Unhappiness and civilization size

SiCK_Boy

Chieftain
Joined
Mar 27, 2002
Messages
18
Location
Montreal, QC (Canada)
Is there a post or article somewhere describing the exact formulas and rules governing unhappiness and large empires?

All I've found until now is the basic table stating you get this unrest to start to happen based on map size and government type:

Despotism = 4 cities
Monarchy = 6 cities
Republic = 8 cities
Democracy / Fundamentalism = 10 cities
Communism = N/A

However, I've been looking unsuccessfully for the following:

- Number of cities variations for other map sizes (and possibly difficulty, if it impacts it)
- How can I determine exactly which city will suffer from that unhappiness

In my latest game (Standard map, Deity), I had 4 cities under despotism. I found an advanced tribe in a hut, which became my city # 5 (as ordered in the City advisor).

This created unrest in city # 4 (that city now had it's first citizen unhappy, the other 4 cities had one content citizen). Note that the 5th city itself did not suffer from any special unrest (it's one citizen was content).

I then built city # 6 from a settler. I was assuming it would also have one content citizen, creating unrest somewhere else (I was thinking maybe in city # 3). However, that 6th city had it's first citizen unhappy, plus it created unrest in city # 2.

So, how can I determine whether or not the newly created city itself will suffer from this unhappiness (thus requiring a military unit upon creation for martial law), and how can I determine what other city will be affected?

Did the fact that one of my cities came from a hut impact this situation at all?

Thanks in advance to anyone knowledgeable enough to answer this.
 
Do you happen to know what is the highest number that the game (ToT) accepts for the Riot factor? I detest the whole concept of citizens becoming unhappy due to the size of one's empire (they should be happy that we're close to world domination, instead! :mwaha:), and so I aim to disable it or at least mitigate the effects as far as possible.
 
I think the in game editor in MGE allows you to put in 100 for the riot factor. Or you can just use communism, which doesn't suffer from quantity of city unhappiness.
 
I think the in game editor in MGE allows you to put in 100 for the riot factor. Or you can just use communism, which doesn't suffer from quantity of city unhappiness.
Thank you for the answer. :) Now I'm a bit torn about 'disabling' it (100 means that the game will be over most likely before you encounter it)... 'Cause this is a benefit for choosing Communism over Democracy, something the game sorely needs imo. --If only I could somehow disable the perpetual growth from WLTKD in Demo/Republic, then the government forms would be at least somewhat balanced in the end-game. I did ask TNO about it in the ToTPP thread, but it might've slipped his eyes. Even if the government forms themselves cannot be altered, concievably an 'event' of sorts might be made where every time the growth occurs, it gets immediately canceled, meaning the net effect is the same as if it never existed. But that is a matter for another thread... Again thank you for the info.
 
I detest the whole concept of citizens becoming unhappy due to the size of one's empire (they should be happy that we're close to world domination, instead!
The concept makes sense if you look at it as raised expectations instead of sheer unhappiness. If you are big and successful your people want to share the bounty and expect more in luxuries.

From the point of view of game mechanics, adept players who build big empires like this feature because they take advantage of it big time. Citizens turning red is a disadvantage but at higher difficulty levels this period is short lived. After that comes citizens turning black. The black ones react to luxuries like content citizens turning happy with only 2 units of luxury. This means that with modest luxuries you can keep a large empire not just content but celebrating. Without blacks this is impossible at higher levels where every city starts with just one (Deity) or two (emperor) content citizens.
 
The concept makes sense if you look at it as raised expectations instead of sheer unhappiness. If you are big and successful your people want to share the bounty and expect more in luxuries.
Fair point, hm. Or it could be looked at as stability issues due to separatist movements in the conquered areas, with a bureaucracy that's too vast and glacial in its movements to keep up with them. Or even a combination. I guess I just don't like the mechanic tbh. I could always compromise and set the Riot factor to 30 or 50 or something. That way it will slow you down if you aim for true world domination, but won't interfere with you reaching your natural ancestral borders (Africa, Europe, or some other continent :mischief:).
From the point of view of game mechanics, adept players who build big empires like this feature because they take advantage of it big time. Citizens turning red is a disadvantage but at higher difficulty levels this period is short lived. After that comes citizens turning black. The black ones react to luxuries like content citizens turning happy with only 2 units of luxury. This means that with modest luxuries you can keep a large empire not just content but celebrating. Without blacks this is impossible at higher levels where every city starts with just one (Deity) or two (emperor) content citizens.
I detest gimmicks like this even more. Good riddance! :p
 
Top Bottom