G-Minor 197

While the general Hall of Fame is an ongoing competition, we like to run time-definite competitions between updates that we call Gauntlets. Standard Hall of Fame rules (*) still apply, but any games meeting the settings will be counted towards the Gauntlet.


Settings:

• Victory Condition: Space Colony (though all victory conditions must be enabled)
• Difficulty: Prince
• Starting Era: Ancient
• Map Size: Small
• Speed: Normal
• Map Type: Rain Forest
• Required: No Tribal Villages, No Random Events
• Must Not Be Checked: No Barbarians
• Civ: Ethiopia (Zara Yaqob)
• Opponents: Must include Carthage (Hannibal), Egypt (Hatshepsut), Mali (Mansa Musa), Zulu (Shaka)
• Version: 3.19.003 or 3.19.003s
• Date: 10th March to 10th April 2015

Must not play as Inca.
The earliest finish date wins, with score as a tiebreaker.

Figured I'd have a stab at this one, so anything of note to know about other settings or AIs? For now I'll see what maps I get with just the above settings. Never played rainforest before.

Edit: Didn't like being so close to the edge, but a lot more food popped up when settling in place than I expected, so it looks like a sweeeet start.

Can't recall what Prince was like as it's been ages since I played it, but I suppose relying on tech trades is pretty much a lost cause.

no forest and low hammers (no hills) is not good, for the space espacially, u'll be need to build in ur capital at least Oxford, NE, may be HG and pyrs..

You can actually do better than that on food, or at least better as in not having to wait for plantations: 2 pig 2 gold is easy to get (and hopefully at least one gold on ph instead of dh). The first time I played bts regularly (which is more years than I care to admit) I was obsessed with playing as India on rainforest maps although I have forgotten much ... err almost everything, but anyway there is going to be a ton of food on these maps but shields will be a problem for virtually every city so workshops become more important and watermills might too (alzheimers is a little fuzzy on that one), if you get lucky enough to have some forest try not to chop it and leave a few tiles around it unimproved for as long as possible hoping it will spread (which isn't going to happen but no harm as long as you don't hold your breath for it) and of course you whip until your fingers bleed, put on a couple bandaids and whip some more, however one of them there corporations can come in handy because if the map lays out just right you can get a decent amount of metals (or you can always just take them from the prince level AI).

Prince difficulty is that level where you get alphabet, discover that you have 20 techs to give away but nothing to receive in return, you catch one or two AI up on tech hoping to make a good trade partner in the future only to again get 20 techs ahead of them and so you just take their land. Oh I almost forgot, you can get fishing and sailing from the AI which of course will come in handy when the rainforest floods.

Yes, I couldn't see the forest for the trees... Saw myself a bit blind on the double gold and food. Used this as a little learning experience because.. errm.. a panther ate my first settler. Just typical an animal would pop out from the one tile it could, eh? Played on, however, and lack of hammers in the capital was already a pain, and all that jungle.... good grief. Gonna need about 10 workers per city chopping down all that. Not much hope in trading, as with so few AIs they're also stingy in trading stuff they actually have on me early. Warrior rushing may even be an option.

This map left me with no copper, no iron and no horse, so yeah, kinda crap actually. The forest from the deer actually spread, however, so that was nice. Not often that happens, even in long pangaea maps.

I'd definately add some more opponents. Rainforrest is an extremely large mapscript and you know already, that crouding a map makes it easier to conquer each civ in single.

Good picks would be Darius and Asoka, Peter is also always good and can serve as a meatshield on top.

Probably it doesn't matter that AIs are easier to conquer on Prince, but getting more cities does.

Yea, you have to crowd the map because the mapscript will clear all the jungle around every capital. And it often fills that with forest. I've almost never played rainforest, but I've generated maps enough. I'm pretty sure that's how it works.

That looks like a good idea, but I went with one of the other maps I generated earlier. So much jungle, though, and it's a huge pain to deal with it all. So much land too, so it would be useful to have other AIs fill some of it and help me clear the land before conquering them. With so much food and jungle, both happiness (cap) and health are problems. Few health type foods too, so I can see why HG would be useful.

With the post somewhere above in mind, I've been working on some wonders, though I'm not sure how much they're needed. However, I Oracled Civil Service for the very first time, so that was pretty neat.

Put some hours into this game now, so will try to continue with it, but think it would have been better to go with more AIs. Let them clear the land, build some wonders for me, and maybe conquer one or two early, if I were luckier with strategic resources. Also a good point about the area around capitals being pre-cleared by the map generator. Practically everything else is either jungle, mountains or (oddly enough) desert.

Pangaea said:

So much jungle, though, and it's a huge pain to deal with it all. So much land too, so it would be useful to have other AIs fill some of it and help me clear the land before conquering them.

Click to expand...

See how Deity could sometimes be easier?

I played until 1000AD yesterday, was very curious because I've never tried a rainforest map before (and neither a gauntlet game for that matter).

Almost spilled my coffee when I traded for World Maps and saw how brutal the mapscript can be: Mansa Musa is squeezed between a huge desert and a mountain range, while Shaka's land is more than double than that of any other civilization. Accordingly, Shaka is the highest ranked AI, and since we are on opposite edges of the map it will be interesting until the end.

As a result of the jungles and the low difficulty, the AI is annoyingly slow. I didn't expect them to have great techs for trade, but at least more than 50 gold would be helpful now and then. Also, since I had stone I had put 450 hammers into Chichen Itza for failgold. By 1000AD these have decayed to 300, because nobody ever finishes a wonder.

