SGOTM 14 - Kakumeika

PD had Toto survive two 67% combats, and then another combat. So, they'd met all four teams by T47 or so. That's quite a big information edge over our position, having lost Toto!

mabraham said:

PD had Toto survive two 67% combats, and then another combat. So, they'd met all four teams by T47 or so. That's quite a big information edge over our position, having lost Toto!

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Their Toto did a good job!

Did they manage to snag The Great Lighthouse in their game? We missed it by 1 turn for 200 fail gold, and it would have generated 2000-3000 commerce for us.

I'm not sure how we could have finished much faster. Asoka kind of rolled over and died a lot easier than I thought he would, so maybe skipping Nationalism and Economics? T179 is screaming fast.




Plastic Duck's roster reads like a long list of Deity pros. I learned a lot of what I know about war from one of Snaaty's posts long ago, that Don Deity one.

I'll cross my fingers for 2nd place then! Off to read Phoenix's posts.

Great turnset bcool
Seems like everything went according to plan, and it was a great plan.

Congratulations to everyone on the team, the whole team was doing a great job ingame, and here in the thread .

It was a great experience to me as it was my 1st SGOTM, and in fact the 1st game followed in "real - time" (referring to the games in strategy and tips forums, and various succession games going on constantly).

Thanks again for letting me participate. I hope to be in for the next one.

Thanks for the game all. Well played. I think we did the diplomatic about as fast as was possible. It's just a shame it couldn't hold up to the warmongers.

frogdude said:

Thanks for the game all. Well played. I think we did the diplomatic about as fast as was possible. It's just a shame it couldn't hold up to the warmongers.

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We did have quite a measure of bad luck, too. Had we not lost Toto we'd have met the last Witches 30-40 turns sooner (PD met the West witches second!), and we'd have had more of a clue about the land.

For example, settling 1W of deer would have allowed us to also settle 1W of sugar. Those sites have two shared food resources and three shared mines, which is great value all through the slavery phase because they'd have so much food that you can have the whip cycles running approximately out of phase with each other and work every tile all the time. Later we'd have had the option to convert the western site into a GPfarm that is almost as good as the one we chose, while the east worked mines happily. However Toto's death meant that we learned about the sheep and clam much too late.

Also, we'd perhaps have known not to try for GLH if we'd seen more of the land, known all the teams were on our continent, perhaps worked out the modified-Wheel nature, and perhaps deduced the Tokugawa personality sooner. No overseas trade routes and limited AI trade routes make GLH much less useful that it could have been when we were choosing whether to try for it.

The second ~10% GSpy was a mixed blessing - it allowed us to recover some scouting options, but we ended the game with several thousand spare EPs. I don't think the ability to infiltrate two teams was a key one. We did get some useful techs from North, but there'd only have been a handful of turns before West would have had them. Getting the GScientist that was ~90% at the time would have meant an earlier academy and higher priority for workers cottaging Washington.

Nice Job overall guys! We played a solid game. Tremendous micro payed dividends!

You managed to pull off the vote. Congrats on your finish guys.

I really don't think OSS will really be checking dates for 2nd/3rd as they know PD have finished. At present you are 2nd. Will OSS finish ahead of you and PD??

Gumbolt said:

You managed to pull off the vote. Congrats on your finish guys.

I really don't think OSS will really be checking dates for 2nd/3rd as they know PD have finished. At present you are 2nd. Will OSS finish ahead of you and PD??

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At this stage... will they finish?

I can't imagine that they won't finish. I'm am sure 1-2 players can do marathon sets, probably one of their warmongers. That would make the most sense.

Let's hope they stick to the 25 turn rule if they do do large turnsets. Although I doubt AlanH would ban a team for that.

Main issue will be time. 10 turns with 50-60+ units can take quite a while. 2-3 turns for us were taking nearly 1-2 hours with all the micro.

If they don't finish we'll happily take

If anyone was waiting for AlanH confirmation that we can view other posts... he confirmed it by PM. He reminded me not to post in team threads that haven't finished...

