Could use some help with revamping iPower ratings

Tholal

Emperor
Joined
May 19, 2009
Messages
1,676
I discovered the other day that the iPower values (found in the XML for Units, Techs and Buildings), weren't really set in a meaningful way.

For units, it seemed that their iPower rating was set by simply multiplying their Combat value times their Tier. While that makes some sense, it doesn't take into account any special abilities or promotions and undervalues low combat units such as Archmages. Other units, including Hill Giants, had their iPower set to 0.

iPower is used by the AI for making a general estimate of its own power as well as that of its rivals. It is also used to generate the power graph display in the Stats window.

So, I set out to revamp the system entirely, starting with Warriors as a base (iPower rating of 3). This turned out to be kind of a daunting task (and I started getting burned out about halfway through), but I have completed a first pass which you can view here - https://spreadsheets.google.com/spr...dXd1blFmOHRPcEZmMGc&hl=en_US&authkey=COzXos0E

I would love some feedback and suggestions for any adjustments.


Note: In addition to revamping the iPower ratings for units, I also discovered that the iPower values for the Mercurian and Infernal palaces were set to 1000(!), severely over-inflating their actual power!
 
mercurian and infernal are intended afaik, it's to make them more aggressive when they spawn. 1000 does seem too high though...
 
[to_xp]Gekko;10586650 said:
mercurian and infernal are intended afaik, it's to make them more aggressive when they spawn. 1000 does seem too high though...

Interesting. Not the right way to do it, IMO. Giving them artificially inflated power settings is counter-productive (and it obviously didnt really work in base FFH to begin with). They could have 0 troops, but still think they're #1 in power rating! Power rating should be reflective of the actual troops you have available with some fudge factor for buildings and techs that help you get more/better troops (oh, and population numbers are also factored in).

Anyway, both buildings will be set to an iPower of 0 in my next release.
 
Good work :thumbsup:

I had an eye on your Naval AI mod too. When you'll release final version of those, I' ll give them a download.

For now I rather wait until last bugfixes and optimizations are done.
 
You also might want to check the iAsset values, since they are pretty inconsistent too.

I mostly compared the values we (RifE) and base FFH has in comparison with BTS.

The following is a quote of what i observed. This may not be 100% the same numbers you have, but i guess the trend is still there, since we both just used the bad FFH values as a base.

But a few things can be clearly seen.
First: our values are way too high.
The BTS Values have the iAsset roughly equal a tier of units. really early units get a 1, melee units get 2, rifle units get 3 and so on.
We have Warrior at 1, Axeman at 4 and Phalanx at 24.
iPower in BTS seems to be in most cases the Strength of a unit. There are some special cases, like the trebuchet which has an iPower twice its strength, but that is explained by its 100% city attack bonus, which is its main purpose.
iAsset in RifE seems to be somewhere between the strength and double the strength of the unit in most cases.
iPower in Rife seems to be double of the iAsset value and since that is pretty inconsistent, it is all over the place too.
I think the only two RifE units i have in that list, that do it right are scout and warrior.

And another quote:
Another thing to note is that in base BTS settlers and workers have an iAsset/iPower rating of 4/0 and 2/0 respectively. This means, at least the settler is for a damn long time the unit that is most important to the AI and has a large "do-not-waste" sign above him. and the worker is of equal value than the melee units up to maceman.

In the end we decided to mostly use the tier of the unit as its iAsset value and the strength as iPower, except in special cases like the already mentioned archmages, or other units that are stronger/weaker than their normal strength suggests.
 
Thanks for the info Shoggi! Interesting that base Civ just uses strength.

You also might want to check the iAsset values, since they are pretty inconsistent too.

In regards to iAsset, I did notice that XML tag when I saw the iPower tag, but from what I can tell, the only place it's used is in the isBetterDefenderThan() function. The iAsset values for techs and buildings arent being used at all.
 
Note: In addition to revamping the iPower ratings for units, I also discovered that the iPower values for the Mercurian and Infernal palaces were set to 1000(!), severely over-inflating their actual power!

It seems to me that could mess around w/ the aggressiveness of those civs. I would think we’d want those civs to be feared and to be aggressive, both of which the iPower of their palaces accomplishes. In fact, both civs work better (to some extent) when they are aggressive.

I would say that 1000 iPower for their palaces might be a bit much. That’s the equivalent of 55 champions, or 41 iron champions if it take the weapon promos into consideration. Something equivalent to 10-20 champions might be more appropriate.

For reference, what are the iPower ratings for palisades, city walls, and other buildings?

Also, what do you think about the iPower of the treant unit? Their high iPower means that the Ljo can tech to feudalism, cast march of the trees, and then immediately obtain capitulation from every other civ. Obviously this is an exploit only a player would really use, but the inflated power graph rankings of the Ljo during the march sometimes has some weird consequences.
 
I would think we’d want those civs to be feared and to be aggressive, both of which the iPower of their palaces accomplishes.

Perhaps, but it does so in the wrong way. Either civ could have 0 units and still think they are at the top in power rating. Using the iPower rating of their palace to overinflate their military situation will just lead to strange behavior.

For reference, what are the iPower ratings for palisades, city walls, and other buildings?

I plan on removing most if not all of the iPower ratings for the other buildings. But for reference, an Archery Range is given a power rating of 4 and Walls are given a power rating of 2.

Also, what do you think about the iPower of the treant unit? ... but the inflated power graph rankings of the Ljo during the march sometimes has some weird consequences.

Good point! I think I will disable adding or subtracting power for temporary summons.
 
Top Bottom