Anyway, Ethiopia is a cool civ. Right now I'm waging war with Drill-IV-Oromos and Cannons (from Liberalism->Steel) and ORG really helps to keep the upkeep low and somewhat makes up for the missing trade gold and failgold.

Seriously considering Cereal Mills Corp given the abundance of rice. But State Property would probably be better given the utter lack of hills... very interested how everybody tackles this.

WastinTime said:

See how Deity could sometimes be easier?

Click to expand...

I do actually. Deity seems a bit too tough for me atm, but it certainly has advantages in the AIs teching faster so you get great techs most of the time, and they develop the land (for you) much faster. Much of that applies at immortal too, though the speed is all that much faster on deity.

Qactus said:

I played until 1000AD yesterday, was very curious because I've never tried a rainforest map before (and neither a gauntlet game for that matter).

Click to expand...

No chance for me to kcd_swede this then

Decided to try a new map today. Got so many 3-4 gold starts, but NONE had food, so went with a 3-gem start instead. Not great food pre-calendar, but it has many hills, which will come in handy. Gems also have the advantage that they're not 0 tiles.

Can only agree about the brutality of the mapscript. In an earlier attempt I had a huuuuge desert to my south, in another a big mountain range next to the capital. With four AIs, in several attempts one AI had pretty much half the map to him-/herself. Going with 7 AIs now so that shouldn't be an issue, but Oracling Civil Service is probably off. No stone or marble nearby either, so building wonders is more or less a waste I guess. Would love Mids, but 500 without IND or stone is brutal.

One disadvantage with max AIs is that you can have less land before triggering domination. 68% for 4 AIs, and 62% for 7.

On Prince level Oracling CS is never off. You'd have to be pretty unlucky if someone builds it before 1000 BC, I think.

I doubt I have time to play this gauntlet, but if I did, I would hope to get a start with easy access to both stone and marble. Hammers are so rare on this script and there's a lot of wonders that I'd want to build.

More AI does not lower your chances of Oracle-CS significantly. With 3 gems you should be able to get it.
xpost

I got it in 800BC or thereabouts on the new map. 850BC yesterday. Bit in two minds on the map though. Good capital with 3 gems and 5 hills or something, so lots of hammers and commerce (albeit no rivers), but nearby there is no stone, marble, horses, copper or iron, so wonders will be a tough one, and conquering won't be straightforward either. Very unbalanced mapscript.

So, so different from 'normal' maps, but kind of fun too. Just need a pile more workers. 1 worker per 3 cities would be a bit rough here

Bahahahaha I'd be a little upset if I was Hannibal.

(If I continue this game), guess he'll have to stay alive.

I really love this start and hate to mess it up but even though its only prince level im still re-learning how to play this game and I was never that good the first go around. I oracled cs in 1160 and adopted bureau. Meanwhile Frederick was nice enough to research alphabet for me which I can get with maths and some other low tier techs. My only problem is I have no idea where to go from here lol.

You can probably HA-rush most AIs on Prince very well. HAs are a lot faster than all non-mounted units, so they are very desirable.

Conquer as much of the map as possible without triggering Domination. If you need to long for that, go for Knights or Cuirrs after HAs, as said, HAs will be probably enough though. Elephants + Catapults would also be a good choice, but slower.

Tech-path: HBR -> Currency -> Paper -> (bulb) Education -> (bulb) Liberalism -> Machinery -> PP and when you're there, you ask for further advice.

Hth.

P.S.: Plz post this start in "the awesome starts collection" -thread in S&T once you're finished and have submitted the game.

elitetroops said:

I doubt I have time to play this gauntlet, but if I did, I would hope to get a start with easy access to both stone and marble. Hammers are so rare on this script and there's a lot of wonders that I'd want to build.

Click to expand...

I assume one of them is the Great Lighthouse?

drizzt.titan said:

I really love this start and hate to mess it up but even though its only prince level im still re-learning how to play this game and I was never that good the first go around. I oracled cs in 1160 and adopted bureau. Meanwhile Frederick was nice enough to research alphabet for me which I can get with maths and some other low tier techs. My only problem is I have no idea where to go from here lol.

Click to expand...

That's a very good-looking capital. Copper too, so you're sorted for military.

For those of us who end up without metals or horses, is it better to just give up on the map, or would it be okay to conquer later rather than early?

Not in play on this map of course, but Keshiks would be quite handy with the 2-moves regardless of terrain.

Pangaea said:

I assume one of them is the Great Lighthouse?

Spoiler :

Click to expand...

Of course, and Oracle MC for colossus!

Pangaea said:

For those of us who end up without metals or horses, is it better to just give up on the map, or would it be okay to conquer later rather than early?

Click to expand...

As it's so easy to rush Prince AI, I'd prefer to have copper or horse. If you are early enough, you can even pull off axe rushes with one axe... Warrior rushes might be harder, as it's not easy to get a 5 hammer start on this mapscript. Getting a free capital+extra worker early can speed up the game a lot. Shaka is the only one starting with hunting, the rest should be pretty slow to archery.

Pangaea said:

No chance for me to kcd_swede this then

Click to expand...

With all this talk about the Gauntlet, I'm becoming interested in playing it too.

I don't wanna WastinTime the Gauntlet though.