C2C - Religions discussions and ideas

Different topic , Right now I'm more concerned over getting a Religion at all. AI is beating me badly in that race. Current game it's 2070BC and I still have not been able to Found a religion. AI seems to have the inside track so far. So it's much more of a challenge and frustration. Just keep missing out. Started this new game expressly beelining Tengri and missed it by 2000 game years! :ack:

JosEPh
 
Could someone give me the source on the slavic.mp3 music (religion sound)? I have searched the forum and tried song recognition apps without luck.
 
In late ancient, I have founded Canaanism and Kemetism, but can't build monasteries yet (Priesthood?). Does this mean I can't spread them at all? Meanwhile Druid, Mesop and Andean mishes are flooding in from the (more advanced) AIs.
 
In late ancient, I have founded Canaanism and Kemetism, but can't build monasteries yet (Priesthood?). Does this mean I can't spread them at all? Meanwhile Druid, Mesop and Andean mishes are flooding in from the (more advanced) AIs.

Temples at Priesthood and Monasteries at Meditation. Do you have Multiple Religion Spread On in the BUG Options?

JosEPh
 
Only Druid, Shaman, Tengrii, Ngai and Yourba can make missionaries without Monasteries. All the others need a monastery to build a missionary unless you are running the civic which allows you to build them without monasteries.

Originally those five religions had a national limit on the number of missionaries allowed. For Druid and Shaman you could only build a cathedral and higher level building with the missionary which cost as much as a national wonder (the missionary cost that much).

Multiple Religion Spread is about religions spreading without the need for a missionary. In base BtS when you found a city without spreading any religions to it then the next turn a random religion will spread there. MRS allows any religion to spread to any city that does not have it. Though I think some civics stop it.
 
Some points so far

Asatru and Nagualism have nearly all special buildings/wonders obsolete at Humanism. Dont think it's fair, it's nearly make these religion obsolote with this tech

Druidism and shamanism are really good for food. If you have the right ressource. But if you start n Africa or Australia, you nearly cant build the special buildung.
 
Some points so far

Asatru and Nagualism have nearly all special buildings/wonders obsolete at Humanism. Dont think it's fair, it's nearly make these religion obsolote with this tech

Possibly also based on the idea that Cannibalism and Human Sacrifice should also go obsolete at that time. Druidism should probably have been included in those two originally but wasn't.

I have some ideas which will probably allow us to change all of the Religious wonders so that they fit better with how your nation wants to grow.

Druidism and shamanism are really good for food. If you have the right ressource. But if you start n Africa or Australia, you nearly cant build the special buildung.

Druidism has not had the attention that Shamanism has had.;) Every time a new food animal was added so was a special building for Shamanism but this was not the case for Druidism and the food plants.

As yet no attempt has been made to restrict where the bonuses are placed with the plant ones being totally left up to the map scripts as they work well for them. Some work does need to be done to change where the wild animal resources appear on the random maps. This is a known bug and is on my to do list. The spawning of wild animals is based on Earth normal as described elsewhere.
 
@Camber

I have done more work on your Mormon suggestions. I have found all the art and think I have all the buildings correct now. I have had to remove the movies as everything goes haywire when I have them in. I will look into it again and get it fixed.

There is a problem with the way the units are defined. You have the missionary upgrading to a returned missionary but that means you will never be able to build a missionary. There is a way around this but I need to know a bit more about your intent here.

The events are still not working but I may not have your latest code for them.

This has missed the deadline for v36 but can be included in v37.
 
1. Most of the religions in the mod currently are schismatic. Christianity is schismatic Judaism; Buddhism, Jainism are (or were originally - see 2. below) schismatic forms of Hinduism; Voodoo from Yoruba; Hellenism from Mesopotamism; etc. etc. etc.

2. Christianity is not a modern religion. It is a classical religion that has become so accepted despite its quirky ancient near-eastern ways that many of us think of it as modern. Hinduism is originally an ancient-era religion, etc. My point is that a 'modern' religion only became that way by surviving and being patronised and propagandized (and by evolving, including as in point 3.).

