Deity OCC Science Victory - G&K Strategy and Tips

I managed to get a Cultural Victory with Inca on T237! And this was with only about 8 RAs and pretty much without CS allies. Had only two of them for a brief time until they also got wiped out by Germans and Mongols. Eldorado on T5 helped a lot tho At first I wasn't even planning going cultural OCC but I had an amazing start, excellent growth (I had 46 pop at the end), production (those desert TFs were insane with Petra and Desert Folklore and I had Marble too.) and noticed that nobody seemed to build the cultural wonders early. Everyone was too busy warmongering. I could even have made it a few turns earlier with more careful micromanaging.

Wow, impressive! Do you mind to post initial save?

The Pilgrim said:

Wow, impressive! Do you mind to post initial save?

Click to expand...

Here's the initial save


It was quite an insane game overall. I don't think I've managed to build HG, CI, Alhambra and the Artemis in the same game in Deity before or even two of those

Just wanted to say thank you for this. I've always liked playing tall, and in many ways I felt that this locked me out of Science, but I see now otherwise. While I'm not near the times in the thread and still not brave enough to tackle Deity, this guide did help a player who's straddling the line of King/Emperor get his first Immortal win, so thanks and kudos!

I applied the principles in here to a game with Siam, and I think most of my time was due to my slow start (I got landlocked into only seeing half the civs and less than half of the CS's for the first 100-130 turns, so it made trading and such harder), but it gave a side benefit: I got delayed into Renaissance long enough that I was able to put two into Patronage, which as Siam lets you abuse the UA. I grew immensely after that (from all the Maritime CS's), never had to worry about my army (got gifted enough units to get ranked up to 3rd in soldiers) and the output from culture CS's helped bridge the difference in policy costs to still let me get Freedom done in a timely manner.

Thanks again for the guide, it was fantastic. ^_^

jeespoks said:

Here's the initial save


It was quite an insane game overall. I don't think I've managed to build HG, CI, Alhambra and the Artemis in the same game in Deity before or even two of those

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Thanks. Gonna check it once I finish off the Mayans (or they finish off me, whatever happens first ). The Inca are beasty.

I tried following this strategy on Immortal, and while I did fail (Arabia launched ahead of me on T324) it was a useful learning experience. Started as Spain, and I was quickly landlocked and missed out on meeting civs early, so I was only able to get a few RAs done. I managed to get enough of a military that no-one managed to DoW me the entire game, a first for me in OCC. I was even more surprised when first Darius then Harun both settled cities in my face and stayed neutral with me all game.

I have a feeling I'm close to being able to pull this off, but I need to sign much more RAs. I didn't get Education till T124, which seems quite late for this to work. I'll try and do this with a non sciencey civ first to ensure I'm confident enough.

I'm trying this on Immortal with 8 other Civs. It has taught me a lot.

Attempts:
1st try: I picked Continents instead of Pangea and I was the only Civ on my small island. I had to restart due to having no one to trade with.

2nd try: Incan's, I would probably try somebody else next time. Mountain, 3 sheep, 2 silver, 1 gold, 1 Cow, 2 Grassland rivers, hills, hills, more hills. Other then no great food tiles, it was a good starting location. Things went well, but I had to research archery a bit early as Mayans were getting aggressive. The trading luxuries for gold is amazing. Allowing you to buy units and give gold to AI for RAs. I'm on turn 230 and things are going well, i've made a few mistakes but i'm going to finish this game win or lose.

Things I noticed:
1. Had to grab archery a bit early in my 2nd game to deter Mayans.
2. Had a hard time filling up science buildings, acadamy's, luxuires, and keeping city growing.

Questions:
1. Do you bother with spy defense buildings?

Thanks for the guide.

actually i cant believe that people needed a guide telling them that its possible to get gold for lux - its a obvious trading option and ai sometimes even propose themself - isnt it?

tommynt said:

actually i cant believe that people needed a guide telling them that its possible to get gold for lux - its a obvious trading option and ai sometimes even propose themself - isnt it?

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What you say is true, but in a lot of games especially if you have a lot of cities you need to keep your luxuries to keep your own people happy. Also I never knew the maximum amount the AI would typically pay. So I think that selling them is a lot more feasible in a OCC game.

Also I took a year and a half off of playing Civ 5, and hadn't played Civ 4 for 2 years before Civ 5 came out.

I have news, new record post-patch.

Playing Babylon Science Victory turn 227.



Built Temple of Artemis T37 (after writing chopping forests), Hanging Gardens (T55, I beelined for it after writing), NC T65, Hagia Sophia T77 (founded religion, Fertility Rites, Tithe and Religious Community, later Sword to Ploshares and Relicary), Oracle T85 (For the GS points, Opened Patronage, with my next policy before Rationalism took Aesthetics and protected all non-mercantile CS), Tower of Pisa T130 , PT T140 with an Engineer from Pisa, T150 Sistine Chapel. Later once got Hermitage I built Kremlin and Brandenburg Gate for the GS points.

Opened Order for getting an Engineer with Faith for Hubble, later got Factory science bonus policy.

My tech Order was: Writing, Archery, Mining, Math, Philo, Theo, Civil Service, Education, Compass (Oxford Astronomy), Machinery, Printing Press, Acoustics (Stole Banking), Architecture, Economics, Scientific Theory, Industrial, Electricity, beelined to Plastics then to Rocketry and Satellites (without Chemistry nor Navigation), then Advanced Ballistics.

