Fall Further - The Original Thread

Slvynn said:
If you like i can add some b/w planning brainstorm-concept-artworks for leaderheads for Lizzies, as i see it.
Click to expand...

I'd actually love to see those (and any of the other concept sketches) - I know you said you didn't really want to release the illustration part before it was ready - but I'd love to see the style etc so I know what to expect :)
 
i will give you later from home lizzies, but itso nly composition sketch, so not much aviable to see from painting techniques.

Daracaat is very very savage. Most savage from all FfH leaderheads.
Ursoaan-At (2nd , Harsupex archos leader , is very different , dark , mysterous, task-driven and spiritual.

rest is just dunno + i have some strange leader sketch (b/w) atm for race i dont know (its cool ,but really dont know where to apply him)

will send some b/w sketches to you via mail from home.
 
Whatever you did in the XMl with Daracaat is a big :thumbsup: He is a warmongering fool and I love it.
 
woodelf said:
Did I miss where it said Chislev couldn't build libraries?
Click to expand...

Who's got time to read? There's orcs to be killing... :)

Full list of building switches for the Chislev
Code: 
            <Buildings>
                <Building>
                    <BuildingClassType>BUILDINGCLASS_ALCHEMY_LAB</BuildingClassType>
                    <BuildingType>BUILDING_MEDICINE_HUT</BuildingType>
                </Building>
                <Building>
                    <BuildingClassType>BUILDINGCLASS_LIBRARY</BuildingClassType>
                    <BuildingType>NONE</BuildingType>
                </Building>                
                <Building>
                    <BuildingClassType>BUILDINGCLASS_INFIRMARY</BuildingClassType>
                    <BuildingType>NONE</BuildingType>
                </Building>
                <Building>
                    <BuildingClassType>BUILDINGCLASS_PALACE</BuildingClassType>
                    <BuildingType>BUILDING_PALACE_CHISLEV</BuildingType>
                </Building>
                <Building>
                    <BuildingClassType>BUILDINGCLASS_ELDER_COUNCIL</BuildingClassType>
                    <BuildingType>BUILDING_TRIBAL_COUNCIL</BuildingType>
                </Building>
                <Building>
                    <BuildingClassType>BUILDINGCLASS_PAGAN_TEMPLE</BuildingClassType>
                    <BuildingType>BUILDING_TRIBAL_SHRINE</BuildingType>
                </Building>
                <Building>
                    <BuildingClassType>BUILDINGCLASS_CIV_BUILDING1</BuildingClassType>
                    <BuildingType>BUILDING_TOTEM_OF_OLD_ENEMY</BuildingType>
                </Building>
                <Building>
                    <BuildingClassType>BUILDINGCLASS_CIV_BUILDING2</BuildingClassType>
                    <BuildingType>BUILDING_COUNCIL_OF_THE_WARCHIEF</BuildingType>
                </Building>
                <Building>
                    <BuildingClassType>BUILDINGCLASS_CIV_BUILDING3</BuildingClassType>
                    <BuildingType>BUILDING_COUNCIL_OF_THE_SHAMAN</BuildingType>
                </Building>
                <Building>
                    <BuildingClassType>BUILDINGCLASS_FORBIDDEN_PALACE</BuildingClassType>
                    <BuildingType>NONE</BuildingType>
                </Building>
                <Building>
                    <BuildingClassType>BUILDINGCLASS_WINTER_PALACE</BuildingClassType>
                    <BuildingType>NONE</BuildingType>
                </Building>
            </Buildings>
 
Try Draconian instead of Lizardman. Wind up having to clip wings off most of them to use the image, but you get a lot more that are pretty nicely done (Probably thanks mainly to DragonLance fans)
 
Psychic_Llamas said:
I honestly really dislike both those lizzie leaders. :( i had a google and cant believe how few decent lizzie pics there actually are
Click to expand...

Aye - I know what you mean, I really am going to have to find something better before I call it finished.

On the plus side, at least the units are looking ok :goodjob:

Thumbnail is of a Priest unit - in this case of "Agruonn" - the evil one. I've gone for a "Priest-leader" look for them rather than a "cloaked monk" type look. There are 3 of them in total (Agruonn, Omorr and Kelshekk), in a variation of colours/symbols. If I get chance, I'll add some additional decoration to them (skulls etc for Agruonn) to further differentiate them, but the colours work fine for identification and the model itself isn't too bad.
 

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hows this for a Mazatle leader:



just edit the wings away (but i think he looks great like that, maybe have some lore saying he is the result of a wyvern lizardman hybrid?)

and some others:





Lizzie palaces?


 
Excellent finds there PsychicLlamas...

And here's the result (needs a few rough edges polishing off, but it's just about there)



And a quick "oil painting" filter later...
 
Those lizzie palace pics are gold P_L. Thanks. I should be able to come close.
 
Vehem said:
Not sure what the problem is there - I've just tried it and each of the Students is able to spread in the same way as a Disciple/Thane/Acolyte etc. The "Spread Automatically" option also works. Can you try it again and let me know if there's a problem, preferably with a savegame?

They're crazed - studying the Overlords is not good for your sanity. The Crazed promotion is used on Lunatics and grants Enraged periodically. The Students of the Overlords have the same problem - though turning Barbarian straight away is just really unlucky - there's only something like a 3% chance. In anycase - if you want to spread Overlords - do it quickly, before the students go completely raving mad.
.
Click to expand...

