How do you try this with 3 different civs in only 2 different games?
Why does denouncing delay a DOW?
- Thread starter beetle
- Start date
How do you try this with 3 different civs in only 2 different games?
Often the best thing to do is not let your relations get so sour that it comes to that.
Although this is easier said then done, and often you can't really do much.
But if I suspect an AI is plotting against me yes scouts are the first thing you should have on your border. If I'm in a bad position I'll usually pay tribute to the Civ (usually give them a free luxury or 5 gold per turn). That's no real biggie, if they DoW then you get those items back anyway. You can also try sending a trade route but that is more risky as it takes a lot of time to build one if they do DoW.
Usually paying them to DoW on another Civ is the best option. If that doesn't work then try getting them to DoW a citystate. If they conquer a CS then that will sour their relations with other Civs particuarly if that CS is allied with another Civ. If you can ally a CS near the AIs borders that will create a second front and take some heat off for you.
Other than that the best ways to stay friendly with a Civ is to stack as many positive modifiers as you can. Give them tribute, share religion, vote their WC resolutions, liberate a worker, denounce a common Civs. Most importantly is don't forward settle them. That is always a way of saying we are going to war. If you forward settle an AI they will usually immediately shift into building armies and you will have major problems real soon.
Although this is easier said then done, and often you can't really do much.
But if I suspect an AI is plotting against me yes scouts are the first thing you should have on your border. If I'm in a bad position I'll usually pay tribute to the Civ (usually give them a free luxury or 5 gold per turn). That's no real biggie, if they DoW then you get those items back anyway. You can also try sending a trade route but that is more risky as it takes a lot of time to build one if they do DoW.
Usually paying them to DoW on another Civ is the best option. If that doesn't work then try getting them to DoW a citystate. If they conquer a CS then that will sour their relations with other Civs particuarly if that CS is allied with another Civ. If you can ally a CS near the AIs borders that will create a second front and take some heat off for you.
Other than that the best ways to stay friendly with a Civ is to stack as many positive modifiers as you can. Give them tribute, share religion, vote their WC resolutions, liberate a worker, denounce a common Civs. Most importantly is don't forward settle them. That is always a way of saying we are going to war. If you forward settle an AI they will usually immediately shift into building armies and you will have major problems real soon.
You are more clever than I, as you picked up on this pattern without reloading. But why should denouncing delay or prevent a DOW? Or is it just one of those inexplicable and arbitrary things?
Wait, what? You have better success bribing an AI to DOW after you denounce them?
Before asserting it does not work, try this against 3 different AI civs (not as 3 different civs, which would require 3 different games).
Yes, of course.
Agree, and I said as much. This is something to try when your usual war delaying tactics have failed. If this is never an issue for you, then you don't need this technique.
I have not done that much. Usually I would be too worried that they would conqueror the CS, thus just getting bigger. Usually when I bribe to DOW, it is because I don't expect my bribe recipient to be very successful.
That's a good summary of what most players already know about diplo. This reload-the-turn-before-and-denounce trick/exploit is for when your best efforts have failed you.
Grendeldef
Trancerelic & coffeeholic
Not a clue but there's some built-in mechanic as it works too often to be totally random. The minds of the devs are sometimes unexplainable but I willing to accept a logic behind it but never came to any good one. Something along the lines that once others are informed by player A that AI B is perhaps not the most trustworthy of leaders on map AI B starts looking for an a new target out of the rest which might not even met anyone else yet - maybe it's something attacking incognito as much as possible. Hardly a convincing theory but the game has lots of oddities.
Yup, the evidence is obviously anecdotal & thin at best but it seems that when AI who is not currently at war starts camping at your borders it's easier to bribe it to go elsewhere after the denouncement or to put it in other words the camper may not take any bribes at all before the denouncement but after that it will - it doesn't like it but your cash is good. This has something to do with the dilemma mentioned above. In general I wouldn't suggest denouncing anyone just to make them easier to bribe - that's unlikely to work.
What comes reloading stuff I did my fair share in vanilla while trying to learn wtf was going on as the rules didn't justify the stuff what my eyes though they saw - I occasionally even turned the combat animation on to slow things down to spot the happenings. Without combat log it's tricky enough.
One thing I learned from that is that the AI is less likely to strecth it's flexible interpretation of rules in tiles visible to the player hence I've taken in a habit of having visibility boosted scouts to just keep an eye on things and later started liking Conquistadors quite a lot.
budweiser
King of the Beers
My theory on this is that the denouncements carry a diplo penalty with them that changes the relationships between the victim of your denouncement and the rest. Once you hit the victim with the malus, they get a whole new list of enemies that they are willing to take action against because their standing vis a vis the rest has gone down.
_Dachannien
Chieftain
- Joined
- Jun 18, 2014
- Messages
- 17
One thing to check is, when you've denounced an AI player and they delay declaring war on you for several turns, do they bring up more units in the meantime? The delay could be based solely on bringing up reinforcements. This could indicate that either (a) the AI considers the denouncement to be a show of strength necessitating more units on the front lines, or (b) the designers wanted denouncements to really make the AI mad, with the response being the use of more units in the attack.
This is probably pretty tough to know for sure, because it's difficult to know whether the delay really is about the reinforcements, particularly if the additional units are freshly built after the denouncement. If they're bringing up pre-built units, that might say something about why the delay occurs.
This is probably pretty tough to know for sure, because it's difficult to know whether the delay really is about the reinforcements, particularly if the additional units are freshly built after the denouncement. If they're bringing up pre-built units, that might say something about why the delay occurs.
CivHeretic
Chieftain
- Joined
- Sep 12, 2014
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In this case you make a "friend" with Rome since they will be at war with Morocco. Thus you get to raise your diplo standing with the superior force and perhaps make the Rome AI think twice about DoWing you and they may even devote a trade route or two to you. Once you see trade routes you can start to rest easy that you won't get DoW'd before you are ready.
