On the topic of unhealthiness, why did thefrom Jungles get removed?
I agree with that, this is far too easy to begin in jungle ! Historically, didn't the jungle were hostile (except, maybe, for south americans) ?
Brainstorming Thread - One-Trick-Pony Techs
- Thread starter Vokarya
- Start date
I agree with that, this is far too easy to begin in jungle ! Historically, didn't the jungle were hostile (except, maybe, for south americans) ?
Rezca
The Greatest Jaggi
Right. Since AND allows jungles and forests to be burned down pretty much right away with the only 'drawback' being no hammers being produced from the chopping, Jungle Starts are no longer an extra challenge nor is settling in one in any way detrimental to the growth of that city.
Was the removal of
from jungle tiles simply to 'make things easier' for the player? Or was there some other reason? 
JosEPh_II
TBS WarLord
Right. Since AND allows jungles and forests to be burned down pretty much right away with the only 'drawback' being no hammers being produced from the chopping, Jungle Starts are no longer an extra challenge nor is settling in one in any way detrimental to the growth of that city.
Was the removal of
Boys you are both wrong. Vanilla BtS added the
to Jungles to make it harder to expand into them, yes. You had to have Iron working before you could chop Jungle tile, getting into a Jungle area was delayed by tech. But Vincentz who lived in Thailand for years developed a minimod called Jungle Camps that reflected the True use for Jungles. I adapted that minimod after 2 years of private use into AND when 45* asked me to join the AND Team.It is for the purpose with newer maps (added terrain features) to allow a Good start from Jungle tiles. Historically around the world many Ancient Civs flourished in the Jungles all over the world. This is one of the points were AND has moved past vanilla BtS in scope.
Without JC's the Ancient Era of AND was an exercise in EoT clicking. The severity and austerity were tedious and Boring. Not so much now.
I'll pretty much hold the line on any JC changes. Until 45* kicks me off the team.
JosEPh
Rezca
The Greatest Jaggi
Not sure how the addition of the Jungle Camp has anything to do with the being removed though. That just gives them some production and commerce and allows for resources to be spawned. I was wondering why the Unhealthiness itself from the jungles had been removed. Jungle Camps could still be used with the still there.
But hey, after playing BTS for so long and having Jungles sport that feature, it's been more or less drilled into my mind and hard to get used to Jungles being free of unhealthiness
That's why it seemed odd to me - not because it was realistic/unrealistic but because I was so used to the old ways, and it's not easy for me to leave that sort of thinking so easily (I still sometimes forget there's no penalty to plopping a settler down in the middle of a jungle early in the game)
I was just curious is all.
being removed though. That just gives them some production and commerce and allows for resources to be spawned. I was wondering why the Unhealthiness itself from the jungles had been removed. Jungle Camps could still be used with the still there.But hey, after playing BTS for so long and having Jungles sport that feature, it's been more or less drilled into my mind and hard to get used to Jungles being free of unhealthiness
That's why it seemed odd to me - not because it was realistic/unrealistic but because I was so used to the old ways, and it's not easy for me to leave that sort of thinking so easily (I still sometimes forget there's no penalty to plopping a settler down in the middle of a jungle early in the game)
I was just curious is all.
Rezca
The Greatest Jaggi
For Neural Networks, Would be giving Espionage units a bonus to missions be possible? Or granting a certain building an extra boost to 
be acceptable? Can't think of any buildings that might fit right now, but...
be acceptable? Can't think of any buildings that might fit right now, but...
<Nexus>
Traveler of the Multiverse
For Neural Networks, Would be giving Espionage units a bonus to missions be possible? Or granting a certain building an extra boost to
Building: Cyber Security Link
Master Of Orion II forever
Just need to fill with some cool content...
Rezca
The Greatest Jaggi
Building: Cyber Security Link
Master Of Orion II forever
Just need to fill with some cool content...
<Nexus>
Traveler of the Multiverse
While looking into Neural Networks to see what content would fit to it I was amazed to see that it is actually empty 
So I come with 2 ideas, inspired by MoO2
Cyber-Security Link
Origianal MoO2 description:
Provides a direct mental link to computers, allowing spies to circumvent many automated security systems. Adds +10 to all spy rolls.
Effects:
+10% in city
+10 points
helps thwart rival spies
requires Computer Networks
free Improvise I promotion
Autolab
Origianal MoO2 description:
Completly automated research facility. Generates 30 research points.
Effects:
+30
(equal to 10 scientists. Or is it too much?)
requires Computer Networks, Research Lab and pover
The +30 is equal to 10 scientists. If is it too much, than it could be either lowered or make it a National Wonder (max3)
What do you think?
