Modern war against civilizations with lower technologic level

I have a modern army with modern helicopters, modern tanks etc. I have high walls around my cities. Those walls have no effect, so my city defense is about 25%.
The enemy civilization has musket man and cruisers. They have high walls. Their high walls are working fine, and their defense is about 110%.
When I try to attack their cities with tanks and helicopters, I see the massage that this is not possible. I have to decrease city defense below 25%.

If they attack me my walls are not working against their musket men. If I attack them their walls are working fine, and modern tanks and helicopters could not even penetrate the wall or harm anybody.
This is very unrealistic.

Please change that rule. Modern weapons should ignore the effect of walls.

Never had that happen to me in my games (so far) but that does sound a bit dumb lol.

Can you imagine, a heli blocked by a wall ...

ZorkZ said:

I have a modern army with modern helicopters, modern tanks etc. I have high walls around my cities. Those walls have no effect, so my city defense is about 25%.
The enemy civilization has musket man and cruisers. They have high walls. Their high walls are working fine, and their defense is about 110%.
When I try to attack their cities with tanks and helicopters, I see the massage that this is not possible. I have to decrease city defense below 25%.

If they attack me my walls are not working against their musket men. If I attack them their walls are working fine, and modern tanks and helicopters could not even penetrate the wall or harm anybody.
This is very unrealistic.

Please change that rule. Modern weapons should ignore the effect of walls.

Click to expand...

High Walls are obsolete once you have Rifting but they still give a defensive bonus. But that bonus is lower if they are attaced by modern units with high explosives.

They also give 25% Minimum Defense i thing TB put that tag in i'am not sure but i thing that could be the problem here. Maybe those 25% should be removed once they are obsolete?

This is something that was never quite completed. It's been wrong for a while that Rifling should negate building defenses (I thought that was actually no longer applicable but if it is it shouldn't be...) And likewise defensive buildings should not obsolete at rifling but should probably be inclusive in the building's inevitable upgrade. Therefore, neither value should be made obsolete but units that fly to move should be immune to minimum defense to enter. I'd wanted to eventually include a caviat to this: A building should have a bool that enables its min defense value to apply against flyers (for buildings like citywide electromagnetic shields.)

For now, adding an effect to enable a unit to ignore min city defense levels for entry and applying it to the flies to move effect group would be sufficient.

Additionally, it's always been intended that tanks and such with heavy wallbusting weaponry will act like rams when attacking.

So as you can see, we're simply at some awkward stages with this stuff caught in between a few projects.

@alberts2: Yes Rifling is relay not obsoleting defense bonus, but other technologies is obsoleting it. I do not know which one. Do you know it?

@Thunderbrd: "For now, adding an effect to enable a unit to ignore min city defense levels for entry and applying it to the flies to move effect group would be sufficient."

This would be good.

And maybe modern weapons could bombard city defense like artielry. It is possible the equip real tanks with bunker penetrating armament. It would be good to enable bombard promotion for tracked unit if you invent the technology of Guided missiles or staff like that.

ZorkZ said:

@Thunderbrd: "For now, adding an effect to enable a unit to ignore min city defense levels for entry and applying it to the flies to move effect group would be sufficient."

This would be good.

And maybe modern weapons could bombard city defense like artielry. It is possible the equip real tanks with bunker penetrating armament. It would be good to enable bombard promotion for tracked unit if you invent the technology of Guided missiles or staff like that.

Click to expand...

The Shrapnel Shower and Rolling Thunder promotion lines allow tanks to bombard, IIRC.

TrippedOnACloud said:

The Shrapnel Shower and Rolling Thunder promotion lines allow tanks to bombard, IIRC.

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They allow them to improve Ranged Assault and I do think they add some Bombard ability as well yes.

I wanted to find the technology which obsoleted the defense of my cities. I did not find any.

I checked my city defense when I clicked on a swordsman, and it was much more: 220-560% (depends on city). The enemy cites had approximately 350% defense, against sword men. I am not sure, but the city defense is never obsoleted.

I clicked on a unit with high explosive, my defense was about 25% (for every city) the enemy had approximately 110%. It should not be so different. I think the calculation of city defense is wrong. I suspect this is a calculation bug?!

Shrapnel Shower increase the city bombard damage by 8% according to the help. This looks good. Could you tell me what promotions are needed for Shrapnel Shower? The help not contains this information.

ZorkZ said:

I wanted to find the technology which obsoleted the defense of my cities. I did not find any.

I checked my city defense when I clicked on a swordsman, and it was much more: 220-560% (depends on city). The enemy cites had approximately 350% defense, against sword men. I am not sure, but the city defense is never obsoleted.

I clicked on a unit with high explosive, my defense was about 25% (for every city) the enemy had approximately 110%. It should not be so different. I think the calculation of city defense is wrong. I suspect this is a calculation bug?!

Shrapnel Shower increase the city bombard damage by 8% according to the help. This looks good. Could you tell me what promotions are needed for Shrapnel Shower? The help not contains this information.

Click to expand...

I'd have to check the xml to give you the answer. I'll try to remember to do that in a bit here.

There probably are some buggy stuff in transition in the defense value codes. Certainly something to address soon.