Civ4: No custom units or buildings=Crap game. Everyone go back to Civ3

Neomega · Oct 31, 2005

Weasel Op said:
Then what would be the problem with the camera rotating? (yeah I'm back already)

The unit would also look like it was rotating.

Note how camera view goes form near isometric to top down when you zoom out. Well, with a billboard, from top down, the unit would still appear in isometric... kind of like it was lying on it's side.

Billboards are usually used for effects like fireballs and smoke, because they are relatively speherical, and no matter what the angle, they look the same.

There are also other types of billboards, that hold their position, used for things like laser beams... but as you would zoom or rotate, their flatness would be come very noticeable.

The only way to use billboards for units, and have them look good would be a locked camera view.

jpinard · Nov 1, 2005

Yes, the title of this thread should be changed. Glad Sword_Of_Geddon has expanded his horizons.

WildWeazel · Nov 1, 2005

Neomega said:
The only way to use billboards for units, and have them look good would be a locked camera view.

That was what somebody (warpstorm I think) suggested when the idea of billboard units first came up. Aren't camera controls in Python domain? And since billboards are just primitives, couldn't we add them now like Gaias did with the sphere?

El Justo · Nov 1, 2005

i guess i can give my two cents here...

first off, i will not pass judgment yet on civ4. to do so at this juncture is silly. sure, it took a long time to learn how to mod civ3 properly and it feels like all of our experience w/ it is null and void. well, that's life. this is how things work in the real world and you either adjust or get off the train.

however, i'm concerned about the actual steps needed to mod civ4, especially adding in units and the like. my point is that i'm afraid that firaxis has made it more difficult for the average modder to create and mod for civ4 when the whole point was to make it more user-friendly for us. iow, i echo Rocoteh's sentiment in that the actual 'time spent', even after we're familiar w/ the protocols, will increase dramatically. now, don't get me wrong, at some point or another, i will try my darndest to make the game like i want it. this obviously will take some time.

lastly, someone noted that the modding ability for civ3 is bunk and that civ2 scenarios were a better over-all product this coming from someone who has never posted a scenario in the forums. well, this is not only a slap in the face to civ3 modders but it completely contradicts the poster's (you know who you are) sentiments about 'stick w/ what ever civ version you want and keep you mouth shut' mentality. i fail to even remotely see your point and i would suggest that you put a lid on it.

jpinard · Nov 1, 2005

El Justo said:
i guess i can give my two cents here...

first off, i will not pass judgment yet on civ4. to do so at this juncture is silly. sure, it took a long time to learn how to mod civ3 properly and it feels like all of our experience w/ it is null and void. well, that's life. this is how things work in the real world and you either adjust or get off the train.

however, i'm concerned about the actual steps needed to mod civ4, especially adding in units and the like. my point is that i'm afraid that firaxis has made it more difficult for the average modder to create and mod for civ4 when the whole point was to make it more user-friendly for us. iow, i echo Rocoteh's sentiment in that the actual 'time spent', even after we're familiar w/ the protocols, will increase dramatically. now, don't get me wrong, at some point or another, i will try my darndest to make the game like i want it. this obviously will take some time.

lastly, someone noted that the modding ability for civ3 is bunk and that civ2 scenarios were a better over-all product this coming from someone who has never posted a scenario in the forums. well, this is not only a slap in the face to civ3 modders but it completely contradicts the poster's (you know who you are) sentiments about 'stick w/ what ever civ version you want and keep you mouth shut' mentality. i fail to even remotely see your point and i would suggest that you put a lid on it.

You know everyone can cry about whether a new game is easier or more difficult to mod. But as each generation of games gets more detailed - yes it will be a little more difficult. And that's certainly no reason to stomp on progress. Do we need five thousand mods of varying quality, or fewer better mods? Rome Total War is a good example of the move to true 3d. Some modders cried about it being more difficult to mod new in new units - but hell, I'd gladly take fewer mods of greater detail and quality than what we had before. Rome Total Realism just goes to show that even with greater complexity us modders can still do perform nicely if we want to put the time in.