So I come with 2 ideas, inspired by MoO2
Cyber-Security Link
Origianal MoO2 description:
Provides a direct mental link to computers, allowing spies to circumvent many automated security systems. Adds +10 to all spy rolls.
Effects:
+10%
in city+10
pointshelps thwart rival spies
requires Computer Networks
free Improvise I promotion
Autolab
Origianal MoO2 description:
Completly automated research facility. Generates 30 research points.
Effects:
+30
(equal to 10 scientists. Or is it too much?)requires Computer Networks, Research Lab and pover
The +30
is equal to 10 scientists. If is it too much, than it could be either lowered or make it a National Wonder (max3)What do you think?
Rezca
The Greatest Jaggi
AutoLab would definitely be far too powerful. That's like, the version of the Food Processing Plant
version of the Food Processing Plant I've been redesigning parts of the tech tree to make the lines clearer, and I'm coming to the conclusion that we have a lot of late-Modern/early-Transhuman computer techs that have a lot of overlap (Knowledge Management, Neural Networks, Virtual Reality, Machine Learning, Wearable Computers, Mesh Networks, Advanced Computers, etc.) and that the best thing to do would be to give Neural Networks the axe and use anything that we could come up with to strengthen the other techs.
Neural Networks feels like a tech that is invented in the Modern Era but doesn't come to fruition until the Transhuman, and then it can be folded into other Transhuman Techs. In some ways, it's almost like Gunpowder, because you could make a case that Gunpowder is invented in the late Medieval Era but the practical uses are developed in the Renaissance, so it's a Renaissance Era tech.
Neural Networks feels like a tech that is invented in the Modern Era but doesn't come to fruition until the Transhuman, and then it can be folded into other Transhuman Techs. In some ways, it's almost like Gunpowder, because you could make a case that Gunpowder is invented in the late Medieval Era but the practical uses are developed in the Renaissance, so it's a Renaissance Era tech.
Rezca
The Greatest Jaggi
For some reason the thought of Neural Networks sounds very 'powerful' and interesting to me, so I'd be a bit sad to see it go and would really prefer to try and think something up for it.
On the other hand, I think 'Wearable Computers' is pointless and wouldn't raise any complaints to it being removed heh.
On the other hand, I think 'Wearable Computers' is pointless and wouldn't raise any complaints to it being removed heh.
Afforess
The White Wizard
Agree, the ability to "wear" computers is not a technological advancement as much as a manipulation of basic textiles...
45°38'N-13°47'E
Deity
More or less I also agree, although I'm a bit sad since we've just discovered that tech (smartphones, pads, Google glasses, smartwatches, etc)
Rezca
The Greatest Jaggi
45°38'N-13°47'E;13261035 said:More or less I also agree, although I'm a bit sad since we've just discovered that tech (smartphones, pads, Google glasses, smartwatches, etc)
Helping define what exactly a 'wearable computer' is would help I think. A lot of current-generation tech could vaguely be considered fitting in with that technology, which would kinda take away the 'transhuman' and futuristic feel that many of those technologies in that part of the tree carry.
For me, Wearable Computers is holding its own as far as content goes (both Modern Fighter and Virtual Reality Theatre are here) and I think it fits with not just truly wearable computers, but tablets/smartphones/other computing devices that can be carried around at all times. So WC would definitely be on my keep list.
Rezca
The Greatest Jaggi
VRT could easily be put onto Neural Networks I suppose since the data and audio could be streamed directly into the mind and senses of the person to make it feel like they're truly experiencing whatever they're watching.
Whatever does happen I won't really mind though. I'd like to try and find a way to keep Neural Networks, but if it simply must go then alas...
That's actually closer to Brain-Machine Interface. Neural Networks are computational models patterned after animal nervous systems. Wikipedia has a pretty good article on artificial neural networks, which is what is being used here: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Artificial_neural_networks. I think it's a neat concept, but it doesn't have the associated content that makes for a really good tech in game terms. If I was going on concept alone, it would probably make the cut, but like having a separate tech for Zero, it's not going to have any content and it's going to feel forced. I'd rather have players choosing between different good things right away, or at least good things sooner against better things later.
Rezca
The Greatest Jaggi
Is there any way it can be tied in to a medical advance? I know
is abundant in that era, but what about somehow? Providing some building with additional perhaps? Neural Networks is a nice idea as a tech, but if it's not working then perhaps it is best it be removed.
45°38'N-13°47'E
Deity
I mostly agree with Vokarya, and I don't think we need extra science from modern onwards. Actually I was thinking of reducing it.
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