Random AI denouncing?

For some reason the AI very often simply decides to hate me. I've recently played two games on King, where other civs went from declaration of friendship to denouncing very quickly. I have no enemies, no neighbors and for some reason they just decide to hate me? Please explain

Is this gods and kings?

Who are those civs that denounce you? Some, like Monty, love denouncing friends or denounce when you get ahead (victory competitiveness)

Its Gods and Kings. So far its Elizabeth, Oda, Genghis and Wu, who all have denounced and later declared war against me. The only thing they have in common is that they are "close" to me, but its not like our borders touch or anything. Maybe I was weak and thats why they chose war.

But its not like they have an army either. The most dangerous attack came from Mongolia, which could spare three warriors for the frontline. Don't make me laugh Genghis. And its not just in this game. There seem to be some mechanic that makes the AI pissed, even though we're friends. Were can you see what influence their mood? Is there a guide?

It's not for no reason. Every time I've been denouced, I know why.

Maybe you are expanding too quickly? Maybe you are messing with their CS's? Maybe you've declared war on behalf of friends one too many times?

It could be the first, but why is it a problem I expand if Im not hostile or near them?

Ok here's a good example. Wu declared war against me even though we were friends. I lost the only city remotely near her, to Singapore which is allied with Wu. I make peace with Wu and she is friendly. Next turn she makes embassy exchange with me. And the very next turn she denounce me?

You fought a war with her and after peace, gave her embassy? Yeah she doesn't like you and get ready for another war. Also it means you didn't renew a DoF that expired, if you had one

AIs are generally deceptive, I will talk more when I get a keyboard

smallfish said:

...AIs are generally deceptive...

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Very much so. Liz will often pop up and ask about trade - acting friendly - while ships/troops are enroute to your shores. Sometimes if you take the deal she will back off.

Some of the AIs, just seem cranky by nature - Liz and Alex for starters (many others I am sure). Some do just seem stupid - why denounce someone right next to you because they are stronger militarily? Like poking a bees nest.

It doesn't have to be as random as you think. My guess is that often civs denounce other civs to get on the good side of other civs that don't like the denounced civ. Don't forget that denouncing the same civ as someone else grants a diplomatic bonus.

I've found that minding your own business, and avoiding playing the seedy diplomatic game as much as possible, is often a recipe for getting hated and ganged up on. As tedious as it sometimes seems, taking the time to make strategic friendships with key civs, denouncing other civs to cement those key friendships, trading with other civs as much as possible (that gives a +diplo bonus), spreading your religion when possible, and a lot of other things that would take many paragraphs to do justice to... all those things will help you to some extent. But regardless, there will be civs that will end up hating you, no matter how well you play it. Things like coveting your lands, building wonders they wanted, befriending their enemies or denouncing their friends, warmongering, and on and on... they put a LOT of means into the game by which to get hated, many of which aren't obvious right off. It is a minefield out there... just assume they are plotting against you, no matter how friendly they act, and you'll do ok.

smallfish said:

You fought a war with her and after peace, gave her embassy? Yeah she doesn't like you and get ready for another war. Also it means you didn't renew a DoF that expired, if you had one

AIs are generally deceptive, I will talk more when I get a keyboard

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First, when you said they denounced you, were you actual "Friends" or just on "Friendly" terms? This is very important, because one has a guarantee that they are being extremely ready to attack you if given the opportunity and the other is yes/no maybe.







Here's an example of Friends Denouncing/Going Neutral/Then Declaring War:








Generally speaking, the most dangerous attitudes for warring is with those supposed "Friendly" civs whom you just met, rather than "Neutral" civs who had denounced you beforehand because you can expect those to attack you within 10 turns of denouncement or so.



Because what you CAN do to immediately change the geostrategic situation to offset those "Neutral" warmongers is by either massively increasing your military (rushbuy) or do what I did with the Son of Gormsson there (a combination of both is just as good, btw):



And if they change that "Neutral" to "Guarded", you can expect them to not declare war on you. Guarded civs I have never seen them declare war, and if they want to, their stances will either change to "Neutral" or "Hostile"




There are a variety of reasons they may want to go to war that are not listed in modifiers - they are going for Domination or at least securing this part of the Continent, you are friends with someone they don't really like and this one doesn't show up in the list, they ACTUALLY covet your lands and wonders, you are a warmongering threat to the world etc.

But if you are ready to meet their attacks, then you should not have a problem in dealing with them! And remember - some civs can change their attitudes to you as the eras progress, so if Catherine backstabs and attack you in 1000 BCE, you might still have a chance of friendship in 1700AD or so!

edit: also what Smokeybear said! Don't be that odd fellow out in the Great Game.

Whenever I don't do exactly what another civ says, they eventually denounce me, at some point, no matter what the issue...

mdl5000 said:

Whenever I don't do exactly what another civ says, they eventually denounce me, at some point, no matter what the issue...

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You see that Hiawatha there in my post? He and I were best buds, I even gave him 66 gold for free... and what was the result? He took Rome (my capital).

So no they don't.