El Justo · Nov 1, 2005

jpinard said:
You know everyone can cry about whether a new game is easier or more difficult to mod. But as each generation of games gets more detailed - yes it will be a little more difficult. And that's certainly no reason to stomp on progress. Do we need five thousand mods of varying quality, or fewer better mods? Rome Total War is a good example of the move to true 3d. Some modders cried about it being more difficult to mod new in new units - but hell, I'd gladly take fewer mods of greater detail and quality than what we had before. Rome Total Realism just goes to show that even with greater complexity us modders can still do perform nicely if we want to put the time in.

and what does this have to do w/ my original statement? :confused:

Rocoteh · Nov 2, 2005

El Justo said:
i guess i can give my two cents here...

first off, i will not pass judgment yet on civ4. to do so at this juncture is silly. sure, it took a long time to learn how to mod civ3 properly and it feels like all of our experience w/ it is null and void. well, that's life. this is how things work in the real world and you either adjust or get off the train.

however, i'm concerned about the actual steps needed to mod civ4, especially adding in units and the like. my point is that i'm afraid that firaxis has made it more difficult for the average modder to create and mod for civ4 when the whole point was to make it more user-friendly for us. iow, i echo Rocoteh's sentiment in that the actual 'time spent', even after we're familiar w/ the protocols, will increase dramatically. now, don't get me wrong, at some point or another, i will try my darndest to make the game like i want it. this obviously will take some time.

lastly, someone noted that the modding ability for civ3 is bunk and that civ2 scenarios were a better over-all product this coming from someone who has never posted a scenario in the forums. well, this is not only a slap in the face to civ3 modders but it completely contradicts the poster's (you know who you are) sentiments about 'stick w/ what ever civ version you want and keep you mouth shut' mentality. i fail to even remotely see your point and i would suggest that you put a lid on it.

El Justo,

I second this 100%.

To be quite frank: I am sick and tired of these people who
spit on CIV 3 scenario creators!

Rocoteh

yoshi · Nov 2, 2005

Not being able to add new units and buildings doesn't keep with the "modder's wet dream" that Civ4 is supposed to be. I think some of you guys just haven't figured out what the process is it yet. (AFAIK, the SDK is supposed to be for more advanced functionality--not things like adding stuff.)

...But cudos to Firaxis for letting you waste time trying to figure this thing out that could better be spent doing other more constructive things (like actual modding, for instance).

Neomega · Nov 2, 2005

yoshi said:
Not being able to add new units and buildings doesn't keep with the "modder's wet dream" that Civ4 is supposed to be. I think some of you guys just haven't figured out what the process is it yet. (AFAIK, the SDK is supposed to be for more advanced functionality--not things like adding stuff.)

...But cudos to Firaxis for letting you waste time trying to figure this thing out that could better be spent doing other more constructive things (like actual modding, for instance).

Firaxis never released a tool to make civ III units, animations, or any other graphics... never.

Yet there are thousands of units and graphics. I think a unit maker is closer than people think...

warpstorm · Nov 2, 2005

Neomega said:
Firaxis never released a tool to make civ III units, animations, or any other graphics... never.

This is because they have never developed one themselves. They use off the shelf tools for this.

WildWeazel · Nov 2, 2005

Off the shelf tools for making an 8-directional FLC? Then why did Moeniir invent one? :hmm:

Civ4: No custom units or buildings=Crap game. Everyone go back to Civ3

Neomega

Deity

jpinard

Martian

WildWeazel

Carthago Creanda Est

El Justo

Deity

jpinard

Martian

El Justo

Deity

Rocoteh

Deity

yoshi

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Neomega

Deity

warpstorm

Yumbo? Yumbo!

WildWeazel

Carthago Creanda Est

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