If the Mesoamerican religions had not been genocided, they would be (more visibly - see point 3.) with us today. I'm not interested in arguments as to whether certain religions disappeared 'inevitably'. I simply disagree.

3. Religions survive by adopting elements of their rivals. Easter is the name of an Asatru Saxon deity (some say a corruption of Ishtar which means Asatru got it from Mesopotamism). Christmas is an adaptation of Roman "Hellenist" Saturnalia and Jewish Chanukah. My point here is that we are deluding ourselves if we think these religions have gone the way of the dinosaurs (or even that of the Neanderthals ;)).

This is why I want evolving religions. New religions start out as break away cults from existing religions. However they may merge back into their parent religion as that religion changes or they may become new religions in their own right.

Current idea early on everyone has some form of Animism and each nation develops that. This means that most nations will never have more than one or two religions present.
 
Current idea early on everyone has some form of Animism and each nation develops that. This means that most nations will never have more than one or two religions present.

I Really love that idea, it would make Religions work out a lot different per game, the evolution of Religion to match the Evolution of society,

Strict adherence to Traditions and scripture to tend the Flock, or a more Theological Philosophical mindset that's more set towards a persons Own spirituality,
Pacifistic Ideology based around the concept that all life is most sacred, or a Warmongering Philosophy where Fire decides those who are Worthy to have a high place in the after life,

so many different ways religion can pan out,
 
We need some Oceanic religions so looking at Boonkie's idea thread there is the following idea set.
+The Dreaming: Native Australian religion. Not the legit name, but I dont think it has a legit name. Closest to come to a identity name would be The Dreaming or Dreamtimeism. This could be among the most fun and ?complex? religions in the game. It should appear slightly OP and insanely fun.

Also for this religion, the Wonambi (prehistoric ice age constrictor 10-30 ft long of Australia with no living descendants today) should be added, since this was probably the inspiration for the Rainbow Serpent. May have been killed out by man and the dingo.


-In a sense, each totem should also function like a military upgrade, one per city, the first one built. If a city has potatoes, and they build the Yam Totem first, then their warriors all carry the Yam Flag. Or can build a unique unit with up to 2-3 limit, that gain a constellation bonus, but the sign is replaced with a potatoe instead of say, Pisces. This may be too complex and difficult and just best to leave out. But read the site, see what you think.

http://www.aboriginalculture.com.au/religion.shtml\

-Great Spirit Temple/Song(?)

-2nd building is Creation Beings Temple. (technically the "temple" is a astoundingly large and blessed petroglyph. so would Creation Beings Holy Petroglyph be better to title?)

-3rd is Ancestors Petroglyph. Only after Ancestor Temple can Totems be built.

-function like Animism in a way. For example, If a plot has jungle in vicinity, that one city can build a Tree Totem.

Special Building: Wirroowaa's Teaching. Considered in history the first man to learn desert camo in Australia and how to sneak up on Procoptodons and kill with basic weapons before they could run. This blessing says to paint your chest with clay in order to receive the blessing of the Great Spirit, keep your back black, and use other colors and items. Also use bark huts for waiting and bark-plated shields to block kicks or the sand kicked up during the chase. Hunters/scouts/chasers/trackers receive no losses in desert and defensive bonuses for deserts. Aboriginal wooden spearmen with bark shields and white chests with desert and scrub bonuses. Hmmm....

