The Deity Challenge Line-up #28 - Russia

Yeah you were "he" , anyways won this with Freedom at 205, stopped giving a after I saw that I won't make it sub 200. Teched wrong which cost me 2 turns as I couldn't buy boosters. It would've been 203 finish, I could've gotten a GS out in 200 and prob make it 202 then but I wanted sub 200 and was too lazy to calculate if I make it faster not delaying hubble.



Some questions:

As I'm myself pretty new to the game, I could've timed all my RAs to 198 I guess and then get the 50% amplifier for it as well. I had 6 RA, can they overflow like GS? I don't believe I would've made it sub 200 eitherway would just be good to know.

Also what's the exact formula for RA?

I guess I could bulb 2 GS to get to plastics instead of 1 and then get the GS-Points earlier and prob get the one GS out at 199, prob is that hubble would finish 200 then anyways.

Here's the link to the RA formula: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=540971

To avoid overflow complications, I think you will generally want to stagger your RAs at least 1 turn apart.

I avoid bulbing more than 1 GS per turn. I do not bulb if there is only 1 turn left to research the tech, and I am only bulbing late-game techs. I stagger my RAs to be at least one turn apart.

Do I need to be concerned about bulbing if there are only two or three turns left to research a tech? Or should that be okay?

It seems to me if I bulb a GS and then the next turn an RA expires that I am losing beakers. Is this something I should be checking for? Or should that be okay?

Thanks.

For bulbing GS you lose beakers if :

rest of techcost from currenttech + 5*Scienceouput < GS-Bulb power

So if a tech has 2000 left and you make 1200 beakers turn and your GS brings in 8600 you would lose 600 beakers at least I think that's the correct formula.

NiSaSh said:

anyways won this with Freedom at 205, stopped giving a after I saw that I won't make it sub 200.

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It always good to see new competitive player, so if you post your pre-ideology save I may try to play it in free time and maybe will be able to give you some advices

NiSaSh said:

rest of techcost from currenttech + 5*Scienceouput < GS-Bulb power

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Okay, and GS-Bulb power is your last 8 turns of science, correct? So if everything has plateaued, three turns left of research should be about okay. Four or more turns should be safe. Two left turns is throwing 1+ turns of science away, but maybe only one turn. But one turn left might indicate that you have already hit the cap so the overflow loss is not limited.

Do folks think I have that about right? If so, no math: Only bulb if 3+ turns left to research.

To be honest I don't think there is much room for advice after like Renaissance, it plays pretty straight forward. The biggest Edge comes from the early game as all those small edges snowball really hard. I would like to see somebody like you to play that out and then just compare certain turns. I feel like it would've been possible and probably good to go more than 4 cities, 5-6 maybe.

Okay, and GS-Bulb power is your last 8 turns of science, correct?

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You can see how much it gives ingame anyways, it's 8 last turns of science without socialpolicies of Rationalisam as far as I understood.

As far as my sub 200 goes, I think I can do it when I dump my money into religious CS I should be able to get 3 GS instead of 2 + GE. I spend a lot of money on the maritime ones, which doesn't bring as much as an additional GS. Gonna play tomorrow again.

NiSaSh said:

To be honest I don't think there is much room for advice after like Renaissance, it plays pretty straight forward. The biggest Edge comes from the early game as all those small edges snowball really hard. I would like to see somebody like you to play that out and then just compare certain turns.

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OK, as you think

I'm not very eager to play so cooked map (to make it easier) as this looks like (correct me Acken if I'm wrong)

It is the best map I've ever played on, but because it's so good you got a lot of strategic options early game which usually are limited in other starts.It's the first map I've ever played where I knew a sub200 is possible.

My last sub 200t SV was with this map (see Manpenzee post) -it is normal map rolled for HOF: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showthread.php?t=546507&page=6

My updates are on following pages.

