Which tech do you oracle?

Which techs do you oracle?

  • Metal Casting

    Votes: 66 49.6%
  • Hereditary Rule

    Votes: 14 10.5%
  • Theology

    Votes: 20 15.0%
  • Civil Service

    Votes: 22 16.5%
  • Horseback Riding

    Votes: 1 0.8%
  • Alphabet

    Votes: 6 4.5%
  • Mathematics

    Votes: 6 4.5%
  • Aesthetics

    Votes: 5 3.8%
  • Code of Laws

    Votes: 65 48.9%
  • Iron Working

    Votes: 3 2.3%
  • Compass

    Votes: 2 1.5%

  • Total voters
    133
Actually going on the offensive with LB's isn't very reliable(on higher difficulties Oracle is hard to get and still get feudalism without gold) and according to post #24 on this thread, LB's are less effective than swords for attacking cities, and IW is far easier to Oracle.
 
Code of Laws every time. As a Spiritual leader, the religion is very useful, and COL is a great tech for trading, plus to get courthouses for the economy.
 
Nah, I can bundle it in a trade for MC. Religion is more important, especially if I am on an island.:)

Just to play devils advocate , I could see now cheap Colossus after cheap forge would also be excellent on an island . Sure you can trade for MC but not usually until it is built . And Ramesses is tailor made for a theocracy bulb to grab a religion . I just figured for Ramesses , MC would sometimes have to be a good option .
 
Just to play devils advocate , I could see now cheap Colossus after cheap forge would also be excellent on an island . Sure you can trade for MC but not usually until it is built . And Ramesses is tailor made for a theocracy bulb to grab a religion . I just figured for Ramesses , MC would sometimes have to be a good option .

Who says I don't bulb Theology? I frequently save a Great Prophet to do that not long after reaching COL. Unless I have a lot of jungle around Thebes, I normally don't tech Ironworking early (I trade for it), so I would not usually even have MC as a choice with Oracle.:)
 
Minor point . MC needs bronze , not iron working . I'm really just putting out some circumstance where MC would be a good choice for Ramesses as you mentioned you always take CoL.An island start screams for Colossus , maybe even more if you need to get the he'll off it in which case you will need machinery for optics.. But it's a tough one cause no doubt Ramesses screams for founding lots of religions too . Makes me realize how fun of a leader he is to play , there are heaps of cool things to do with him.
 
Minor point . MC needs bronze , not iron working . I'm really just putting out some circumstance where MC would be a good choice for Ramesses as you mentioned you always take CoL.An island start screams for Colossus , maybe even more if you need to get the he'll off it in which case you will need machinery for optics.. But it's a tough one cause no doubt Ramesses screams for founding lots of religions too . Makes me realize how fun of a leader he is to play , there are heaps of cool things to do with him.

Right, I forgot it is Pottery,not IW, that you need for MC. I really don't need to be first civ to discover MC in order to build Colossus. If I have Organized Religion + my Industrious bonus, I don't usually lose many wonder-building races unless I get a late start. Colossus and Lighthouse are very nice on island games especially.:)
 
I dont see how CoL instead of MC makes any sense if you are playing an IND leader.

Courthouses are important, but you can tech CoL faster than you can tech MC, and early Forges are always good to have, even better for IND leaders.
 
You only get one shot at founding Confucianism. MC will still be there, and I usually get it soon after COL by trading for it. Being IND, I can often still be first to build the Colossus even when I am not first to discovery MC. I think it comes down to your game plan, leader traits, map, opponents, and such.
 
You only get one shot at founding Confucianism. MC will still be there, and I usually get it soon after COL by trading for it. Being IND, I can often still be first to build the Colossus even when I am not first to discovery MC. I think it comes down to your game plan, leader traits, map, opponents, and such.

I dont see how CoL instead of MC makes any sense if you are playing an IND leader.

Courthouses are important, but you can tech CoL faster than you can tech MC, and early Forges are always good to have, even better for IND leaders.

To completely rule out COL makes no sense . A classic example would be having nut job neighbors and no religions have been found on your island . The diplo benefits alone trump the half price forges .

Ramessess , you say it comes down to game plan , map opponents etc but you posted that you always take CoL . This seems just as inflexible .
 
Ramessess , you say it comes down to game plan , map opponents etc but you posted that you always take CoL . This seems just as inflexible .

I only say that because of my peculiar style of play. For most other players, I can imagine scenarios where MC is better than COL. In fact, I only go for Oracle in order to found Conf. in my Cultural Victory strategy -- the only victory condition I ever go for (inflexible there, too!).:D
 
I only say that because of my peculiar style of play. For most other players, I can imagine scenarios where MC is better than COL. In fact, I only go for Oracle in order to found Conf. in my Cultural Victory strategy -- the only victory condition I ever go for (inflexible there, too!).:D

Actually no . Makes perfect sense under those conditions . I could see no circumstance where CoL would not be the correct choice if going for culture , and playing the game the way you want to play it isn't inflexible .
 
