[MOD] Medieval: Conquests

Kailric said:

Just wanted to ask the players of this mod what they thought about Castles and Castle building?

As it is it takes Materials, extra gold, and a long contruction time to build castles. Not to mention it upsets any Barbarians that may own the land. But you gain several benefits from building castles...

Motte and Baily
Starts with:
-Weaponsmith's House
-Armorsmith's House
-Forge
-Bailey Keep which gives a 25% bonus to Weapons, Armor, and Tools
-Workshop
-Stable
-and a Fort

Stone Keep Castles
Starts with:
-Weaponsmith's Shop
-Armorsmiths's House
-Blacksmith's Shop
-Lumbermill
-Ranch
-Stone Fortress
-Stone Keep which gives a 50% bonus to Weapons, Armor, and Tools

So, is having to construct castles in this way a feature that adds something fun and strategic to the game or is it more of a nuisance and castles should be founded like villages?

Click to expand...

I have not yet looked in details how organized the castles in your mod. Apparently different, as I guess.

Let me to express my views on various types of settlements and their development.

Turn 1. Settler unloads from the ship or reaches by land the tile with (X,Y) coordinates.
Turn 2. The settler builds a Camp where there are NO buildings except the Fire & Shelter for the rest. No free buildings at all!
Turn 3. The player decides how to develop this new settlement taking into account many parameters (available resources, strategical importance of this place, etc.)

Three ways of development of each settlement:

- Ordinary town with the usual set of buildings (as now in original CivIVCol).
- Castle (military settlement). Here is the best place with buildings for the military infrastructure (Armory, Military Academy, etc).
- Monastery (religious settlement). Here is forbidden to construct any buildings of the military infrastructure, for example.

However, each new settlement develops gradually. Every new building must build itself based on the type of settlement and available resources.

I repeat the general rules:
- no free biuldings,
- no possibility to speed up building construction for money in 1 turn.

As a special case, most probably the fourth type of settlement could be added on the coast.

- Port-city (or seaport), where all ship-building infrastucture will be concentrated. Really each ship is required at least X Wood + Y Sailcloth + Z Tar to construct, therefore all production of these materials (wood, sailcloth, tar) should be concentrated in such port-city or near this city (tar kilns could be build outside the central city tile).

This is a very general idea how the settlements should be organized. At least I develop this idea in my "1492: Global Colonization" mod.

Hey Kailric,

Loading up a new save game for you.

For some reason, the game keeps crashing at this point. I am pretty sure it is not something I am doing, but I cannot progress past this turn. Have a look and see what you can determine.

Jennvare said:

Hey Kailric,

Loading up a new save game for you.

For some reason, the game keeps crashing at this point. I am pretty sure it is not something I am doing, but I cannot progress past this turn. Have a look and see what you can determine.

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Hey, I got the save. I went straight into debug mode but didn't get a crash. I did however figure out one problem that I noticed before. The AI was having trouble with Cargo Yields like Lumber, Ore, and Stone that require more than one Cargo Space in order to load. So, I reset those values back to normal for the time being.

I uploaded the files I changed. Also, the begining music for the Middle Ages was wrong so I fixed that.

I never got a crash so I don't know if this was your problem our not. It may have been though so let me know. If not then I have one more idea we can try.

millansoft said:

Hi Kailric!

I like your mod and here you are a little collaboration, I redid the Founding Dignataries graphics I think that now is much clear, added the Porge attitude icons and remove that white line when loading the game

Hope you like the changes for your MOD.

Regards!

Click to expand...

Hey, just now seen this post. Downloading your files now and checking it out. Thanks!

Uploaded update 1.2 ready for download, it combines all the updates from 1.1c upwards.

-Lowered Education Threshold increase from 15 to 10%
if you want to lower this more adjust the EDUCATION_THRESHOLD_INCREASE tag in GlobalDefinesAlt.xml
-Increased Reseach times by 500%(x5). This can be modified on the GlobalDefinesAlt at the TK_HUMAN_RESEARCH_COST_MOD_PERCENT tag.
-Ships can now trade with Barbarian Villages. If a unit is set to "Mechanized" in the Civ4UnitInfos.xml it want be able to trade with villages.
-Rivers now add a bonus to Gold
-grapes, barley, deer now give + 1 to food
-Farms give the correct bonus to Grapes instead of wine
-for the moment Lumber, Ore, and Stone can now be transported by any cargo unit. This was causing a AI error
-added Porge attitude icons (Thanks to millansoft)
-FF screen has been adjusted so information is more visiable(also, thanks to millansoft)

Thanks to Jennvare, Dragonlord, KJ Jansson, Thonnan, Deon, Radunz, millansoft, and all the others for feedback, suggestions, and play testing.

