How balanced are the ideologies?

BlackWizard · Aug 5, 2015

beetle said:
I would argue that this is one of the best tuned aspects of the game. My priority is the free tenets -- so I get to play all three.

I like Order less than the other two, but I will pick it if I am first to ideologies (not common). The AIs love Order, so I seem to end up with Order in more than half my games. Order has a weak wonder, but is otherwise suitable for any SV, and fewer useless/underpowered tenets than the other ideologies. Also, unlike Freedom, the first Tier 2 pick is obvious. I get the factories ASAP and the free SP from Kremlin. If I end up switching to Freedom or Autocracy, all the better!

My favorite ideology is Freedom, with the synergy between the tenets and wonder, it is a very compelling tree. It is balanced by the lack of significant Tier 1 happy boosts. I will pick Freedom if comes with two free tenets (pretty common), but Order has none. In about half of my Freedom games I end up switching Ideologies anyway. But I usually hold out until the 6 FL and SoL for 3 free tenets, so still a net gain.

Autocracy is the most fun and has a great wonder -- but I am quite terrible at dom and CV, so it does not really progress my end game. Still, I will pick Autocracy if it has two free tenets, but Freedom and Order do not. Between the strong Tier 1 happy boosts and Prora, I almost never have to switch out of Autocracy, which is good since it does not have any lasting buffs (except maybe extra stolen techs).

If the end game situation annoys you, it can only be that you are doing things wrong.

For SV, the Tier 3 pick is a free SS part plus a GS. For the Freedom Tier 3 to really be comparable, it would need to paired with 3000 gold and a GS!

For dom, the free courthouses is almost as good as the double-speed/happy courthouses from Autocracy.

Order also works great for 4 city Tradition, especially for SV with being able to faith-purchase GE for the end game.

I very much appreciated your post, I agree with everything, but especially your conclusion!

It is my third choice, but the one I end up with in more than half my games, and I agree with you that it is very strong. I disagree that it is best.

It is the specialist taking less food and causing less unhappiness that are the strongest buffs. Cities can grow very fast, and those both synergize with the SoL. It all comes together very nicely. I would encourage you to experiment with Freedom more. The Tier 3 picks are extremely strong, 2 of the 3 supporting any VC (because CS influence and Tourism are always good). With my Freedom SV, I dont usually even bother with Space Procurement since I am usually simultaneously building multiple parts at the end (but I am doing things wrong, and my SV are not fast).

You know that you lose your free tenets when changing ideology?

IronfighterXXX · Aug 5, 2015

BlackWizard said:
You know that you lose your free tenets when changing ideology?

AFAIK you always lose 2 policies (doesn't matter 'free' or not).

beetle · Aug 5, 2015

BlackWizard said:
You know that you lose your free tenets when changing ideology?

Yes. Switching ideologies is not optimal. But generally I would rather be first to Freedom and then switch, as opposed to being third to Order. But unless one can get a third tenet in Freedom, opening Freedom might just be wasting turns. And if I can stay in Freedom, all the better.

IronfighterXXX said:
AFAIK you always lose 2 policies (doesn't matter 'free' or not).

Yes, it always two ideology policies (assuming you have them). At one point, the player only ever lost free tenets -- but that was patched out quite some time ago.

One game, not too long ago, I was 3rd to open Autocracy because I had a GE on deck to bulb Prora (and had researched flight). I put the Prora pick into Rationalism or Commerce. No free tenets, but no SP lost with that little diversion.

aafritz17 · Dec 23, 2015

Resettlement seems kind of poor. I rarely want to expand by founding new cities at this point of the game, other than to secure coal or aluminum, but since this is a level two tenet it just seems to come way too late.

Think about why it's called Resettlement. It occurs to me that I've often seen city ruins where there are a number of improved tiles remaining. Drop a settler here, have an instant 4-pop city that is immediately working improved tiles. Especially if (as was said) there's a luxury or a resource for which you are desperate. Also, in some Domination games, my "desperation" was a base close to a foreign capitol (for healing, upgrading, rushing a new unit, staging units, or whatever).

True, it's pretty (very?) situational, and I would probably rank it as you did, but I reckon I wouldn't say it useless.

How balanced are the ideologies?

BlackWizard

King

IronfighterXXX

Work Hard - Play Hard

beetle

Deity

aafritz17

Escaping

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