How do you turn off Fountain of Youth and El Dorado?

hello everyone!

Is it possible to turn off the natural wonders Fountain of Youth and El Dorado?

I find them to be very overpowered and would like to make sure they are turned off, especially in a multiplayer game.

If I uncheck 'Wonders of the Ancient world' expansion would that disable these natural wonders? What does the Wonders of the Ancient world expansion encompass?

thanks!

You can't do anything against it. They initially came with the Inca/Spain Scenario but were then added to the base game.

Wonders of the Ancient World adds a bunch of Ancient/Classical Era Wonders (to build in your cities), no Natural Wonders.

King Solomons Mines, Lake Victoria and Great Barrier Reef are just as overpowered.

Maybe (don't know much about MP) you can play a map you created on your own where you know for sure these NWs aren't on... but I guess then you'd already know all the map layout. Also maybe someone can create a map script that prevents these NWs to spawn?

If there were a way to disable them, someone would have come up with it in the 2+ years since they infected the base game.

LV isn't that good unless supported by decent dirt, and GBR is only insane in the hands of Spain. Kilimanjaro IS absurd, especially in MP where it permits otherwise impossible surprise attacks. Uluru is also extremely strong.

In general, the NWs were a poor design decision. I'd prefer to see more richly nuanced terrain without the 'I-win' spawns. That's plagued Civ design since the beginning, but the stronger Natural Wonders certainly exacerbate the problem.

I want to know how to turn them off, not because they're too strong, but because they're not real!!!! I'm disappointed with Firaxis for adding stuff that isn't real to the game, and even more disappointed because of XCOM squads. Not only are they not real, but they're pretty much just an advertisement to another game... Really???

Js_9001 said:

I want to know how to turn them off, not because they're too strong, but because they're not real!!!! I'm disappointed with Firaxis for adding stuff that isn't real to the game, and even more disappointed because of XCOM squads. Not only are they not real, but they're pretty much just an advertisement to another game... Really???

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There is mods that disable xcom squad and giant death robot, but that's perhaps not your point here, is it?

(Called "Units - No Futuristic Units", can be found in the steam workshop).

I actually don't feel that the Natural Wonders are that strong. (With of course, the exception of Spain)

I find that Natural Wonders tend to have the strongest effects early game. They don't need to be improved, which is good when you're still expanding and short on workers. They're also stronger than normal bonus tiles before things like Granary, Stables, Chemistry...etc kick in. They're also the only way early game for a civilization to gain faith/culture early game besides buildings.

But herein also lie their fault: most of them don't have food attached to them. Early game is very focused on growth, and when you have to dedicate a citizen to, say, a Mt. Sinai, you'll probably be growing very slowly or have to dedicate the time to hammer out a caravan to support that city. This, compounded with the fact that in my experience NWs tend to spawn next to very crappy estates, often make the decision whether to settle their a battle in itself.

Atinuviel said:

I actually don't feel that the Natural Wonders are that strong. (With of course, the exception of Spain)

I find that Natural Wonders tend to have the strongest effects early game. They don't need to be improved, which is good when you're still expanding and short on workers. They're also stronger than normal bonus tiles before things like Granary, Stables, Chemistry...etc kick in. They're also the only way early game for a civilization to gain faith/culture early game besides buildings.

But herein also lie their fault: most of them don't have food attached to them. Early game is very focused on growth, and when you have to dedicate a citizen to, say, a Mt. Sinai, you'll probably be growing very slowly or have to dedicate the time to hammer out a caravan to support that city. This, compounded with the fact that in my experience NWs tend to spawn next to very crappy estates, often make the decision whether to settle their a battle in itself.

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I think the real problem is the most OP natural wonders are the ones that give their bonuses just for finding/getting near them. Uluru and Sri Pata are the only wonders I would consider "insane" just from working them(Because as you said they give that important Food AND Faith). But El D, FOY, and Kilimanjaro don't even need to be worked and only FOY needs to be in your borders.

Killa-Man-Jaro also has 2 , with the , and the insane unit promotion. i love this OP Natural Wonder

usually i run across Sinai in the middle of totally barren Desert and unsettlable. it's almost nice if the really OP Natural Wonder are in AI territory that makes them harder for you to win.

El Dorado is only overpowered if you find it first. But yeah. Then it's basically the same as starting with a second settler.

You have to modify the XML of the base game and re-modify it each time the game is updated. The other option is to play with a mod that does the same thing, but then you won't get your achievements, hall of fame saves, etc.

You need to change the <NaturalWonder> tag to false in the Civ5Features.xml for <Type>FEATURE_FOUNTAIN_YOUTH</Type> and <Type>FEATURE_EL_DORADO</Type> and they won't spawn. I've also removed the free promotion associated with Kilimanjaro.

Dark_Jedi06 said:

You have to modify the XML of the base game and re-modify it each time the game is updated. The other option is to play with a mod that does the same thing, but then you won't get your achievements, hall of fame saves, etc.