I could have sworn the spread religion button was missing for the Students of Kilmorph...but, I see later it is there. ROK finally spread automatically some several hundred turns later. :(

I wonder if an instant Loyalty promotion (if they are built in the city that has the Statue that gives the promotion automatically), might not prevent them from going barbarian???

OK, I played another 200 turns to turn 600 and ran into a few problems that may be related to the Dural civ.

First, you cannot built priests, etc. so I cannot see how you can get Medic II. The Grigori at least have their Medic unit, but I don't see any like that for the Dural.

Second, I ran into a real problem with Disease. I was constantly at war with the Svartalfar who had AV and was churning out the Diseased Corpses. At least half my army was diseased in combat and I had no unit that could cure disease. Again, other civs have priest units that can get Cure Disease and you have the Grigori Medic. I think the Wonder Aqua Succellus helps, but you need Life mana for that. Maybe there should be a special unit for the Duval with Medic II and Cure Disease...unless I am missing something.

I ended up converting back to ROK (losing Valin) so I could build Arthendain to cure my troops and provide his medic skills. ;)

Third, I saw something about professors? I forget where, but it said you had to build colleges. I couldn't figure out either of these.

I'll probably get the hero for this civ tonight and see how that works.

Hyborem managed to spawn in the 4 tile space between my civ and the Bannor (I never understand how he spawns as there was tons of open space on the map, but he was stuck there). I killed him and his lot in one turn, but the damn hell terrain still formed next to a decent-sized lake so it appears impossible to get rid of - and he didn't even last a full turn on the map!
 
I forgot to mention that I did have 3-4 CTDs during the 200 turns I played.

They were suspiciously similar to the ones I was having with the Champion/Mace Man issue before.

I would get kicked out of FFH2, but when I reloaded my game it was OK for more turns when I would get it again. There was no way to post a save as the CTD didn't happen after any particular event.

Maybe there is a similar conflict with one or more of your new units???
 
Sarisin said:
Second, I ran into a real problem with Disease. I was constantly at war with the Svartalfar who had AV and was churning out the Diseased Corpses. At least half my army was diseased in combat and I had no unit that could cure disease. Again, other civs have priest units that can get Cure Disease and you have the Grigori Medic. I think the Wonder Aqua Succellus helps, but you need Life mana for that. Maybe there should be a special unit for the Duval with Medic II and Cure Disease...unless I am missing something.
Click to expand...

Definitely a fair point - I'll add the "Cure Disease" effect to the Statue of Purity.

Sarisin said:
I wonder if an instant Loyalty promotion (if they are built in the city that has the Statue that gives the promotion automatically), might not prevent them from going barbarian???
Click to expand...

It probably should, but I'm not sure that's the way Kael has it implemented at present. In anycase - if it did stop them going barbarian, it would do it by killing the unit first, which I don't think is what you had in mind.

Third, I saw something about professors? I forget where, but it said you had to build colleges. I couldn't figure out either of these.
Click to expand...

Feudalism should allow you to build Colleges (+1 Free Specialist, +1 GPP (unbiased to any type of GP) )
Priesthood + a College should allow Professors to be built. These have Medic I and the ability to cast Hope and Inspiration.
 
For the redraw of the good leader I am thinking that you need to adjust the levels a bit on the actual lizard himself to match up with the background a bit better. Maybe darker on the armor to show some shadows being cast, and then bring the skintones down a tad less than the armor?


Love the Blue lizards that were added after I saw P_L's first post :) But the first one doesn't go quite full body (or feel right for a Leaderpic) and the second one is probably not going to look well when set to the right proportions :(
 
Moved slightly, shadowed, tidied up around the edges.
Spoiler :



Possible alternative Cualli? Seems more aggressive...
Spoiler :

 
They definitely have a distinct difference, which is good. I like them.

Just a quick question; how close are you to implemented the lizzies into your next add-on? I'd love to play them this weekend. :D
 
woodelf said:
They definitely have a distinct difference, which is good. I like them.

Just a quick question; how close are you to implemented the lizzies into your next add-on? I'd love to play them this weekend. :D
Click to expand...

That's not too likely :lol:

To be honest, the Cualli actually have almost all of the mechanics in place now, and both civs have artwork for a lot of units. I could almost call the Cualli playable and the Mazatl "playable, but rather dull" at the moment - but it's a mess of TXT_KEY's and placeholder art for the leaders.

I'm also away over the weekend but I think I should be able to get them sorted out over the next week. I may also break my earlier rule of "3 at a time" and release these as a "Lizardman Doublepack". I would still like to look at the Villasfar, but I haven't started on them at all yet and the lizards have received a fair bit more work than any of the original three thanks to all the suggestions.
 
Be kinda nice if something could be done about the giant shield behind the Cualli Leader, but a good cut overall as the other lizzie which are still in the pic seem to be quite minor compared to the leader. In the full picture he is just "One of the guys" so doesn't stand out nearly as much as all the other leaders thus far do.


Good job on shading the Mazatle leader, though now I find myself wishing that he was holding something in his other hand, or resting it on something. Just a giant jump in contrast right at the fingers, though it is artistically appropriate since the background is WAY back behind him and all.
 
The first is "as was", the second has had a filter applied, which makes it appear more like an oil painting (in theory). It does seem to pull the two images together slightly, though it does lose some of the detail - what do you reckon?

Spoiler :

Spoiler :
 
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