I thought this mod was pretty cool but you guys are helping make it Super Cool

Test out the update to make sure I packed everything right. I am also uploading a new full version for download.

I adjusted the Education increase somewhat. If the game would be more fun without it and not become out of balance then we can reduce it more or remove it altogether.

Tech times have been increased alot so please give feedback on how this effects research times.

@ millansoft
Thanks for fixing up the FF and adding the Porge attitudes. I do however like haveing the different frames look so when I revisit FF to makes adjustments to stats I may also add a few more frame types but will make sure they all look good in the game. The FF was something I through together pretty quick and never went back to adjust things.

@KJ Jansson
What I am thinking on doing is adding a new "GameSpeed". In this gamespeed the player starts with "No buildings" as you suggestioned. I wanted to keep the 300 game turn to Conquest limit and to do so and keep things balanced there needs to be some free buildings. But we can decrease the game speed and make for longer games and add features as you have mentioned.

I also want to merge in your "Slavery Mod" and make it possible as the player plays the game to unlock new trading ports. For Civs that start on land this would allow them to use sailing vessels to reach these new ports. This would also give more importance to sailing vessels and at such time we could add in that sailing ships require Cloth as well.

On Castles...

I am still debating what to do here and mulling over ideas. Jennvare brought it to my attention that some times there are games when you need to "land grab" as much territory as you can like when another Nation is close to you. In this case its not practical to "build" castles as there just isn't enough time. I want to address this issue in some form or another. Anyway, if anyone has anymore ideas on this please let me know.

I also added a new Suggestions and Furture ideas section to the Second post. I'll add more to it as the ideas get compiled.

Kailric said:

@KJ Jansson
What I am thinking on doing is adding a new "GameSpeed". In this gamespeed the player starts with "No buildings" as you suggestioned. I wanted to keep the 300 game turn to Conquest limit and to do so and keep things balanced there needs to be some free buildings. But we can decrease the game speed and make for longer games and add features as you have mentioned.

Click to expand...

Yes, longer game speed is really necessary. Not everybody like very fast battle and 300 turns is too fast to my opinion.

Concerning "NO buildings" is only my style of city development. If you think that such feature is not accepted to your mod, please, do not add it. The long city development could could create additonal disbalance in the game. Especially, if you hard-coded the war after 300 turns.

Kailric said:

I also want to merge in your "Slavery Mod" and make it possible as the player plays the game to unlock new trading ports. For Civs that start on land this would allow them to use sailing vessels to reach these new ports. This would also give more importance to sailing vessels and at such time we could add in that sailing ships require Cloth as well.

Click to expand...

Good luck! All source codes of the "Slavery Mod" are included in the archive.

However, how you plan to add slaves in the mod? As YIELDS (only buy/sell) or as UNITS (can be freed, educated or used as slaves)? Both variants are historically correct. Slaves as yields could be very interesting from the financial point of view, but must have some serious penalties. Slaves as units are interesting as a cheap source of units. Maybe some combination of both variants could be a good solution? I don't know yet.

I also have one question/proposal.

How about to add a bigger size maps in your mod? NeverMind published an excelent set of 15 Earth Maps for CivIVColonization. I tested some of them and they are really very nice. Larger maps prevent too closed locations of all nations in the mod. Moreover, exact starting points for each civilization could be fixed on such maps.

KJ Jansson said:

Yes, longer game speed is really necessary. Not everybody like very fast battle and 300 turns is too fast to my opinion.

Concerning "NO buildings" is only my style of city development. If you think that such feature is not accepted to your mod, please, do not add it. The long city development could could create additonal disbalance in the game. Especially, if you hard-coded the war after 300 turns.

Click to expand...

Well, like I said we can add a whole new game speed as an option. If a person wants to play at that game speed then they can. I'd like to play that way sometime myself.

However, how you plan to add slaves in the mod? As YIELDS (only buy/sell) or as UNITS (can be freed, educated or used as slaves)? Both variants are historically correct. Slaves as yields could be very interesting from the financial point of view, but must have some serious penalties. Slaves as units are interesting as a cheap source of units. Maybe some combination of both variants could be a good solution? I don't know yet.

Click to expand...

