How to protect myself from other Ideologies? [Solved?]

So I figured I'd jump in and try out the new BNW stuff. Dropped it down to Immortal and selected Shoshone. Built 14 cities, took a few more in war. Built nothing related to tourism; didn't even build the 3 guilds. Got up to the modern era and selected Order. Rejoiced at the amount of happiness I got from the Order tenets. Suddenly found myself with a 34 unhappiness penalty for Civil Resistance and seeing that there's a further Revolutionary Wave level that I'll likely hit in short order. Now I'm wondering how I can prevent that for the next time through.

The in-game info seems pretty confusing unless I'm missing something somewhere. It says that the public opinion is calculated based on outgoing Influence of my civ compared with incoming Influence from civs with other ideologies.

1. What is influence? Straight tourism output?

2. How do I resist their influence? By generating influence of my own? Does that mean I need to build great works and get great artists/writers/musicians to generate a lot of tourism? Does it have to meet or exceed the combined tourism output of all civs of other ideologies?

3. Is it possible to protect myself at all if I'm the only civ with Order? I went Order, 4 civs went Autocracy, and one other went Freedom. I got the unhappiness penalty essentially immediately. How can I protect myself from the other Ideologies?

1. Influence is how much tourism they produce as opposed to your culture. If their tourism is 100% your culture, they will become influential over you. And if your ideology is different than the influential, your people will start a revolutionary wave and flip to the civ with the preffered ideology
2. Don't have trade routes or open borders with the influential civ. they get mad bonuses for having those things with you. Also, focus on culture and tourism yourself and try to outbumber them in those factors.
3. Yes, its very well possible. If your tourism is high enough you'll become influential yourself and THEY will start to get unhappy. I managed to win cultural as Freedom, while every other civ was Order or Autocracy.

Another related question.

Once I enter the "dissident" status and receive about 20 unhappiness, is it possible to get rid of this penalty?

For example, in my last game I was influenced by Venice/Order (2 hammers). I eventually won the World Fair, invested in some culture and the influence over me decreased to 1 hammer. However I still got the same amount of unhappiness which seemed rather unfair.

Note that my tourism was "unknown" to Venice during the whole period of time. Is that the reason? I was under the impression that only my culture output is important to defend against toursim.

I just got out of a game where I was the only civ to choose Freedom, and almost all other civ's eventually went the way of order.

I was hemoraging happiness, and I couldn't figure how to stem the tide. I started focusing on building up as much culture and tourism as I could, eventually doubling them both. Built broadcast towers left and right, sent archaeologists out to get trinkets for my museum, but nothing seemed to help. Is it a one-directional effect that you can't come back from?

I got rid of similar unhappiness problem by declaring Autocracy a World Ideology in Congress. It just so happened Carthage was Autocratic as well and we shared vast majority of votes between us. 0 unhappiness for us, 20+ for other civs, solved.

Next time going to pay more attention to tourism and culture, you can't always get that lucky.

Im not fully understanding this new game mechanic either. Why would tourism help though. Thought that culture would be the 'defense' to other civs influence. Yes, great works are the main way to get culture, which are also tied to tourism.

Okay. I think I *maybe* figured it out.

I see that in my game Arabia, Mongolia, Morocco, and Iroquois have Autocracy; Portugal has Freedom; and I have Order. The Culture Victory table looks like this:


The tooltips for the Public Opinions on the 3 higher tourism civs (Arabia, Portugal, and Morocco) have "Not influenced by the Ideology of any other civ. Mongolia is influenced by Portugal, Morocco, Arabia, and Iroquois. Iroquois are influenced only by Portugal and Arabia even though they have the same tourism output as Mongolia (right now anyway; don't know what their relative tourism/culture outputs were over time). I (Shoshone) am influenced by Portugal, Morocco, and Arabia but not the smaller two.

Tabbing over to the Influence by Player tab, I can see that Shoshone obviously influences no one and I am level Unknown vs all civs. I see that Mongolia is Unknown against all the other civs that have Ideologies also. Iroquois are Unknown vs Arabia, Portugal, and Shoshone but Exotic vs the rest. Morocco, Arabia, and Portugal are Exotic vs all civs with Ideologies.

It appears to me that the way it works is if their LEVEL vs you exceeds your LEVEL vs them, you are influenced by them. If it equals, neither of you influence the other. If yours exceeds theirs, you influence them. This is why, even though the tourism output for Mongolia and Iroquois are the same, Mongolia is influenced by Iroquois and Morocco while Iroquois isn't. Morocco vs Mongolia is exotic. Mongolia vs Morocco is unknown (and is therefore influenced by Morocco). Morocco vs Iroquois is exotic. Iroquois vs Morocco is exotic (and therefore neither influences the other).

Therefore, the method to resist other civs' Ideologies and not get the unhappiness penalty is two-fold:

• First, try to keep your Influence LEVEL in the culture overview under Influence by player equal or higher than civs with other Ideologies. This means that you must do at least a little bit of tourism stuff if you want to avoid the unhappiness penalties (unless I guess you just roll with whatever the majority of the other civs do).
  
  
• Second, you can keep their influence level lower by increasing your culture output. Influence levels appear to be calculated by whatever the percentage is of total tourism output against that civ vs that civ's total culture output. 10% is Exotic, 30% is Familiar, etc. Maximizing total culture output will thus help keep their influence levels low.

Alatar1313 said:

Okay. I think I *maybe* figured it out.

Click to expand...

What is still not clear from this:

• Do greater disparities in influence levels cause multiple units of influence? I.e., Exotic vs unknown shows 1 little symbol ("unit of pressure" according to the tooltip) per civ against me. If someone was Familiar vs Unknown, would it show 2 and count for double? If it was Popular vs Unknown would it show 3 and count for 3?
  
  
• How many units from other ideologies does it take to equal what level of public opinion? With 1 for Freedom from Portugal and 2 for Autocracy from Morocco and Arabia, I'm at Civil Resistance. Does this mean that it's taking the higher of the two (autocracy) and giving me 2 levels of penalty (from content past dissidents all the way to civil resistance) or does it add up all units from all different ideologies and calculate your public opinion on some formula?