End of Empires - N3S III

Ultra Farou Nationalist said:
A relationship is highly unfeasible, due to the radically different natures of Arkage and Faronun language- Arkage is Cuneiform, while Faronun is a system of consonants appended to a vowel line.

All civilized people are aware that the Arkage language and Seshweay languages are removed from each other. The Arkage adopted Old Seshweay norms of writing using Cuniform, which was better suited to their language (guttural and unbecoming as it is). Modern Seshweay is derived from a slightly newer, but ancient source, an alphabet of some 13 characters, which is better suited to the spelling and peculiarities of the organization of the language.

Igaen Laoreda said:
By this record, the Seshweay had not yet developed the written language for which it was later so famous. It is entirely possible that Seshweay developed their language at a later point, in tandem or influenced by the Arkage.

Incorrect. Old Seshweay was still written by the Oligarchs and the Priesthoods in the City States days, but the majority of the population had already transferred over to Traditional Seshweay which is what the text is referring to. Linguistically Traditional Seshweay is closest to today's Ti-Sesh Seshweay (and is still spoken in former-Bahra in some places). The Arkage after a time came to develop Ark Seshweay which is a dialect of Seshweay with heavy Arkage influence. Very few words of Arkage have made their way into the other dialects of Seshweay, Ti-Sesh, Siesite, Ex-Sesh, Ma-Seshm, Traditional Seshweay and Ai-Sesh. All of which corrospond to a sub-set of the Seshweay population:

Ti-Sesh - Ti-Sehorsehockyes in the South speak;
Siesite - Spoken by the inhabbitants of Sies and the Delta;
Ex-Sesh - Spoken by the Exiles;
Ma-Seshm - Spoken by the Far Exiles;
Traditional Seshweay - Spoken by a small group in Bahra;
Ai-Sesh - Spoken by the Janians and people living under the Trilui Empire.

Igaen Laoreda said:
It is noted that today, Faronun script makes use of 16 consonants and a vowel line. It is entirely possible that the use of consonants in ancient Trilui's alphabet was adopted by the scribes of early Farou, allowing our early systems to develop into a full-fledged written script. However, it remains equally possible that the consonants too were developed within Farou.

Siesite Seshweay shares many similarities with the Trilui languages, it is not unbelievable that it is the reverse, the Trilui borrowed our word for desert, and it is likely our written script as well. Given that we use the same characters, and have some similarities in structure (translating Trilui trade script is quite simple).

Igaen Laoreda said:
I will conduct further research and maintain our correspondence.

Quite. You of course understand that the Lord Aya'se promised us that the Ancestors would be found in his daughters lifetime?

In any case, the Arkage when they invaded all those years ago, occupied the sites of our cities, integrated elements of our culture, worshiped bastardized versions of the ancestors and ruled as an occupying force. They did not have writing when they came to us, nor did the Bahra who were little better than the Satarai in terms of barbarity or any others, so say the Ancestors and the records of the First Republic.

We further extend our sympathies for the loss of your capital, many of us spent some portion of our time in exile there. We shall return, when it is rebuilt and beautiful once more (or when our homeland is overrun again... whichever comes first).

Most Honorable said:
Uggor got their written characters/language from Thearak, who got theirs from the northern civilizations. So yeah, the southern peoples probably do owe a lot to the Seshweay when it comes to languages.

Quite.
 
I've decided to try and write a Uggor sentence or two:

Kij yenri swen afono emen swen jiti.

The good cow has become a good meal.

Kiji buci gor emen frego.

The four men are dead.

This is an example of the Kasud dialect of Uggor, spoken mainly in the southern areas of Krato near the capital. I plan on doing other dialects later.
 
To Gallat
From Shadyn, the Law-Giver of Evyn.

You seem to be under some delusion that you are in command of the West; perhaps this is the result of the same disorder that has lead your populace to believe in a Creator. That you would seek to force your ideals upon our populace is more than enough to provoke a thousand wars between our peoples. Heresy, no matter the source or locale, will never be tolerated within the borders of our Empire without limitations. You have no say in this issue, and if you deem this unacceptable, then let us commence with hostilities. We fear no outcome.