At the moment there is a slave unit you can purchase in "Europe". The price goes up with each purchase. Slaves get heavy penalties to production but they can be educated and learn from the natives albeit at a very slow rate. I plan to add a feature where slaves food cost is reduced.

also have one question/proposal.

How about to add a bigger size maps in your mod? NeverMind published an excelent set of 15 Earth Maps for CivIVColonization. I tested some of them and they are really very nice. Larger maps prevent too closed locations of all nations in the mod. Moreover, exact starting points for each civilization could be fixed on such maps.

Click to expand...

I want to use some Earth Maps as you mention. The ones I tested need to be adjusted to have more "Europe" tiles and also the AI in my mod needs to be adjusted some as well.

I'd love to create some Scenerio maps for like how europe was during 500 CE, 1000CE, and Scenerios like the Battle of Hastings and also the Crusades. If anyone wanted to work on such Scenerios that would be most welcome.

Kailiric, about the slaves, maybe you can apply the rules I did before in AOFD, using the ViscoMod avoid them to work in the city, just the land and they consume just one food.

millansoft said:

Kailiric, about the slaves, maybe you can apply the rules I did before in AOFD, using the ViscoMod avoid them to work in the city, just the land and they consume just one food.

Click to expand...

Yeah, the ViscosMod is already in the Medieval mod. Did slaves only eat one food in AOFD? I looked into doing that for Medieval but it would take a bit of coding and testing so I haven't started on that yet.

Kailric said:

Suggestions and Future Ideas
-add Animals like wolves, bears, etc

Click to expand...

Great! Here some information for you.

Jeckel published his "JAnimals A Wild Wilderness 1.001" mod for vanilla version.

I adapted his version for patch 1.01, partically reworked and fixed some errors. 11.09.2009 I published the my last mod from the "Model" serie - "Model: Mortally Dangerous Colonization". This mod contains a lot of different mods, minimods, modcomps, etc. available on the moment of release.

Wild animals are one of the main components of "Model: Mortally Dangerous Colonization" mod. Very funny, but up to now this mod can be downloaded. I tested today. Here the direct link to download.

Here some screens:



Some land and water animals:



Possibility to activate them in the beginning:



Chaotic distribution of dangerous creatives on the map (black points on Globus):



Unfortunately, this version without source codes. However, I am ready to find them on my old HD. I never thought than somebody will be interesting in the source codes and therefore never included them in my mods of "Model" serie.

Thanks, KJ. I totally forgot about Jeckels animal mod. I seem to vaguely remember your Mortally Dangerous mod. Was there a thread for that mod as I can't seem to find one?

Yeah, if you can find the source code that would be great.

From what I read wolves and such where a threat to the peasantry. Plus, it will give some units the chance to earn combat promotions early on.

Kailric said:

Thanks, KJ. I totally forgot about Jeckels animal mod. I seem to vaguely remember your Mortally Dangerous mod. Was there a thread for that mod as I can't seem to find one?

Yeah, if you can find the source code that would be great.

From what I read wolves and such where a threat to the peasantry. Plus, it will give some units the chance to earn combat promotions early on.

Click to expand...

No, here I have no special tread for "Model: Mortally Dangerous Colonization" mod. I officially never published this mod on civfanatics.com or on www.civforum.de. Probably I only mentioned this mod in some of my posts.

Exactly in this mod I tested two moments:
1. animals as dangerous creatives, they attack colonists and kill at least (!!!!) this <cencored> treasures that free travel on continent and can discover full map.
2. spawning technique for animals could be used for the weather conditions (tornado, storms, etc., one of animals was especially exchanged on Tornado).
Moreover, this spawning technique could be used also for illnesses and diseases. This was very serious problem in medieval time.

All my mods of series "Model" was just a simple compilation of many interesting mods, modcomps in one big mod. Later I found this method of work as wrong. Too difficult to catch the error if many mods of different authors combined in one big one.

Now I prefer to make small modcomps (as "1492: GC. Resource Pack", "1492: Reefs and Weather", "1492: Slavery Market", etc.), test some interesting moments, fix possible errors and only then to combine such modcomps in one BIG SUPER-mod.

Moreover, now each modder has full rights to take and to use my modcomps in own mods. Now I include all source codes in archive.

Here source codes for "Model: Mortally Dangerous Colonization". Please, see attached file. (P.S. AFAIR it was some tricks during fine adjustment animals, some undocumented changes.)

Sorry for the lack of feedback, I was a bit busy at work here .

I am downloading your last ver. and testing it!

Also I can offer a literate russian translation if you plan to have other language support at this point.

How do I settle a monastery? My monk doesn't have an icon.