Thanks for everyone's contributions to our success! I hope you all enjoyed the level of detail and planning that we put into the game. I look forward to examining the other teams threads and seeing what we might have done better. It is a bit hard to compare our game with theirs, but it does seem conquest was the way to go despite the extra challenge the map and team AI imposed.

I think the unknown of the wizard and our lack of successful early scouting discouraged us from an aggressive conquest game. As did our lack of experience with them.

I think our game result might have been a bit better with a bit more luck, but everyone had their share of good and bad luck. We'll see where OSS finishes.

I wonder if Toto's early death or the 1 turn loss of the Great Lighthouse was more significant for us. Would either of them made a 10 turn difference? Too hard to say I think. But I think Toto's early death might have been as significant as the loss of the Great Lighthouse.

Hmmm we skipped the GLH and the oracle. Maybe that is where we went wrong! Then again for a Un approach open borders would give more commerce. Perhaps not going conquest got you in the top 3. We could of used a GE on GLH but we use it on Glib instead. We lacked open borders anyway.

Our initial warrior got all the way to Monty's hub. Although I think it would of been better to spawn bust really in retrospect. When you looked at the map and the team element what scouting was really required?

The wizard was happily revealed by the Ai maps anyway.

Going for and losing the GLH is worse than not going for it. We sacrificed early expansion for 200 gold.

Earlier contact with the AI would have given us bonuses on research for teching what they already knew. It would have let us perhaps settle better cities (we lacked early map knowledge with Toto's death). We could have gotten trade routes earlier. We could have perhaps traded technologies and resources earlier. We could have begged more gold (need to double check dates of our alphabet and currency and our actual AI contacts for those). And our capital's development could have been better since we wouldn't have had to build a replacement Toto.

Great work Kakumeika, I have been following your thread with great interest in the last week or so.

I'm especially impressed that you took the alternative Diplo route, and you pulled it off with great style and precision . Having played with bcool and mabraham before, I expected nothing less

Well done

Gumbolt said:

Hmmm we skipped the GLH and the oracle. Maybe that is where we went wrong! Then again for a Un approach open borders would give more commerce. Perhaps not going conquest got you in the top 3. We could of used a GE on GLH but we use it on Glib instead. We lacked open borders anyway.

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GLH was poorish on this map if you worked out that Asoka had Tokugawa's personality (no OB), which we didn't do until about T90 when the information was available to us for at least 20 turns before that. Meeting East earlier would have made that observation available earlier still.

Gumbolt said:

Our initial warrior got all the way to Monty's hub. Although I think it would of been better to spawn bust really in retrospect. When you looked at the map and the team element what scouting was really required?

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Well if you don't have a scout you don't get to look much at the map or meet many teams. It was T70ish before we even met the West.

Gumbolt said:

The wizard was happily revealed by the Ai maps anyway.

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Really? Once Monty got Optics and someone got Paper, yes you could see that there was a barb city on the island hill - he had not visited Emerald City with his caravels in our game. However, there were still plenty of mountains that might need to be paratrooped into, and we were glad our tech path unlocked early airships...

Impressive closing Kakumeika!

I am surprised you managed to co-ordinate everything so well. I didn't think you were going to kill the wiz in time, but you did.

Incredible display of diplo mechanics!

neilmeister said:

Impressive closing Kakumeika!

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Thanks for a great map!

neilmeister said:

I am surprised you managed to co-ordinate everything so well. I didn't think you were going to kill the wiz in time, but you did.

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Now that you mention it, we found the wizard T161 and killed him T188 having done much of nothing to prepare for it...

Looks like I missed the boat...
Anyways, awesome teamwork; during the time I was away (still busy though right now; end of semester...), I managed to take peeks once in a while...and the level of planning was awesome.

You did incredibly well.

It was an honor to work with you ,bcool.
You managed really nicely the team.
Proud to have been with you in this journey.

Gumbolt said:

You managed to pull off the vote. Congrats on your finish guys.

I really don't think OSS will really be checking dates for 2nd/3rd as they know PD have finished. At present you are 2nd. Will OSS finish ahead of you and PD??

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Really?! I need to check it out...