging gardens and Petra.

I was trying out a strategy earlier with the maya's with large expansion. otherwise usually the strategy was 4 city's and tradition and that is a quite potent strategy, but different paths would indeed be nice. Though while its so thart early one by keeping it small and concentrating poppulation in a few city's will allow you to build the national college soon and grow fast with tradition, while hapyness is not easy to get early on by the late game one does have significantly more of it usually and that imply's by the late game you better have like 8 city's or more with the extra poppulation for more science, so youre using all the happyness you got. Afcourse, if you choose not to expand much early on youre less likely to grab a lot of luxury's later than if you did so early to the size of 8 city's, or youll need to war a bit over those extra city's.

otoh, could one make up for the fact that it's almost impossible to build the national college early when aiming for rapid expansion? Thus with the maya the strategy was to get a lot of city's quick rather trough liberty and very beelining strait for that free settler and the 50% reduction on building it in culture, and then hard building settlers to the point that i had like 8 city's all near or even settled on luxury's and with just enough workers around to work a few luxury's to plantations,quary's or mine's while i was setlling city's. the first tech was still pottery but after that it was calender and then mining, then animal husbandry and trapping, no need for writing as the capital stayed at size 5 while building settlers and every city was to build that special Maya shrine asap afcourse, then a monument, library was only interresting for larger city's. Messenger of the gods as religion would be chosen and city connections would come soon. Another consideration was that being larger might allow the civ to catch more trade routes from other civs and thus gaining some added research there from being big, caravanseray's would be build in the hope that would pull more research bringing trade to the civ. The end point being that you get big early on, if you can manage it withought falling behind then you will outtech youre opponents easily later on because of more poppulation later, more university's with specialists etc.

A capital city size 6 with a national college and a library produces 18 research iirc? A mayan capital size 4 + its shrine makes 9 research, then you would need like 2 added city's size 2 + shrine's to about make up with that early on, liberty will give you a settler soon if you beeline for it and harbuilding one after youve unlocked that policy doesn't take to much time, the maya's shrine's are cheap and so are their early archer units so you might actually get all that before you could have build the national college.

A capitol size 10 + 3 added city's size 6 all having a library and with the national college around will produce roughly 67 research. If the maya's have 8 city's with a shrine in it then that gives them 16 research, if by then all city's are connected and imbued by the pantheon belief then thats another 14 research and with the +3 research bonus of the capital that makes a total of 33 research not counting poppulation. Withought library's then the maya would need a poppulation of 34 total to make as much research as the 4 city's with size 10-6-6-6 respectivly combvined, or 28 poppulation total there. for the the added 4 city's will produce an added 12 unhapiness, so the maya's here need to find an added 18 happyness to make up for poppulation/city's. When the maya's should have build library's in those 8 city's, then it only needs 22 population they need to make as much as the 4 city's, still with a 12 unhapiness by number of city's, then the maya's only need to find 1 extra luxury to make up for the unhapyness and make as much research with their 8 city's of an average size 3 as the 4 tall city's strategy. When the national college then gets eventually build, the maya's are bigger and stronger and will make another 50% more research or something like a 100 beakers, not bad if you can do all that before you get to education, and essentially youre 8 Maya city's need only a cheap shrine, a library and some minimal poppulation for the research and making the roads profitablme. (you can avoid growth in favor of production here)

probably the maya's should build there many city's against mountains, if youre going for the maximum research output trough loads of poppulation in many city's when you have more hapyness later, then the added 50% from having observatory's everywhere will jsut make so much more inpact.

That said, expanding to 8 city's in time with decent luxury's around while there other civs around is not always easy, ive tested this strategy on emperor and i grew faster than the ai but in that game i ran out of usefull near land to expand beyond 4 city's.
 
Lots of great suggestions here. I really appreciate it! I'm also reassured to hear that some folks go "off the beaten tech path", instead of beelining to Philosophy, to mix things up. I'm going to try that, too.
 
Top Bottom