Settlers & Surplus Food

alpaca

alpaca

King of Ungulates
Joined
Aug 3, 2006
Messages
2,322
I noticed yesterday that when producing settlers, the surplus food is not converted into production. Instead the city just stopped growing. Can anyone confirm this? And if so, did they change this in G&K or was it a change in one of the more recent vanilla patches?

At any rate, be sure to micromanage your city to avoid food surplus in favor of production when building settlers.
 
alpaca said:
I noticed yesterday that when producing settlers, the surplus food is not converted into production. Instead the city just stopped growing. Can anyone confirm this? And if so, did they change this in G&K or was it a change in one of the more recent vanilla patches?

At any rate, be sure to micromanage your city to avoid food surplus in favor of production when building settlers.
Click to expand...

its the same as before (vanilla) - building settlers freezes the food calculation - you can go into deep starvation mode in favor of production - no one will starve
 
Wow, I didn't know that, I always thought (like the topic starter) that food was added to the production of the settler.

But this is not the case?! *shock*
 
It certainly is pretty weird. Especially the fact your cities don't starve. I usually buy my settlers just because I dislike micromanaging my citizens when producing settlers. Not micromanaging them is not really an option because you're just wasting your citizens on food tiles.

Actually, it suprises me this hasn't been brought up more often and that it has not been changed. Do others also think it is unbalanced?
 
I often switch to building a settler when my city gets attacked, stops them from starving.
 
anandus said:
Wow, I didn't know that, I always thought (like the topic starter) that food was added to the production of the settler.

But this is not the case?! *shock*
Click to expand...

I'm pretty sure that surplus food went into production at some point in time because otherwise I'd have noticed it before. I distinctly recall switching to production tiles because the food surplus was not affected by collective rule (which boosts settler production) in vanilla because, but it certainly didn't make for as much of a jump as it does now. I also remember sometimes switching from a two hammer tile to a four food tile to speed settler production.

So, either I'm deluded, or this changed at some point in the couple of months I haven't played the game. The manual just states settlers "consume" food and production when being built, which might be interpreted both ways.

I certainly think it's pretty annoying to micro your settlers (kind of like the no-research overflow when the base game was first released). I don't know about unbalanced, though. It doesn't seem like it affects much beyond micromanagement except for very small cities with no nearby hills. It could be one of the ICS nerfs but I don't think it's necessary or sensible.
 
I always thought this was annoying. I hate micromanaging it. I think once upon a time long ago, the food and production both counted toward building settlers. No more.
 
When the game first came out, extra food was converted into production while producing settlers. However, one of the patches nerfed that down to a max of 3 or so bonus production, then a future patch nerfed it again so that excess food doesn't add any production for settlers at all. However, a city cannot SHRINK while producing settlers, so I always ignore food completely while producing settlers. Just remember to switch it back after the settler is produced!
 
I recall that in Civ IV, food was combined with production for creating Settlers.

I don't recall earlier versions in Civ V, but for quite some time, food has *not* been converted.

I didn't realize that cities couldn't starve when producing settlers. I might need to try that trick. Sometimes, cities are out of food stores and about to starve (losing a population point). This may happen when enemy units are occupying your tiles (especially naval blockades) or when you get a population ancient ruins before you can fully support it. It's nice if you can delay the starvation by building a settler, at least until you can work out the food situation.
 
bryanw1995 said:
When the game first came out, extra food was converted into production while producing settlers. However, one of the patches nerfed that down to a max of 3 or so bonus production, then a future patch nerfed it again so that excess food doesn't add any production for settlers at all. However, a city cannot SHRINK while producing settlers, so I always ignore food completely while producing settlers. Just remember to switch it back after the settler is produced!
Click to expand...
Indeed!
I've looked up the patch notes. Here's from the march 2011 patch:
Taper off benefit of excess food when building settlers
Click to expand...
I guess that's it? I can't find any other mentions of tweaks to settler building.
 
That sounds like it must be it.

I just don't get why though, and still wonder if people really agree with this or just didn't really notice.
 
I noticed it but honestly didn't give it much thought but not having food count towards production of a settler is a little odd. Indeed, you could switch it entirely (settlers are only produced with food and production is stopped) and it would make more sense. I assume its a balance issue, though I can't see how that's the case.

It certainly makes no sense that you can avoid starvation by producing a settler, that should not have been allowed slip by during the change and certainly fixed in G&K.
 
The March 2011 reduced the hammers from food; but there were still some.
(pre March 2011 patch: 5 food = 5 hammers; post 5 food became 3 hammers; and the first 2 extra food were fully effective).

A later patch removed the benefit entirely but it wasn't documented. I think it was the summer 2011 patch that zeroed out the surplus food benefit entirely.
 
The problem was "all the bonus food" from tradition policies and early maritime cs allies gave an unintended, disproportionate benefit to settler construction. I messed with it all the time, and wasn't surprised when they changed it.
 
Yeah the solution is to raise the cost of settlers. It was mainly a reaction against tradition civs with a maritime ally or 2 building a settler every turn and ICS.

Since they have fixed a lot of that I think they should just increase the cost a bit and add back the ability for food to produce.

Or the even simpler solution of just not having settler prodution effect food. Just make it a normal unit.
 
Becephalus said:
Yeah the solution is to raise the cost of settlers. It was mainly a reaction against tradition civs with a maritime ally or 2 building a settler every turn and ICS.

Since they have fixed a lot of that I think they should just increase the cost a bit and add back the ability for food to produce.

Or the even simpler solution of just not having settler prodution effect food. Just make it a normal unit.
Click to expand...

Another solution would be to have only the food produced by the city (and not food received from CSs, SPs, Wonders, etc.) add to the production of the Settler.
 
I read this yesterday and checked it out in game today. I'm not sure about the ratio of :c5food: to :c5production:, but when I took a worker off a 3 :c5food: tile, the finish time of the settler increased by a turn. Apparently, surplus :c5food: still benefits the building of settlers, but how much?
 
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