Yelü Chucai's surprising ascent

Well, I can see the position that pigswill favours, but I think the other's got merit too.

Bombers are vulnerable as per the 'scissors-paper-rock' theory that is Civ4 (e.g. Knights beat Crossbows - Crossbows beat Pikes - Pikes beat Knights) in that SAMs and Fighters do have good shots at Bomber interception, but Bombers can deliver big collateral damage to stacks in cities from a reasonably safe distance, and if the AI tries the 2-only stack attack, they get 'owned' by Bombers before they even get close. There's always some chance that Bombers will get injured and need healing rather than shot down. I'm aware that there was quite some criticism of the cost-benefit of Bombers under the Warlords expansion rules - so if everyone would prefer to avoid them and go with Gunships, Artillery, and Gunpowder units, then that's OK.

Personally, I'm no Nostradamus, but if we can get Flight, Radio, and Industrialism, I'd suspect that's all we'd need. Even then, that might be overkill in the view of some, but I think that those three tech's should do it.

Best of luck.

Fair enough, if you want tech parity/superiority for added insurance then go for it, I'm not sure its necessary but maybe I'm being overconfident.

Sorry, I had some real bad news yesterday, actually thought about quitting the game, but decided to throw in my TS. I have lost my notes, but the general PP seems quite clear:

Diplo: continue war with Cyrus conquering Susa, then cap him, heal units, move them towards Peter. Any suggestions of the direction of the assault? I am not a great warmonger, so any tips and hints would be welcome. Otherwise, if I don't get a clue where Peter's stack is, I'd go after Moscow.
I haven't been in a situation where I cap somebody who's in war: does it mean we get automajically into war with WK? I'll move some boats, just in case.

Techs: finish Flight, go Radio (Cyrus already has Industrialism, btw, so I kind of hope to get it from him. Won't it be better to continue war - going over to the West - till he offers it in the deal? A variant is taking his island city as well, and WK's nearby as well...

Civics: Police State looks tempting, but after teching the Flight-Radio-Industrialism trio, as suggested (maybe it won't hurt to switch to other military-supporting civics as well?!

Wonders: I'd get the Rushmore in the capital city after finishing the factory : good hammers. The alternatives seem Turfan and Pusan. I also thought that the Globe might be of interest when one considers the high unhappiness around: I think we can have one more national wonder in Cimmerian...

Great General: Military Academy in Beshbalik.

Production: I'd build the infrastructure where already started, so that to have the base for air units.

I am sure I won't be able to start my TS this evening, so there is some more time to share insights, if you feel like it.

Are we willing to spend a potential Great Engineer on finishing Rushmore? I wouldn't.

Sorry, guys!

I really can't get myself to play. Would it be too much if I request a pass? I hope can join you later, once I get used to the situation...

I'm sorry that you've had bad news.

First rule of Civ: Real Life is more important.

Come back when you're ready either to comment or play.

FiveRings, likewise, sorry to hear of your troubles. I hope whatever they are can be resolved or if not that you can come to terms with them.

pigswilll, are you OK to take 'the wheel' on this one? I guess you can start handing back those cities!

Danger. Pig at the wheel!

Got it.

I'm back to KISS. We have the army now to stomp Peter so why delay?

Roll the dice bigfella!

That was.... interesting.

Read on.

Thanks Pigswill.

According to the roster, I am up but I am going away for the weekend and will only be able to play on Monday if the roster is happy to wait for me.

Looking at the save, I think sending the GM to St Petersburg (4t) for a trade mission is probably the best idea so we can update all our outdated units that are still floating about. The lighthouse in Visigoth needs to be rebuilt because the city is starving.

Switching to Nationhood for the draft seems logical considering the transports by the NE shores. I round of drafting would probably help a lot!

We have three options for rapid production:
i) Drafting. Means losing vassalage and we can only get infantry (3pop?), we get happy boost from rax but hell-no misery.
ii) Slavery. Means losing emancipation so temporary unhappy until we swop back. However we can whip anything, keeps vassalage and whips get boosted by factories and PS.
iii) Cash rush through US. We lose PS so more WW but again its fairly flexible though possibly less immediately productive.

We can also have any combination of the above. My preference would be just slavery to keep PS and vassalage.

Thanks for the turnset pigswill.

Unless I'm horribly mistaken, our Great Merchant will die if he tries to conduct a trade mission into St. Petersburg! I'd consider Susa.

I'm fairly relaxed on the civic options at this stage. I'm fine with what we've got, but if any change I'm also thinking Nationhood has merit. I'm not vehemently opposed to Slavery, but with the whole world in Emancipation, it'll hurt.

There's an interesting deal with China possible ... Qin Shi Huang will DoW Peter-Asoka for Flight. Just a thought that maybe has merit, or maybe not.

Hi guys. I am back after my weekend away and this is my official "Got it". Will post PPP shortly.

So, a PPP of sorts:

I like the QSH bribe.
Switch to slavery for more military and to whip away anger.
Take Yaroslav'l, then Novgorod.
I don't know how the mechanics work for Trade missions but since Persepolis has wonders and stuff shouldn't my trade mission occur there? Use those monies for upgrading legacy units.

That's really about it. Should I leave the mines as they stand or should they be converted into windmills? Workers will keep building rails. I also think it may be worth whipping out some semblance of a navy where possible.

So, a PPP of sorts:

I like the QSH bribe.
Switch to slavery for more military and to whip away anger.
Take Yaroslav'l, then Novgorod.
I don't know how the mechanics work for Trade missions but since Persepolis has wonders and stuff shouldn't my trade mission occur there? Use those monies for upgrading legacy units.

That's really about it. Should I leave the mines as they stand or should they be converted into windmills? Workers will keep building rails. I also think it may be worth whipping out some semblance of a navy where possible.

I'm not sure one way or the other on the Qin Shi Huang bribe. If you like it, then proceed.

My understanding is that trade missions reward distance from our capital, the size of the destination city, and whether the city has the Temple of Artemis (which isn't possible for us while we're at war with its owner). I agree that we should probably use the for upgrading units with already decent XP and can perform a useful role, but I wouldn't mind having some to direct to for Industrialism either.

I can't generalise about Mines versus Windmills. It's city dependent.

On whipping, I'd be careful with Karakorum, Beshbalik, and Cimmerian. I'm OK to slip in a Theatre in some cities where needed and put some into prior to getting Mount Rushmore up. No objections from me to getting out some units to combat the Russian boats.

Best of luck.

Sounds like a fine plan to me. Bribing Qin will get us some mutual military, maybe ask him to attack Asoka instead of Peter. The only potential downside is that if Qin's more succesful than we are Peter could end up capitulating to the wrong person.

I will very likely only be in slavery for 5 turns before switching back. I simply want to whip away anger.

The turnset in words and pictures:





End of turn two I demand 60 from WK.

Also, midway through 1850 I remembered to send my merchant on a TM. In the IBT's there were many attempts at regaining Calcutta which were rebuffed at mild few losses. Reinforcements are on the way and some stacks are healing up.

After only 3 turns:



Peters' power has taken a serious nose dive. Mt Rushmore was rushed (whipped). We also get a Great Engineer. He is snoozing.





We are pretty close to victory and some closing screens of the cities we took and how far we are from winning:






I made one or two silly little moves but at this stage I guess it doesn't matter.

... and with that philosophical gem from Ozzy Osbourne, Yelu Chucai and Peter find that peace is indeed the way.





The empire rejoices and gets seriously bumped!