Plot and Vicinity dependent totems:
-Potatoes = Yam Totem (constellation-like upgrade for workers?)
-Fruit = Fruit Totem. If a modder wants to grow this to Banana Totem, Prickly pear Totem, etc., then...I guess. Seems too much work for me, but idk...
-River Plot = Water Totem
-Parrots = Gang Gang Totem
-Forest in vicinity = Tree Deity Totem
-Flower/dye = Warratah Totem
-Any natural wonder = 'Natural-Wonder-Name' Deity Totem

Building Dependent Totems:
-Kangaroo herd/hunting camp = Kangaroo Ancestor Totem (constellation-like upgrade for story tellers?)
-Termite Mound = Termite Totem
-Dog Breeder = Dingo Totem

Subdued Animal Totems:
-Platypus = Boondaburra Totem
-Echidna/porcupine/armadillo = Biggie-Billa Totem
-Thylacine = cLooh-Oahnna Totem
-Ding/wolf/dhole = Warrigal Totem
-Diprotodon = Bunyip Totem (warrior boost and river boost?)
-Wonambi = Rainbow Serpent Totem (there are no constrictors in Australia today, but when man first hit the shores, there definitely were. Upwards of 30 feet long and ambushers near caves, waterholes and rivers. The areas filled with Salt Water Crocodiles probably only housed the largest since anything 10 feet or smaller probably couldnt have survived amongst the 30 ft crocodiles. Just what the color of the snake was is a good guess. But considering hiding amidst the red clay and greenish-blue reflective water it literally may have had a very rainbowish hue or shceme somewhat like a anaconda. The only human documentation we have the animal while alive is the ancient ice age stories of the Dreamtime and the Rainbow Serpent. So...mustve been rainbowish in SOME aspect.

I think there is quite a lot we can work with here:)

I think I go with Corroboree instead of buildings. This is then similar to the African religions Yoruba and Ngai and the Asian religion Tengri.

Religion Technology: The Dreaming requires Pictographics and Ceremonial Burial.

Temple level "building": Creation Corroboree requires religion in city

Monastery level "building": Ancestor Corroboree requires tech Ancestor Worship

Cathedral Level Building: ??? Corroboree ????
 
Pretty cool stuff there on Aboriginee religions. While we're at it, we equally need the Great Spirit religion of the Cherokee. N. American religions are lacking as well as Oceanic.
 
I think that there are already too many religions in the mod. Did you ever manage to make them fully modular, DH?
 
I think that there are already too many religions in the mod. Did you ever manage to make them fully modular, DH?

This is one area I have to disagree on, for now.

Now if number of Leaders and Civs in the mod would get reduced then I could agree. Many that are currently in the mod I personally don't like. I do miss Israel as a Civ and David and Solomon as Leaders. Much rather have them in than say Head Hunters or a half dozen Other Middle east Civs.

JosEPh
 
I think that there are already too many religions in the mod. Did you ever manage to make them fully modular, DH?

Not yet. The work on Mormon took time and is not complete since Chamber has gone missing. Also while making them modular Rwn made a couple of bad assumption which have lead to a better implementation of workers.

I also think there are far to few religions in the game but I also don't like the current fact that you can get them all. It is unrealistic.
 
<snip>but I also don't like the current fact that you can get them all. It is unrealistic.

That is only true for certain cultures and not unrealistic for early game or history at all.

JosEPh :)
 
That is only true for certain cultures and not unrealistic for early game or history at all.

JosEPh :)

If you had said religious belief systems rather than cultures I would agree. The same Culture in C2C would have gone through any number of changes to its religious beliefs varying from accepting all, through integrating many into one, to not tolerating any but a narrow interpretation of one and back or vice versa.
 
If you had said religious belief systems rather than cultures I would agree. The same Culture in C2C would have gone through any number of changes to its religious beliefs varying from accepting all, through integrating many into one, to not tolerating any but a narrow interpretation of one and back or vice versa.

Yes I should've said belief systems. And eventually the majority Culture usually boosts one belief over the rest. Some cultures then try to eradicate the lower/lesser "beliefs" but others were more tolerant.

I'll say it again the current Religious system in C2C is the best I've ever played. And for me personally it is a Major reason I keep playing C2C.

JosEPh
 
Wish something would be added to Jain and Rodnovera to compensate for -10% to 20% unit construction cost in the current for it is there just to mess AI up especialy when both religions are present and AI builds all buildings.
 
Top Bottom