What does everybody think about unrestricted leaders?

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yturk39 said:
Maybe Cyrus of Zululand.

REXing Settlers (Imperialistic) with Ikhandas (Unique Building) would allow you to grab a lot of good land early without feeling the financial pinch.

Add Charismatic to the mix and you can get away with leaving some of these settlements ungarrisoned (and let them grow comparatively large) if you're careful about fogbusting.

Impis and their Mobility promotion also make for very pretty good rear defenders, running between cities that need a unit to keep them happy while the bulk of your force is bringing the fight to your rival.
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I was thinking of the AI. The thing that makes Shaka so dangerous with the Zulu is his "personality". Although he's Aggressive (normally a weaker trait) his tendencies make him a strong leader. He extremely warlike but doesn't seem to have the insanity of somebody like Monty.

Zulu are actually a pretty good Civ. Extremely good UB and the UU has some interesting uses - terrific supermedic and pillager. Shaka does fit the Zulu quite well - Aggressive works well as a trait with the Zulu.

For the human, Cyrus is a good leader. He's OK for the AI.

Maybe I should try Unrestricted Leaders while choosing the other Civs. If you make yours random it might be interesting, although Toku of America or Germany is frighteningly bad, whether human or AI. Might actually make an interesting thread - worst Unrestricted Leader Combo.
 
For more than 3 years, I play with unrestricted leaders, and I play with 12 AIs! For the first couple of games, it's a bit disorieating, but you brain will get used to it fast enough. When you play UL, you will realise that civilization traits means little for AI. If your neighbor is sitting bull of rome, he will build more archer than Legions. Now I hardly notice an AI leader's civilization unless it's Mali, which I will think twice before sending my axeman; or Arab, which mean harder to compete for culture.

All in all, unrestricted leaders are loads more fun, there are more uncertainty and excitement when you start a game.
 
I love it - makes the game so much more random and flexible. And fun. It can go from heavily in your favour to heavily against you - and that's the luck of the draw

Being placed next to Monty or Shaka of Rome is enough to make any player quake in their boots LOL :)
 
I think the leader's personalities effect how they govern their civs so much more than their unique buildings, units and starting techs. Shaka is not going to forgo barracks just because he no longer gets the 20% maintenance reduction. Gandhi is not going to launch an all out chariot attack just because he has war chariots.
 
civvver said:
I think the leader's personalities effect how they govern their civs so much more than their unique buildings, units and starting techs. Shaka is not going to forgo barracks just because he no longer gets the 20% maintenance reduction. Gandhi is not going to launch an all out chariot attack just because he has war chariots.
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And that's why we don't play against Qin Shi of India. :eek:

REXing and Fast Workers... Yeesh.
 
civvver said:
I think the leader's personalities effect how they govern their civs so much more than their unique buildings, units and starting techs. Shaka is not going to forgo barracks just because he no longer gets the 20% maintenance reduction. Gandhi is not going to launch an all out chariot attack just because he has war chariots.
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True. Leader personality is by far the most important factor. Shaka will build barracks because he's a warmonger. In fact, I'm not sure how much the AI plans around it's UB, UU or traits. I don't remember seeing JC or Rome prioritizing Iron Working that much - he certainly doesn't beeline it. This actually weakens several leaders playing unrestricted because their personalities often fit their traits. 5 of the 6 psychos are from Aggressive Civs, but has been noted they'll be a warmonger no matter who they lead.

Toku will hamstring any Civ he's a leader of. The biggest reason he's a backwards idiot in 90% of the games isn't because of his weak traits, it's because of his isolationism and slow expansion.
 
Shaka or Ragnar of Rome is a nightmare and one of the scariest things you will see with unrestricted leaders. If they are near you, turtle up fast.
 
thecaesar said:
And that's why we don't play against Qin Shi of India. :eek:

REXing and Fast Workers... Yeesh.
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Qin? Rexing?
Have you ever heard of Joao II of Portugal? :p
 
AJ11 said:
Joao is a rat. One of the really bad personalities. To be honest, you can easily neutralise him by making everyone else hate him. His main threat has always been him mobilising others against you.
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Really? In my opinion he is one of the best AIs, as in one of the AIs which may become a threat. Saladin, for example, is a good AI, but almost never gets close to victory. Joao might be cramped 1/2 of the time, but the other times he just REXes and gets a booming economy later on in the game.
And 'making everyone else hate him' is quite hard in most situations.
 
strijder20 said:
Really? In my opinion he is one of the best AIs, as in one of the AIs which may become a threat. Saladin, for example, is a good AI, but almost never gets close to victory. Joao might be cramped 1/2 of the time, but the other times he just REXes and gets a booming economy later on in the game.
And 'making everyone else hate him' is quite hard in most situations.
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He is always a threat because he likes to get others to fight his wars for him. Fighting him is fighting 3-6 civs at the same time because he always calls people in. And, from experience, he has a high backstab threshold, as in he will backstab you at the drop of a hat. The only one worse than him is Cathy, and she is hardcoded to be the ultimate backstabber.

Preempt his ratasshattery by asking another civ to declare on him early and often. If you have Cathy nearby, she will always declare if you give her enough incentive.

Otherwise, point every warmonger you can his way. Monty, Ghengis, Shaka, Ragnar, Alex, Julius. Get them to attack him.

Even if he survives, his relations with them will be so low that none of them will help him over you later, and you all get the "mutual enemy" bonus with each other, which means that later dogpiles are easier to organise against him and harder against you. Never allow Joao to boom or you are in for it.
 
UL sounds interesting. I'll try it on my next game.
 
I don't like it at ALL. For me, it's a roleplaying thing. I don't want the United States of America ruled by Julius Caesar, and I don't want the Vikings ruled by Queen Elizabeth.
 
While this feature may be fun online, as it brings about more depth and strategy. I have to say I can't bring myself to play with this on often offline. Since it gives a considerable advantage to the human player, if they choose their leader and civ, second because human players can adapt no matter their civ/leader combination.

The AI I don't think adapts to their combo so they will be harming themselves more often than not. If playing against the AI it's better imo to play against standard civ/leaders for better competition, unless deliberately picking all the civ/leader combos for the AI as well. But then that would remove some of the mystery of the games.
 
I know people on the forum don't like it when old threads are resurrected, but seeing as how someone has already done it, I'll post a reply. Just starting a new game UL. First UL game, chose to select Toku of Sumeria. Wish me luck!
 
Moderator Action: Please don't resurrect old threads. If you want to discuss the same issue, make a new thread (and possibly link to the old one). Thanks!
 
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