What is it that makes AI's be able to win even though out teched?

Okay, so long story short, I'm going for a Domination Victory. Eventually I attack Genghis Khan. Now, at this time Genghis Khan has nothing but Pikemen and Trebuchets. So I attack him with my army of CANNONS AND MUSKETMEN, then he defeats me.

What the heck? What kind of combat bonus is this, where he can have Pikemen and go toe-to-toe with Musketmen? I also noticed my units would lose HP in his territory.

I did eventually come back with Riflemen and Artillery, but it's just stupid how I out tech him and he still has a fighting chance because of some policy or some other BS.

Did u move your units next to a Citadel?
Ranged units are very susceptible to melee attacks. Musketmen, although gunpowder take ages to reload so against a hardened band of pikemen they wouldn't fair well, I suspect the game takes this into account. Also you get flanking bonuses and bonuses for being near a great general. Since Genghis is a warmonger he usually opens Honor to get his free great khan.
Tech level means nothing against shear numbers, and Genghis will build as many units as he can support. Up until you have Infantry, Rocket Artillery, and Bombers with appropriate promotions will numbers mean more than tech.

Looks like genghis khan have a pikeman fortified in a citadel.
And civaddict2013 is facing it for the first time in his life and is confused by the constant -30 hp loss every turn.

A pikeman is like str 12, then in citadel = 24 and then fortified that's another 50%.. making pikeman well more than capable of crushing musketmen. And if There's an friendly Khan nearby? xD And various another bonuses that it might have. Like the citadel is behind a river and op is suiciding units on that citadel. And it's also on a hill?!

Does CivAddict2013 even look at battle results probability windows? I suspect not.

Share screenshot.

There is a simple solution here. Before attacking, but after you have selected the attack option (red circle around enemy unit) look at the bottom left of the screen. This will list out the combat strength of the units and all bonuses and penalties currently affecting the units. You can easily see *exactly* what combat bonuses we're dealing with.

Also, maybe your empire was unhappy and that is giving your units a penalty? (but this would also be included in the bottom left combat bonuses window...)

CivAddict2013 said:

I did eventually come back with Riflemen and Artillery, but it's just stupid how I out tech him and he still has a fighting chance because of some policy or some other BS.

Click to expand...

Such attitude! Might I politely suggest that it's not "BS", but the obvious fact that you still have more to learn about the combat mechanics of Civ 5?

Note that some of us on higher difficultly levels have learned how to defeat the AI even when outnumbered and/or out-teched, using terrain, flanking, fortifying, healing, citadels, roads, ranged attacks, city bombardment, etc. Fighting in home territory and knowing how to retreat damaged units are two key tactics.

I will take a pike over a musket any day. Pikes rule civ 5, I put one in a citadel once and it was taking abuse from GWI's for over 30 turns before it got pasted by GWB's.

I never bother with iron based units until I can make rifles.

The AI loves honour and picks it regularly. This means their units may well be very well promoted and also have the discipline effect giving them +15% combat strength.

The AI also likes taking tenets/beliefs/pantheons and build wonders that add to their combat strength in certain circumstances - like being in their own borders etc that human players almost always ignore.

Add a few of these things together and you can see how units that are at a glance inferior, can hold their own against more advanced foes.

Haha you remind me of the people who go into the Civ4 forums and go "what is this why are my riflemen not instantly-winning against macemen???"

Never underestimate your oppoments army. Even a relatively behind army can be dangerious with the right buffs.

I once assualted a human friends cap that was near the coast (but not on the coast, so no navy there to directly protect it) and despite being a few critical techs behind me (I had artilarry, he had just cannons being the main difference, I also had 4 battleships) his army was tough because he had Himar castle and honour buff, which made him 30% stronger not counting any other buffs.

I won largely because I only needed to take his cap to win that battle, but had it been part of a larger campiagn I would have likely failed to go beyond my cap due to the huge losses I substrained, too even for my liking and had he examined his borders and established a small army there, I likely would have struggled to get there at all.

In this case, check to see what he has, other then tech that could be giving his units advantage in battle. If he poped a great general, you need to destory the unit on there and savalage it ASP or bypass it completely, otherwise you will take overwheming losses.

Don't stand close to citadels

Technology does help, but you have to calculate sheer numbers, defensive positions, and other bonuses in order to have an accurate description on how to defeat the AI army.

Could also be possible that the enemy had built units with Barracks and some wonders that boost XP, along with actively hunting barbarians, those Pikeman could have easily 30% bonus to combat in the terrain of choice. And when defending in their territory they get the benefit of Fortification and +10 heal.

If their pantheon was the +30 healed per turn next to friendly city... game over, you need tanks to take that out.

Ghengis khan has the kesheik which can move, attack and then run away. If they do all this during his turn with quick combat and quick movement on it will appear that you're losing life from no where because they run away after hitting you. Ghenkis is also a military civ, he will no doubt own at war. If you're touching citadels you will lose life every turn. Any unit fortified in a citadel is much stronger than normal.

If you're at war, you should always, always consider deactivating quick combat so you actually see what's going on.

It's a shame you can't fine tune it to only show animated combat during enemy turns involving your units. That would be perfect.

I don't really care about a city state I'm allied with shooting a barbarian trireme that sailed into range...

My friend who we'll call Ryan and I were playing together, with 6-8 other AIs. I was China, he was Japan. Quickly we eliminate enemies & we got into quite a war. Now, he had a superior tech, but I had more numbers & experienced troops. He started to push & I gradually fell back, lost a few puppets, not the end of the world. But it eventually came down to a choke point. Imagine this: river 1 side some hills, some mountains & my city that he needed in order to push to my capital. I had 2 citadels on the one side of the river with a space in between them, in each citadel a pikemen & a cho-ku-no in between. Also very important: my religion had Defender of the Faith. So Ryan comes with riflemen and cannons, expecting easy pickings. Nope. My PIKEMEN were holding off RIFLEMEN. Like this: Pikemen- strength 16. Citadel-24-hills 45%-31-GG-33-DotF-36-Discipline-38-Fortify-42. 42 Strength Pikemen on 34 strength riflemen plus those getting damaged every turn & my pikemen getting über healed, he stood no chance XD. He was *pissed*. Imagine watching that happen irl...