Monasteries question...

When monasteries become obsolete, what exactly goes away? Clearly the building and the culture are still there. I can still use them to build missionaries. Is it just the science bonus that goes away?

Yes, and you cannot build new ones.

They also lose their bonuses from Spiral Minaret, Sankore, AP and the Sistine Chapel.

Clam Spammer said:

They also lose their bonuses from Spiral Minaret, Sankore, AP and the Sistine Chapel.

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... making Scientific Method seriously suck. From a tech like this someone would expect to help science, while what we get is clearly the opposite...

Refar said:

... making Scientific Method seriously suck. From a tech like this someone would expect to help science, while what we get is clearly the opposite...

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I remember in civ3 scientific method made the "Theory of Evolution" wonder available, which gave two or three free techs to the builder. Maybe they should put that back in the game. Or maybe they could move the free scientist from physics to scientific method.

I agree it needs some tweaking, I find it very ironic (and annoying) whenever my civilization's science drops a signifigant amount (often 100-200 beakers or so) after learning the glorious scientific method.

Yea. If they want to make research go a bit slower, why not just make the cost of later techs higher ("higher-higher" than it is now)....
Seeing how the tech has a net-hit on the beakers is very discouraging.

I completely agree with the above... I often put off scientific method a while because of this.

On the other hand, it's clearly supposed to represent the fact that once the boys in the Renaissance got rolling, no real science was taking place in the monasteries (for the most part - the theory of evolution as it relates to bean sprouts notwithstanding). I appreciate this aspect of reality infringing on my gameplay, even if it does suck, but really, the late game science buildings make up for this. Also, I suspect that Caste System was originally intended to be used around this time... it makes sense, if you imagine a bunch of scientists chilling out on a farm together figuring out anatomy or whatnot. If you use Caste System earlier, just assume that you're ahead of the curve.

If you look carefully, you will notice that the techs that require SM are techs which religion would not help you with anyway. Biology? That requires acceptance of Evolution. Flight? If Man was meant to fly, God would have given him wings. Fission? I could spend a while on that one, but I don't have the hours to waste.

Sure, you lose a lot of science, but it was all haphazard. By using a specific methodology, you get better science, and hence better technologies. You have to dump your old infrastructure and build a new one, and doing that isn't cheap.

If questions end because the answer to every one of them is "God wanted it that way", then you can't advance your technology beyond the basics that you accidentally discovered along the way.

TheDS said:

If you look carefully, you will notice that the techs that require SM are techs which religion would not help you with anyway. Biology? That requires acceptance of Evolution.

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Um, Gregor Mendel, hello???????

Gregor Mendel pwn3 all your base. And this thread.

Venger

Venger said:

Um, Gregor Mendel, hello???????

Gregor Mendel pwn3 all your base. And this thread.

Venger

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Six Star General already made an exception for Mendel in his post above.

One entire scientific monk. Yeah, I guess that invalidates the whole of SciMet. Back to the Medieval ages with you!

Come on, cheeze whiz, the guy used SCIENTIFIC METHODS to come to his conclusions! Where he lived and what his day job was doesn't make a difference. And Darwinism wasn't even a scratch in the Pope's pants back then, either. Can you come up with something useful to say? Please?