P.S. That's strange, my other monks have the icon...

Anyway, how do I trade with natives? I brought them tools they wanted in a wagon, but there's no option to do anything. Could it be a wrong settlement? And why can't I talk to a leader with my wagon?

Deon said:

How do I settle a monastery? My monk doesn't have an icon.

P.S. That's strange, my other monks have the icon...

Anyway, how do I trade with natives? I brought them tools they wanted in a wagon, but there's no option to do anything. Could it be a wrong settlement? And why can't I talk to a leader with my wagon?

Click to expand...

Which unit was it that had the Monk professions that could not found a Monastery? All monks should be able to found a monastery.

Also, Supply Wagons are not meant to operate as traders. They only work transporting domestic cargo. To trade with natives and talk to leaders you need a Peddler or build a Coastal Merchant once you have a dock. This was done as Historically villages and towns where self-sufficient at the beginning of the Dark Ages and people didn't venture out much. Then came the Peddlers that starting trading from settlement to settlement. If Supply Wagons where able to trade with natives and such there would be no need of Peddlers

And yeah, for the most part it is ready to be translated to any other language. The Inventor mod especially needs translated as a lot of the non english tags where left out. So, if you wanted to do this that would be great.

PS Who would be a good Russian leader for this time period?

Can you tell me the whole timespan of the mod (from the turn 0 to the latest tech planned)?

Also I thought slavs represent slavic villages good enough right now. It all depends on the time period.

Also, Supply Wagons are not meant to operate as traders.

Click to expand...

Ah yeah, now I see. I didn't know why would I want peddlers at all until I realised it .

I couldn't repeat the error with inability to found a monastery... Probably I was blind or something ;D.

Deon said:

Can you tell me the whole timespan of the mod (from the turn 0 to the latest tech planned)?

Also I thought slavs represent slavic villages good enough right now. It all depends on the time period.



Ah yeah, now I see. I didn't know why would I want peddlers at all until I realised it .

I couldn't repeat the error with inability to found a monastery... Probably I was blind or something ;D.

Click to expand...

Right now the timespan goes from 476 to roughly 1500. It is planned to have Gunpowder added in to the tech tree and so it will be one of the last to research.

I nominate Sviatoslav to lead the Rus.

I still think there needs to be some base (read: free) research. Civs that don't start with Monasticism can easily fall 30+ turns behind others. I usually try to get 2 monasteries up with libraries ASAP, and it still seems to take a long time to get to some of the more essential techs. Once I get everything going and have some inventors and monks, the rate seems pretty good (maybe a little too good, if I got a bunch of inventors and monks), but it's tough getting going, especially when you have to wait on monasticism.

On a related note: Islamic monks don't get a research bonus?

On settlements: While somewhat related to research, it just takes too dang long to get MaB up. What if, as I think you suggested, military units founded military settlements (Call them forts or outposts or whatever you like.) that could be improved to MaB and later Castles. Then you'd have 3 distinct settlements, each having unique buildings, each founded by different types of units. Monasteries for early research and agriculture, villages as economic manufacturing centers, and forts for military production.

What exactly is the deal with Marauders? They seem to always pop up in the same places, which is kind of boring. How is their spawning figured? Also, can they maybe not demolish settlements? Steal stuff, burn a building or two, and maybe murder an innocent citizen, but don't raze the city. That's a job for armies, not roaming marauders. Maybe when you capture them , they should be slaves, instead of outlaws, too.

Do workers "learn" professions they do long enough, like they did way back in the original Colonization? Like if you had a colonists working prime timber as a lumberjack, there was some chance every turn that he might become and expert lumberjack. I'd love to see this, especially with peddlers having the potential to become wily traders. On a similar note, do serf really need to be educated to free peasants? Can this just be bypassed so that serfs can go straight to learning a profession (just at the slower rate). It feels silly having to educate the lower classes first to peasants, when the natives can train them straight into some profession.

Finally, I've attached a save where I have been building a MaB for like 25 turns on the coast. It should complete the next turn, but all it does is remove the jungle. I tried removing the jungle first, but it still did nothing. (If you change the way castles are built it probably wont matter, but at the moment I would call it a bug.)

Kailric,

I just downloaded the new version and update. I am getting an error at startup:

Tag; Promotion_Trader

It seems to be some kind of XML error that I am getting. I've downloaded this twice and reinstalled it three times and this error keeps repeating on startup. If I hit OK, it proceeds to start up, but I get many crashes throughout every game.

Think you can give this a look?