The Deity Challenge Line-up - Game #11 - Morocco

@ Pythonic

@Pythonic - great write-up! I can't add much directly to what has been said. I used to be a good Emperor player who could sometimes win on Immortal, and then I read Tich's Deity guide for SV. It is written with the Shoshone in mind, but it translates to any SV. Many would find it boring, as it is a total turtle strategy, but it is the backbone of most of my games - at least to Plastics. I dislike avoiding the top of the tech tree until the end, but it is very efficient.

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=506043

Thanks for the feedback! It looks like the consensus is that I should have transitioned after taking Copenhagen to prioritize the SV, or maybe even passed on attacking Denmark altogether. I used to play Civ IV a lot, where the mantra is land=power, so it's a big surprise to me that one can win a scientific victory, or any sort of victory, with just the four original cities. I guess vertical growth is really strong in Civ V!

@Nigel_Tufnel2 Thanks for the recommendation to read Tich's guide. It looks great and quite technical. I'll have to practice going pure SV to optimize it for sub T250 wins (wow, in retrospect, my game went on for a while...)

@Fluphen Azine Yes, playing on epic speed is a different game entirely -- I think it favors domination and timed pushes with upgraded units a lot more. I'll need to practice standard timing for the challenges =)

@consentient Great criticism, and I think you're absolutely right that I was trying to play too mixed of a style and should have assessed the situation better to prioritize one or the other. As you say, the map didn't favor domination, so I should have assessed the situation and gone for the SV. I didn't realize how bad the AI is at doing the SV. That said, I think it's interesting that the game did in fact take so long, considering that (searching the threads) a runaway rationalism AI can win an SV at turn 250 or so, so I think that warring may be able to slow the AI down some. War with Alex was mandatory, because his gunboat diplo was giving 5 influence per turn to all city states, so I needed to lock in the ~5 CS allies that I had to prevent him from getting a DV. Given that I had to war, I think it's interesting to think about how best to do the space race while slowing the AI down as much as possible. I think nuking the core cities might be part of the answer. At the end of the day, though, I think my basic mechanics need better work: prioritize public schools/research labs, choose a better tech path, etc, to optimize the SV.

This is my first Deity game in a while (first since the patch, in fact). I decided to go for Diplo victory, and man is Greece a pain. That guy definitely feels like the most dangerous overall AI civ.

I'm going to hit the first World Leader vote on turn 252, which isn't bad at all, but I don't think there's any chance that I'll actually win then. I have barely more than half of the city-states (can't even count how many successful Greek coups I've had to cope with). I have my Workers scurrying to tear up Farms and build Trading Posts, and I'm just hoping that I'll be able to scrounge up enough cash to win on the second vote cycle. There's also that suspicious Danish army massing in the northeast...

I probably expanded a lot further outward than most people. The Jungle/Bananas city seemed like the best overall expansion spot, and my other expo choices were warped around wanting that city. I would've liked to get another city under the mountains, but unfortunately I was too slow. Liberty start with a Great Engineer for Machu Picchu (very nice as a way to undo the lack of gold in Liberty) followed by some standard Patronage/Rationalism/Freedom stuff.

obsolete

The endgame ended up being pretty interesting. Before I even got to the first World Leader vote, I got double-DOWed by Boudicca and Alexander, locking me out of half the city-states. Boudicca was close enough to fight, but it looked like it could be hard to get Alexander to make peace. Greece quickly ate one of my city-state, too.

I was able to overtake Boudicca with ease. She had the Forbidden Palace, so her DOW'ing me was actually pretty convenient. To deal with Alexander, I planned to build the Manhattan Project and put the fear of nukes in him. This ended up not being necessary. Once his ally got crushed, Alexander was eager to make peace -- he even gave me a generous 700 gold for my troubles.

At this point I had a ton of gpt and was able to borrow thousands upon thousands from my buddy Harald, and I cruised into victory on the second vote with every remaining city-state in my pocket. Pretty satisfying victory -- a bit of challenge, but not a game-long slog.

IMPORTANT NOTICE:

Though this map is quite old, it can still be played, so if you play it and complete it, please send me a PM so I can update the finisher's spreadsheet.

Thank you.

Sorry for bumping this, if you only need the finishing turn number in a PM, let me know so I don't bother.

Anyway

Well done Stormtrooper! Sorry you did not have a lot of fun playing this map. You were not alone. This was the least popular of the maps I submitted. However, do not underestimate Morocco's UA. While nothing like as good as Arabia, it will attract more friendship, especially early game.

Oh, and for everyone else, bumping the thread is a good way of drawing my attention, and we should definitely see your write-up if you made one. But send the PMs anyway, just in case.

stormtrooper412 said:

Sorry for bumping this, if you only need the finishing turn number in a PM, let me know so I don't bother.

[/spoiler]

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No apologies allowed for bumping and posting your game. I did the same thing when going back and playing the older maps. It would be great if you gave the older maps a full write-up…..no need to be brief.

On this map, I'm curious who got



and who didn't. I did not, and also didn't win this game. I think it was a factor.

I'm pretty sure it's 500 Gold, not GPT

But yeah, it's a good question. I'm afraid I didn't get it. I think Denmark will find it first in most playthroughs. I went East and started messing with Boudicca straight away.

I did not get the 500 gold as well. I think North was the last place I scouted even though many games I build 2 to 3 scouts I do not scout as much as most players do. I usually bring them back home or delete them once I get tired of having to constantly worry about where to send them. Many games they are costing me too much time or gold or if I am going honor I want them in my cities.

Shark Diver said:

No apologies allowed for bumping and posting your game. I did the same thing when going back and playing the older maps. It would be great if you gave the older maps a full write-up…..no need to be brief.

On this map, I'm curious who got

Spoiler :

the 500 GPT for finding El Dorado

and who didn't. I did not, and also didn't win this game. I think it was a factor.

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Lost a turn 276 Diplomatic defeat.

You could try to ally a few (coups + quests + gold) and then immediately DoW him. Pit the world against him and hope for other AI to kill some CS.

OK, I see how that could work. If I understand correctly, the CS's I've bought and couped can't be bought if they are at war (but can be couped?), which buys me some time.

Evening gonad said:

OK, I see how that could work. If I understand correctly, the CS's I've bought and couped can't be bought if they are at war (but can be couped?), which buys me some time.

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Yeah but they can be swiped by a third party and then returned to their previous ally

Evening gonad said:

Lost a turn 276 Diplomatic defeat.

Spoiler :

Alexander had all city states by around turn 200. With him having 525000 in the bank, I couldn't dent his control at all (he was hundreds ahead of me on relations for each), and lost on the first round of World Leader votes. As I understand it, this is a little unusual, but does happen. Would I have been better off sending all my spies to try and coup to prevent this outcome, as opposed to make inroads with gold? Or was it a lost cause?

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In the one game out of 20 that Alex actually works out what he should do and plays properly, there is almost no way to stop him, unless you have the best army cuz you've been going DomV. Playing peacefully, there is nothing you can do really.

consentient said:

In the one game out of 20 that Alex actually works out what he should do and plays properly, there is almost no way to stop him, unless you have the best army cuz you've been going DomV. Playing peacefully, there is nothing you can do really.

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Thats game for Alexander already. At that time, Alexander already has it done because he has all his city states bought it is best if youd quit..

reddishrecue said:

Thats game for Alexander already. At that time, Alexander already has it done because he has all his city states bought it is best if youd quit..

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Yes, that's exactly what I said. But it doesn't always happen like that. Sometimes he has 100k in the bank and isn't doing anything with it