Palmyra, Collab Mod

Firebug

Firebug

Not-so Great Engineer
Joined
Sep 25, 2014
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Location
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The original post
Spoiler :
As some of you may or may not know, the Palmyrene Empire (270–273) was a splinter state centered at Palmyra, that broke away from the Roman Empire during the Crisis of the Third Century.
Palmyra, the city it was centered from, was a prosperous city of trade, monumental structures, great culture and a strong military which fought against the Roman Empire. It was ruled by Empress Zenobia in its short 3 years of being an Empire but even after its defeat it remained strong.

Unfortunatley, in the past year, ISIS/ISIL were able to take over the city of Palmyra (designed a UNESCO World Heritage Site in 1980). Palmyra, being an ancient city, is full of idols and statues of ancient gods no longer worshipped. ISIS seems to think of this as a bad thing, their god is the only god. So...
  • According to eyewitnesses, on 23 May 2015 the militants destroyed the Lion of Al-lāt and other statues.
  • The militant group destroyed the temple of Baalshamin on 23 August 2015 according to Abdulkarim and activists while the Syrian Observatory for Human Rights claimed that the destruction took place one month earlier.
  • The Syrian Observatory announced that on 30 August 2015, ISIL destroyed the temple of Bel; and according to eyewitnesses only the outer walls remain.
  • and today (4 September 2015) it became known that the terrorist militia had also destroyed three of the best preserved tower tombs including the tower of Elahbel.

This upset me, i hate to see Nations lose their history and their culture. No matter how ancient the people, humanity should never lose what has stood the test of time and proven how far we've come. Without history we would not know the work that humans have gone through to come the the point we stand at currently. From mud, to stone to bricks and more.

I mention all of this to ask one thing of all the modders and researchers on CivFanatics, to work together to make sure Palmyra has its own legacy in Civ V. So you can build a civilization that can stand the test of time as Zenobia, their strongest leader. So you can expand the great empire to the lengths that Palmyra did, and to preserve it in the Steam Workshop as another civilization for all to play as, and remember.
It may be practically gone in reality, but the world still deserves its culture and history, and Palmyra still deserves to be remembered. Its people, its artifacts and its monuments.

So far, ryanjames and SuperWaffle have said they want to help and believe its a great idea.

TL;DR
Spoiler :
  • ISIS destroyed/destroying Palmyra's history
  • History is important, its an important part of humanity
  • We need to collab on mod to make Palmyra into a civ.
  • Zenobia should be the leader.
  • Need help with research, UA/UU/UI or UB
  • got help from some people because people are nice
  • thanks


The following are photos from before the destruction, and what we've likely lost from human history.
Spoiler :
 
I'm down for doing anything I can to help this project out.

A good potential source for the LH:

 
I'm also very much up for doing this!
 
I'm also up for this project, human history has to be preserved and our effort as a community and this mod is going to show that we can do this.
 
Its nice to see such positive support. What we need to really think of now is the actual gameplay concept. Researching what Palmyra was most known for, where its culture was focused and what UA would best suit - that is a good first step.
I'll edit the first post with a few important steps, it'll give us a checklist to work on.
 
If anything the only thing I can propose is maybe something involving Building/Wonder? production and Great General Generataion, without her generals Zenobia wouldnt be able to conquer most of eastern Rome quickly and the multiple Temples built at the now-destroyed site could be fitting even with all we have to go on right now.
 
I was thinking that the Clibanarii could be the UU, they were the Palmyremene empire's heavy calvary and were the core of their army
 
Thanks for the feedback. Clibanarii sounds like a great idea. It actually appears in the Fall of Rome scenario as a Sassanid UU.

And i agree that Building, Wonders and possibly Great Generals needs to fit into the civilization somehow, that's a good idea too.

I've changed UU and UA on the checklist into WIP and added your ideas (with credits to you). Good to know we're making pretty quick progress. But we're still open to ideas from others.
I'm currently researching what Palmyra's UA could be called, and try to see if it could themed around that.

to further focus on Palymra's military prowess, heres a quote from wikipedia (the most trustworthy website ever)
Due to its military character and efficiency in battle, Irfan Shahîd described Palmyra as the "Sparta among the cities of the Orient"; even Palmyrene gods were depicted in full military uniforms.
These are the Gods mentioned.
Spoiler :


Palmyra seemed to be pretty good at everything. Wealth, Unique Architecture, Religion and War. Finding one or two to focus on will be interesting. The empire only lasted 3 years, so i'll look into why they collapsed and maybe we can work out what we need to focus less on.
 
NOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!!!!!! What have those Insular Fundamentalists done? It wasn't enough that the great Buddhas and countless other hindu or buddhist temples and holy sites have been destroyed, now they are destroying the remnants of an ancient civilization that existed long before their religion, or rather their twisted interpretation of it was founded? This is sacrilege!

.........ahem, sorry, history lover, history major, special fondness for ancient civs and Asian civs, just found out about this. Needed to get that rant off. My first exposure to Palmyra was playing Age of Empires Rise of Rome, which was a very long time ago so I know that it was eventually conquered by Rome. What I don't remember was whether or not it started as a Roman colony.
 
I was just thinking about a Palmyra civ because of the recent events. It's a tragedy that Palmyra's history has been destroyed. I'd love to help out. I can come up with some design ideas and do lua. BTW wasn't Hiram planning to do Palmyra? He might has something assets already.
 
Uighur_Caesar said:
I was just thinking about a Palmyra civ because of the recent events. It's a tragedy that Palmyra's history has been destroyed. I'd love to help out. I can come up with some design ideas and do lua. BTW wasn't Hiram planning to do Palmyra? He might has something assets already.
Click to expand...

Wouldn't surprise me if he did. I planned Palmyra a while back too, but never had any assets made. Maybe i'll try contact him.
 
I think Palmyra should definitely have the destroyed temples in their design somewhere. It might be better for E&D, "Construct the Temple of Baal" (or Bel, I've always heard the deity referred to has Baal but Wikipedia has it labeled as Bel) would be a great thing to include.
 
Uighur_Caesar said:
I think Palmyra should definitely have the destroyed temples in their design somewhere. It might be better for E&D, "Construct the Temple of Baal" (or Bel, I've always heard the deity referred to has Baal but Wikipedia has it labeled as Bel) would be a great thing to include.
Click to expand...

Tower Tomb or Tomb Tower (or Funerary Tower) would make a good Unique Building. They HAD Valleys of them.
Spoiler :



and they were what ISIS destroyed on the 4th of September, (today/yesterday according to timezones)
 
Firebug said:
Tower Tomb or Tomb Tower (or Funerary Tower) would make a good Unique Building. They HAD Valleys of them.
Spoiler :



and they were what ISIS destroyed on the 4th of September, (today/yesterday according to timezones)
Click to expand...

That looks like it could be a good replacement for the Monument, although it would have to distinguish itself from the Stele
 
I'd say the reverse would be better. The Stele is a Monument that gives Faith, but the Tomb Tower can be a Shrine that gives Culture (and perhaps is cheaper or something). It creates a parallel, but is the opposite at the same time.
 
GPuzzle said:
I'd say the reverse would be better. The Stele is a Monument that gives Faith, but the Tomb Tower can be a Shrine that gives Culture (and perhaps is cheaper or something). It creates a parallel, but is the opposite at the same time.
Click to expand...

With your idea it would be like this -
Monument: +2 Culture
Stele: +2 Culture +2 Faith

Shrine: +1 Faith
Tomb Tower: +1 faith +2 culture? --------------------- or Tomb Tower: +2 Faith +2 culture (same as Stele)

You need to research a shrine, but not a monument. So the Stele would instantly be more powerful than the Tomb Tower. So the Tomb Tower needs a much larger boost.
 
Firebug said:
With your idea it would be like this -
Monument: +2 Culture
Stele: +2 Culture +2 Faith

Shrine: +1 Faith
Tomb Tower: +1 faith +2 culture? --------------------- or Tomb Tower: +2 Faith +2 culture (same as Stele)

You need to research a shrine, but not a monument. So the Stele would instantly be more powerful than the Tomb Tower. So the Tomb Tower needs a much larger boost.
Click to expand...

I was thinking that the tomb tower could give bonus culture or tourism after discovering archeology.
 
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