Jon Shafer leaves Firaxis!

Nares · Dec 21, 2010

bryanw1995 said:
If he's really gone it's probably due to poor sales.

Almost assuredly. I doubt 2K cares what happens to the franchise, so long as it's selling well.

I'm sure Shafer sold them on the idea that the game would sell well by following the New Bizzard Approach of simplifying the game for the masses. No doubt he dug his own grave with lofty sales projections.

bryanw1995 said:
how much of that was shafer and how much of that was 2k?

No doubt both parties are equally responsible. I haven't seen positive results with any of the buyouts of smaller developers. The industry is in a malaise brought on by the overwhelming trend of simplifying games.

jagdtigerciv · Dec 21, 2010

Hahaha! This is great. He was definitely fired. "Non-disclosure" is right - they fired him, and declared they non-disclosure for PR reasons. Always looks bad to fire a lead designer after such a train wreck.

In other news, Civ5 is getting better by the minute. This is great news.

bonafide11 · Dec 21, 2010

What are you all basing this "poor sales" theory on? You all are really overreacting -- the game didn't sell poorly at all.

jagdtigerciv · Dec 21, 2010

Louis XXIV said:
What's the last good game that Sid Meier made? I don't recall Civ Rev getting a great reception here.

You speak the truth. I don't know why Sid Meier gets so much credit - never forget civfanatics, Civ Rev was Sid's personal monstrosity.

WastinTime · Dec 21, 2010

AbbieRevo said:
the press release makes it seem like he quit, not that he was fired.

Trust me, if you've been in or around the industry, that's exactly what a FIRING looks like in the press. Good for them.

KahunaGod · Dec 21, 2010

Jon's gone? Wow, there is a God (yay! self-actualization lol). The future's looking better evey moment.

bonafide11 · Dec 21, 2010

jagdtigerciv said:
You speak the truth. I don't know why Sid Meier gets so much credit - never forget civfanatics, Civ Rev was Sid's personal monstrosity.

Civ Revolution was a good console game. Just because it was made for consoles and made for quicker games instead of the complicated longer PC games doesn't make it a "monstrosity." Some people prefer a game they can finish in a couple hours.

bonafide11 · Dec 21, 2010

...And he's tweeted about it:

Thanks for the well-wishes everyone. Had a lot of fun at Firaxis, and looking forward to enjoying their games as a fan again.

http://twitter.com/_jon_shafer_/status/17345322103603200

Buccaneer · Dec 21, 2010

Gismo said:
As long as we don't know who is taking over it's hard to say if this helps CiV to become what most expected it to be from the start.

However, this makes me feel hope again.

As long as it's not someone with a Civ3 pedigree or a modder.

joyous_gard · Dec 21, 2010

bonafide11 said:
Civ Revolution was a good console game. Just because it was made for consoles and made for quicker games instead of the complicated longer PC games doesn't make it a "monstrosity." Some people prefer a game they can finish in a couple hours.

Yeah, it's the only way my friend "knows" civ. He knows that Civ Rev is "lame" compared to Civ IV though also.

I also think Sid Meier is a bit of a hack who had a good idea 30 years ago and just rode the pony ever since.

neptune2000 · Dec 21, 2010

Rohili said:
I doubt Shafer leaving has anything to do with Civ V's quality. As others have pointed out, Soren Johnson also left Firaxis after finishing his work on Civ IV.

It seems like a typical business decision to me - once the game is released and major patches are done, why continue paying the lead designer? You don't need him any more, so just let him go. Fresh blood will be brought in to handle future expansions and sequels - that has always been the modus operandi of Firaxis with respect to the Civ games.

So, I think you guys are reading way too much into this.

This. This doesn't preclude them being unhappy with him or him being unhappy with them or both/neither, but it's quite possible it was going to happen in any case. Hopefully that new blood will come up with good ideas for expansions and if necessary be able to convince the higher ups.

Nares · Dec 21, 2010

Nares said:
I haven't seen positive results with any of the buyouts of smaller developers. The industry is in a malaise brought on by the overwhelming trend of simplifying games.

To add to this, I've seen good lead developers forced to fall on their own sword in similar situations. In those cases, there's always some executive with aims at moving to the parent company. Too often, the lead developer takes the fall. The industry loses a potentially talented developer, in order to support some obviously lecherous executive.

bonafide11 · Dec 21, 2010

Based on his tweet I quoted above, he doesn't seem bitter about it or anything. But it also doesn't sound like he has another job he left for.

LegioCorvus · Dec 21, 2010

I don't see why everyone is defending Jon Shafer. :dunno:

He is the one who decided on global happiness to control expansion.

He is the one who decided on having the AI "play to win the game."

He was the one given a set release date years in advance*.

He was the one responsible for many of the core elements of gameplay that have formed a very messy game.

:viking:

In what fantasy land is he the one defending the CivFanatics from the evil executives? Did the executives hand down global happiness, and Jon took it on the shoulder as our valiant knight of the CFC, knowing that allowing global happiness into his perfectly formed jewel of a game would give him the chance to show us such splendors as "I hate you because you're going for a victory condition" ?

*(I'm going to expand on this one, as obviously an inexperienced developer will have problems with his first deadline, and Firaxis axing employees right before the end didn't help, but the deadline wasn't handed out at the last second).

Horizons · Dec 21, 2010

Will Jon Shafer ever play a Civ game again? Did Soren play Civ5 and if so what was his opinion on it?

Scaramanga · Dec 21, 2010

lol It's fun watching people sing "Ding dong the witch is dead."

bonafide11 · Dec 21, 2010

Horizons said:
Will Jon Shafer ever play a Civ game again?

He tweeted that he looks forward to enjoying the games as a fan again, so I assume he will.

da_Vinci · Dec 21, 2010

Comic relief:

seasnake said:
In short, Shafer's leaving is no kind of indictment of Civ V, good or bad.

I am trying to get my head around the concept of a good indictment ... :mischief:

dV

Horizons · Dec 21, 2010

bonafide11 said:
He tweeted that he looks forward to enjoying the games as a fan again, so I assume he will.

It would be good if he did, and posted his comments and criticisms ... it would be fun to see him answer back at all his critics.

Dale · Dec 21, 2010

jacyp said:
Most people, since Civ 5 was launched, criticized the game.

Other people defended the game with arguments like "it's selling well" and "look at steam, there are 50k people playing it right now".

The truth is, all of these are falacious arguments that have no use in this discussion.

If you have a forum full of fans that can't agree whether the game is a success or not, then IT IS NOT.

So 10,000 active fans on ALL Civ forums (reasonable guess) is indicative of the failure or success of a game that sold 1,000,000? All it says is 1% of the player base can't decide if it's a success or failure.

Nice try mate, come back when you can talk some sense.

Jon Shafer leaves Firaxis!

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