You need to change the <NaturalWonder> tag to false in the Civ5Features.xml for <Type>FEATURE_FOUNTAIN_YOUTH</Type> and <Type>FEATURE_EL_DORADO</Type> and they won't spawn. I've also removed the free promotion associated with Kilimanjaro.

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Thanks for the info! I will try this out in my next multiplayer game with friends!

There are 2 coral reef natural wonders in the game while in reality there is only 1 in the world.

I like Fuji the best. It gives me everything, gold, culture, faith, looks pretty. Sri Pada is great too.

FeiLing said:

You can't do anything against it. They initially came with the Inca/Spain Scenario but were then added to the base game.

Wonders of the Ancient World adds a bunch of Ancient/Classical Era Wonders (to build in your cities), no Natural Wonders.

King Solomons Mines, Lake Victoria and Great Barrier Reef are just as overpowered.

Maybe (don't know much about MP) you can play a map you created on your own where you know for sure these NWs aren't on... but I guess then you'd already know all the map layout. Also maybe someone can create a map script that prevents these NWs to spawn?

Click to expand...

GBR isn't close to being as strong as any of these; if you can secure Krakatoa (which is rare because it's not often well-placed) you get more of a science boost from half as many workers, and Krakatoa is strong but not overpowered.

Though the rest are almost certainly overpowered, neither Solomon nor El Dorado is quite as strong as the other two. Because NW value is very closely tied to their utility in the early game, even Fountain of Youth is somewhat weaker than Victoria (no one needs 10 happiness in the earliest game or gains a lot from it). However, I think Victoria and Solomon (and Kilamanjaro) are still linked to BNW, so you can disable them by disabling the expansion.

EDIT: Also a point I just noted on the other NW thread - KSM is the one NW that is probably most dependent on the identity of surrounding tiles. 5 gold, 5 science, 5 culture, 6 faith ... these all add to a global pool and as such are valuable in their own right. 6 food is, well, 6 food. But production only affects the city where it's worked, and 6 production by itself isn't all that valuable even at the earliest game stages - if you don't have KSM anywhere near an area that's already good for production specifically, it's not very useful (sure, you need tiles near Victoria to make it useful, as noted, but this is true of any food-producing tile. You can still do much more with excess food than with production). So in practical terms Solomon can't be really considered one of the strongest NWs, even if it is in terms of its tile output in the abstract.

LV isn't that good unless supported by decent dirt, and GBR is only insane in the hands of Spain. Kilimanjaro IS absurd, especially in MP where it permits otherwise impossible surprise attacks. Uluru is also extremely strong.

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Yes, Uluru is very often underrated, but as a tile you can work immediately (because it produces food), which gives a very substantial about of faith, and which is exceptional at the game's start by guaranteeing a pantheon very quickly, it is one of the strongest if you find it. Its utility does decline a lot more quickly than some NWs, though.

In general, the NWs were a poor design decision. I'd prefer to see more richly nuanced terrain without the 'I-win' spawns. That's plagued Civ design since the beginning, but the stronger Natural Wonders certainly exacerbate the problem.

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I consider it simply a balancing issue; the idea of Natural Wonders, both as a reward for exploration (the most entertaining game stage in my view) and as representations of recognisable real-world features that add graphical variety, is great. The implementation is however very far from balanced; this isn't an issue in single-player particularly, but Civ V should do something akin to Sins of a Solar Empire and have a series of maps balanced for multiplayer, which exclude NWs altogether (as that game does with its equivalent exploration reward, artefacts). Of course this would require a change to Spain's UA, but that's a poorly-designed UA as it stands.

I want to know how to turn them off, not because they're too strong, but because they're not real!!!!

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Ditto King Solomon's Mines - and none of these three would be 'natural' in any sense if they did exist (a city, a marble fountain and a mine). I'm not a fan of that, but as said balance-wise they're no worse than the stronger real-world NWs. Thematically it also grates that (even though it's since been added to the main game) the Fountain of Youth - which is a myth tied to Prester John, a legend associated originally with Asia and later with Ethiopia - was introduced in a scenario set in the Americas.

I think the real problem is the most OP natural wonders are the ones that give their bonuses just for finding/getting near them. Uluru and Sri Pata are the only wonders I would consider "insane" just from working them(Because as you said they give that important Food AND Faith). But El D, FOY, and Kilimanjaro don't even need to be worked and only FOY needs to be in your borders.

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Not Victoria? Really? It's for precisely the same reason that Victoria is by some way the strongest NW. GBR also allows you to generate food, but has somewhat low tile output per tile and needs two citizens to work it - in which case working a food tile and a non-food producing NW is often as effective. Sri Prada is just Uluru but a little weaker - Gibraltar is a strong NW for its food bonus as well, and I'd rate it above SP (early game faith is great if you can get it but not essential, early gold in quantity is always very valuable).

There's also rarity to factor in - even if we allowed that Fountain of Youth and El Dorado, say, were as strong as Victoria in the absolute, they aren't as common (FoY is very rare in my games - I've run across it maybe 3 times in over 500 hours). Of the strong NWs, Uluru seems to be by some way the commonest in my experience, and the one most often well-placed to settle.