I got the Oralce>Confucianism tip from my guru TMIT. It is a great move for Spiritualist who have not founded one of the two early religions, especially if you are going for Cultural Victory. I believe TMIT also trades for MC more than manually teching it. He says it takes a lot of beakers that early in the game. Once I get COL, I can bundle it in a trade for MC even at the high difficulty levels. I would bet that TMIT would also choose Monarchy more than MC with Oracle (he loves Monarchy).
 
Oracle > Confucianism is very good for non IND and Cultural Victory, I didnt mean to say that it never makes sence to take CoL.

But for IND you are giving up on a quick +25% production per city. Its also very easy to use a great scientist to bulb Philosophy for Taoism if you need a mid game religion.

But the thing is when you mention high difficulty levels, are you reffering to emperor and below, or immortal+? Because on the latter the AI builds the Oracle extremely fast and it isnt a reliable wonder.
 
Oracle > Confucianism is very good for non IND and Cultural Victory, I didnt mean to say that it never makes sence to take CoL.

But for IND you are giving up on a quick +25% production per city. Its also very easy to use a great scientist to bulb Philosophy for Taoism if you need a mid game religion.

But the thing is when you mention high difficulty levels, are you reffering to emperor and below, or immortal+? Because on the latter the AI builds the Oracle extremely fast and it isnt a reliable wonder.

I can get Oracle at Immortal if I beeline to COL. Done it many times. No guarantee, but certainly doable, and easier than discovering Phil. As I said, I can usually pick up MC by trade soon after COL, so the production bonus delay isn't that long. For Cultural Victory, you just need to have your forges ready in time to build all the Temples, Monasteries, and Cathedrals.
 
I can get Oracle at Immortal if I beeline to COL.

Yet your guru TMIT would tell you that this is highly unreliable if not even impossible :D

What date do you manage to build the Oracle on Immortal? I'm going to have to try this. Do you need both IND + Marble, or will either one work?

I just pulled off the Oracle on 5 random Immortal games in a row with Hatsy and no marble, just making sure I had a single gold / gems or silver to help me tech -

Tech order:

Mining > Mysticism > Meditation > Priesthood > Writing > Free CoL

Build order:

Worker > Warrior > Obelisk > Oracle > Library > Settlers

I like it very much, and lots of Great Prophets will be made :D
 
Yet your guru TMIT would tell you that this is highly unreliable if not even impossible :D

What date do you manage to build the Oracle on Immortal? I'm going to have to try this. Do you need both IND + Marble, or will either one work?

I just pulled off the Oracle on 5 random Immortal games in a row with Hatsy and no marble, just making sure I had a single gold / gems or silver to help me tech -

Tech order:

Mining > Mysticism > Meditation > Priesthood > Writing > Free CoL

Build order:

Worker > Warrior > Obelisk > Oracle > Library > Settlers

I like it very much, and lots of Great Prophets will be made :D

I attached a game I just started to prove the point. It is at Immortal level and built Oracle>Confucianism in 1880 BC without Marble
 

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  • Confucianism BC-1880.CivWarlordsSave
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I believe you, I played a random Immortal fractal map as Hatsy and went with the first map that gave me a marble to settle on. I didnt even research Masonry before building the Oracle so dont think the bonus applied. I founded Confucianism with the Oracle, and used my first Great Prophet to bulb Theocracy, I actually managed to build Stonehenge > Oracle > AP.

Also I had both Saladin and Isabella on my Island! Isabella founded Budhism and Saladin Hinduism and they spread it to me in no time. I had a cramped rather food poor location with just space for 4 cramped cities, but with SPI religion swapping to keep both Saladin and Izzy happy, they are peaceful towards me and leaving me alone, giving me an easy culture game with with 4 religions on a terrible start location.
 
I believe you, I played a random Immortal fractal map as Hatsy and went with the first map that gave me a marble to settle on. I didnt even research Masonry before building the Oracle so dont think the bonus applied. I founded Confucianism with the Oracle, and used my first Great Prophet to bulb Theocracy, I actually managed to build Stonehenge > Oracle > AP.

Also I had both Saladin and Isabella on my Island! Isabella founded Budhism and Saladin Hinduism and they spread it to me in no time. I had a cramped rather food poor location with just space for 4 cramped cities, but with SPI religion swapping to keep both Saladin and Izzy happy, they are peaceful towards me and leaving me alone, giving me an easy culture game with with 4 religions on a terrible start location.

Yep, my game went along the same line -- I built Stonehenge, Oracle, Pyramids, and Great Library. Ramesses with early religion is a wonder-building machine.:D
 
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