This issue having been dealt with, we must state our extreme displeasure with your notion of “security” for the Seadol people. This act is a blatant threat to our people and it shall not stand without competition. Unless revoked immediately, the Empire of Evyn declares war upon Seadol people and its allies.

Finally, we must stress that there is yet a chance for your peoples to escape the ravishes of war. In return for a retraction of your threat, the Evyni Empire will restrict its armies from the Seadol lands; Taudo will remain a portion of the Empire through. No quarter will be given to heretics upon the main land, and your traders will never be allowed upon our soil. However, the island of Ritya[1] will be made a haven for those that do not follow our faith, and your traders will be granted restricted processions on the island. Your missionaries, however, are not allowed within the Empire and a foot upon any portion will be punishable by death.

[1]Rityva; the main island of the archipelago; also know as Ritti.

OOC: Its generally known that the Crier, the Avaimian alphabet, is descended almost directly from the Sesh, with only minor changes resulting from its procession through Ritti and Prokym lands. The pronunciation of the characters do not correlate whatsoever, but their forms are reminiscent.
 
You're in, then :)

I'll send you a PM with some details. I've been having quite a bit of fun with Maninism in this NES, and I'm so glad it's not dead, just dormant while NK is at school.

Interesting Read.

Das, I resent the implication that I need your help in running my nation into the ground.
 
By all means, do it yourself. I don't want to invade another continent just to mess things up for you. :p
 
It worked in Bisria after we conquered it, for what's it's worth.
 
Nonsense, we'll push north in the wake of the fall of the Satar Empire and its Redeemer. It will be a blast.
 
Of course the Kratoans could just use the Duroc scripture.
 
Of course the Kratoans could just use the Duroc scripture.

I was under the impression that all southern civilizations obtained thier written languages from northern civilizations, with the exception of early Thearaki hiroglyphics. NK might be able to help us sort this all out.

Edit: I'd just like to describe the Kratoan governemnt system for a bit. There are approximetly 20 "families" (more like clans now) that are represented in the Council of Chiefs. Each family elects a male in their family to represent them in the Council of Chiefs. For new families to gain a seat at the Council of Chiefs, the Council must decide whether to give them a sot or not. Usually this is done with debates or sometimes voting. However, voting isn't really the main duty of the Chiefs. They discuss and argue, until they find solutions to problems. Represenatives can agree to withhold their resources if they disagree with a certain action or law, but this can be risky. Such protests are often ended with threats of exile and removement from the Council.

The Low Chiefs are chosen officials that are appointed by the families represented in the Council. They generally just help collect taxes, manage trade, and other jobs deemed to insignificant to the Council.

The position of War Chief is held by individuals selected by the Council to lead large armies. Usually there is just around 5 war Chiefs around at any given time. However during some times when good leadership was needed, and it was worth the risk giving individuals command over vast armies, there can be any number of War Chiefs. Once a crisis is deemed over, the War Chief can either continue his role in the military, or retire with a large sum of Ka as his payment.
 
Mhm.

Legends are legends, ofcourse, but what about holidays (private and public) and rituals (life cycle and other - such as for instance the monarch's ascension ceremony)?
There are various celebrations at the coming of the rains, celebrations of the spirits, and important Haiaoan (solar) festivals on the solstices and equinoxes. Daily rituals... well, I could write a story about that.

According to Iggy, the uplanders (the ones with the very long name) have more of a mystical tradition than the coastal-dwelling, more urbane Faronun.
Yes, the Faerouhaiaouans are much more spiritual, believing in the immediacy of the spirits and in their direct impact upon humanity. Faronun view them as being eccentric, flighty, xenophobic and irrational, although they are the speakers of the 'language of art'. The Faerouhaiaouans view the Faronun with some mild disdain, at worst considering them to be corrupt, authoritarian, and materialistic.