The last step is researching up to Computers and time Rationalism tree completion to get Robotics and Nanotech. All the upper part from Navigation was hard teched / completed with RAs / stolen (I stole only Navigation).

As you see my army was huge due to being permafriend with all Military CS from turn 100.

Babylon is the fastest Civ because GS points count 150% BEFORE other bonuses. That means that Oracle GS point is 1.5 + % modifier (with Pisa, Garden and National Epic 75% means 2.62 GS points. At the end I had +42 GS points per turn. I lost the count of how many GS I generated, I built my lab T180 and started bulbing them since then.

In the screenshot my culture rate is low because I sold Radio Tower and Museum to time Rati completion with Computers completion.

I played again that map I posted an initial save earlier, wanted to see how it'd go if I went for Science Victory. Sent spaceship on T221. This is clearly earliest post patch SV I've managed to get. Shows how crucial the starting point and the opponents are especially for OCC.

I'm gonna try Babylon next time. Sadato's T227 victory is impressive since it was done without El Dorado, GL and Petra. Babylon's UA looks handy and it would also help to prevent generating other GPs than Scientists (I popped even a one Great Merchant on that last game when I wasn't paying attention enough).

Great games guys!

I just wanted to say thank you to Sadato for this wonderful guide. I finally completed the OCC on Deity after many a tries. I got a pretty fantastic starting position with 4 wine and spices pretty close, squeezed in between lots of mountains and lots of hills. Since I was playing as Pachacuti, I attribute the victory almost fully to their terrace farms. 4-6 food, 2 production tiles pretty early in the game is nasty. I wasn't even DOW'd a single time, maybe because it would have been practically impossible for my city to be conquered, being wedged in between two mountains. Through this guide, I've learned a whole lot about Civ V and its mechanics, specifically about the timings of RA's, policies and wonders etc. Timing is REALLY important I gather.

Thanks again, Sadato!

Using the guide I was doing quite well. Aside from accidentally getting navigation early from an RA wave I didn't pre-plan.
Then Darius I SVs on turn 216 (without even building hubble)
I hit 'few more turns' and tried to renew my RA with him on 217; I could not as he already had every tech.
How do you compete with that?
I payed for every war on him I could as soon as he hit Apollo, but Mongolia and the Celts together didn't slow him in the least. In fact he took over half the Mongol empire before he won...

jeespoks said:

I played again that map I posted an initial save earlier, wanted to see how it'd go if I went for Science Victory. Sent spaceship on T221. This is clearly earliest post patch SV I've managed to get. Shows how crucial the starting point and the opponents are especially for OCC.

Click to expand...

Crazy start indeed. The only downside, Polynesia is gone already and Korea is rather pathetic.

Jigokuro said:

Using the guide I was doing quite well. Aside from accidentally getting navigation early from an RA wave I didn't pre-plan.
Then Darius I SVs on turn 216 (without even building hubble)
I hit 'few more turns' and tried to renew my RA with him on 217; I could not as he already had every tech.
How do you compete with that?
I payed for every war on him I could as soon as he hit Apollo, but Mongolia and the Celts together didn't slow him in the least. In fact he took over half the Mongol empire before he won...

Click to expand...

Are you saying he actually won on 216? Insane.

ToA + HG + Petra + mountains + desert hills + Inca rule!
Finished the game on 229. Considering only 5 of us left and China wasn't exactly friendly but trolled me with phony wars instead, it's not bad at all. Although could have been better. Korea was killed 3 turns before RA resolved. Japan died even earlier. Yet, my best OCC finish by far. AI took a nap or something. I built the Oracle on t110. Got 17 wonders in total. Was too lazy to grab the rest.

I'm getting better but still having crazy bad luck. Decided to switch to Incas as I found they have a nice balance between food and production. Started well when I got Artemis on T29, but things must have slowed down late for me. Egypt was my bane this time, launching on T226. I managed to beat France (who was the 2nd place civ) to Apollo, but not by much, so I'm feeling I'm getting much better. I did manage to get an Engineer and rush Hubble by T203, which is probably too late. One war with China this time, probably screwed me over as they ravaged my Academies primarily. I was probably on course for a T260ish win, which sounds good but the AI seems to be insane for SVs with the latest patch.

It's all been a good learning experience though. I should really make more use of paying for wars between civs to keep them all busy fighting and not building, that seems to be my downfall atm. I'll get there though.

Is there a video of this in action?

Quite a lot if mentioned about timing, particularly timing of Research Agreements (RA), and Social Policies (SP).

1) Research Agreements: I currently sign RAs as soon as it is possible to do so, which is generally as soon as a Civ decides that they want to make/accept a Declaration of Friendship. After that, I'll sign a new RA as soon as the previous one completes. Is this wrong? Should I delay an RA in order to time things better? How should I achieve this? What's the best way of tracking/timing your RAs?

2) Social Policies: Is it correct that you have to balance the amount of Culture and Science you're generating so that you reach the Renaissance Era before you complete Tradition? What options are there for managing this, and what is the best way of correcting things if they get skewed?

3) Specialists: In general how/when should they be assigned? Should you always fill all science buildings as soon as they are built, and keep them filled throughout the game? Or, are there some instances where it's better to wait, or only fill only some of the available slots?