Ironically, most of the cultural produce of Faron comes from the Faronun- the city of Farou and was once a great cosmopolitan center and place of cultural mixing.
 
The Iralliam faith has the disadvantage that there is no accepted lingua franca to spread its texts by. Mostly as there has been no sweeping, world-unifying empire.
 
I'd just like to describe the Kratoan governemnt system for a bit. There are approximetly 20 "families" (more like clans now) that are represented in the Council of Chiefs. Each family elects a male in their family to represent them in the Council of Chiefs. For new families to gain a seat at the Council of Chiefs, the Council must decide whether to give them a sot or not. Usually this is done with debates or sometimes voting. However, voting isn't really the main duty of the Chiefs. They discuss and argue, until they find solutions to problems. Represenatives can agree to withhold their resources if they disagree with a certain action or law, but this can be risky. Such protests are often ended with threats of exile and removement from the Council.

The Low Chiefs are chosen officials that are appointed by the families represented in the Council. They generally just help collect taxes, manage trade, and other jobs deemed to insignificant to the Council.

The position of War Chief is held by individuals selected by the Council to lead large armies. Usually there is just around 5 war Chiefs around at any given time. However during some times when good leadership was needed, and it was worth the risk giving individuals command over vast armies, there can be any number of War Chiefs. Once a crisis is deemed over, the War Chief can either continue his role in the military, or retire with a large sum of Ka as his payment.

Lurker's comment: Not to provoke you or anything, but how does the state pass any laws or decisions when they usually have to agree about a subject, not vote about it? People don't usually agree about their nation, especially not spoiled aristocrats.
 
The Nahari invested heavily in their economy, and with the influx of refugees, especially from the latest in the series of wars, they were well-placed to do this. Their formerly ruined islands were repopulated with refugees, though there were some raised eyebrows at exactly how cosmopolitan this Empire was getting. In the meantime, an expedition to Leun, while not discovering any new lands, did solidify the links between the states and better survey the coastline for trading ships.

Yay for my Cosmopolitan Empire of the Nahari! :king:
 
There are various celebrations at the coming of the rains, celebrations of the spirits, and important Haiaoan (solar) festivals on the solstices and equinoxes. Daily rituals... well, I could write a story about that.

Now, see? That's what I'm talking about. Secular and religious philosophies don't really matter to most people alive as much as the rituals; even in Moti-city, a veritable bastion of Iralliam orthodoxy in some regards due to its southerner-ran theological schools, the main public event is the new year sacred elephant sacrifice to the ancestor-god of the Elephant Family, and in all due honesty this seems unlikely to go away any time soon.

So, advanced animism (i.e. spirit worship; I'm thinking of either the Iroquois or the Japanese here)?

The Iralliam faith has the disadvantage that there is no accepted lingua franca to spread its texts by.

I honestly keep forgetting what country Kal'thzar was playing in the first place was called (Duroc?), but its language should do fine for this, if not quite as well as Arabic did for Islam or Latin for Catholicism.

Mostly as there has been no sweeping, world-unifying empire.

I'm working on it.

Religion in the Sesh is going to be a mess. It's already split between Ardavan and Ancestor Worship, and the introduction of Iralliam won't simplify things.

I already promised you violence and oppression; surely that cannot fail to help? :p

Not to provoke you or anything, but how does the state pass any laws or decisions when they usually have to agree about a subject, not vote about it? People don't usually agree about their nation, especially not spoiled aristocrats.

It worked for Novgorod. And by worked I mean it eventually failed miserably and pathetically, but the boyars there sure had it good while everyone else was too weak to harm them. Poland-Lithuania did have voting and also the liberum veto, which is pretty awesome in that if you and you alone do not agree with the decisions (and are a member of the Sejm), you can just put your foot down and keep everyone from getting any work done out of sheer spite. It went well. Also: the British Cabinet, though that required giving the Prime Minister more and more power to force through a consensus.

Consensual oligarchy is a pretty awful way of actually running a state, but can be a very nice political compromise, and as long as there are some recognised common interests it is possible to make it work, if squeakily.
 
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