And final result: http://forums.civfanatics.com/showpost.php?p=13808738&postcount=57

This map is by far the easiest non cooked map in the series, got my fastest CV on this map, may replay for SV to compare later.

Sclb said:

This map is by far the easiest non cooked map in the series, got my fastest CV on this map, may replay for SV to compare later.

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How do you know that? I would have to roll more than hundred times to get such map, so I'm pretty sure that Acken cooked it a little bit in IGE.

BTW Looking at DLC spreadsheet Spain map is the easiest (fastest all VCs)

Yes this map was modified a bit but it's too old for me to remember what exactly.

The start was already really easy with salts and deserts and I remember saying to myself that I would add a couple things to make it on the really easy side and see what results people would get with it.

I had never done a CV at deity, so I figured this was a perfect map for wonderwhoring.

I made a number of mistakes I think, but still got t213 victory, so I'm happy with that. I basically played a science game until Internet except for focussing a bit more on culture and great people, prioritizing production/wonders archeology a bit more than usual. The only wonder that I tried to get and failed was the leaning tower, which is a shame as the engineer would have come in handy. The International games were really tense, I have to admit I savescummed there because I underestimated the AI and stopped contributing too early.

All AI were pretty easy except the northwest one, to whom I gifted Novgorod and then bombed with three musicians with 2k, 4k, 4k strength. I planted on GS, bulbed one for labs which I bought in my two best cities, and bulbed the rest (5 or 6?) to get to Internet. I faith-bought two GM after Internet+visitor and one GE (to get SoL in St. Pete so it would get the +33 for having a wonder).




Mistakes / Questions:

- Took too many rationalism policies (1 left, 2 right), so I never got tier 3 freedom (3 turns left at victory). I thought that with the amount of culture I would get I would be able to afford the extra policies. On the other hand, this did get me to Internet quicker, which is also worth something, so it's difficult to see exactly (I got Internet at turn 206, in time to have internet+visitor center powered musicians). What is "normal" in a CV game? How do you get more culture?

- I probably built the musician guild too early, and ended up creating 2 great works of music (so I built broadway to get the third for the theming bonus). Although this gives pretty nice tourism, I guess it can never beat one or two more concert tours at the end. I guess you can start working musicians around the time the games are coming up?

- I guess it is really attractive to try to overlap the IG bonus with Internet and then quickly buy some musicians. In my game there was 1 turn in between the two, so maybe with better play that would have been possible.

- In the first play I messed up the musician timing in the end, it went much quicker than I thought so I had a musician left over and spent time walking them over rather than gifting a city. This lead to victory on t220 with a satisfying 608 tourism (http://imgur.com/btwC7pg). I then replayed from t205 to get to the t213 CV

- probably put too much early effort into religion (built haga sofia and borobudur). I had hoped to get some nice culture perks but everything was taken so ended up with guru and plowshares. The culture AIs all founded their own religion so the bonus only really helped with the eastern warmongers, who were no problem to get influential anyway. I could have taken the hermitage tourism bonus one, but I didn't think that that would really be worth it (?)

Again, this is my first deity CV, so all feedback is much appreciated (although I won't replay the map, probably going to Dutch or Indonesian next)

Edit: final question: Assuming that an earlier CV is possible, how do you manage to get to Internet in time while finishing Aesthetics tree and getting tier 3 ideology? Is a sub-200 CV possible? (Edit: never mind, just found this thread from ironfighter where he reports a t180CV, afaics without Internet but with Carnival - I guess the Internet route means that <200 will be very tough...)

I wouldn't recommend CV on the dutch map but you're welcome to try a difficult map for it.

How do you get more culture?

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You can bulb great writer for culture instead of great works. You can also ally cultural CS.

- I guess it is really attractive to try to overlap the IG bonus with Internet and then quickly buy some musicians. In my game there was 1 turn in between the two, so maybe with better play that would have been possible.

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It is difficult to time IG or even win it in some cases. However you want Internet asap.

T259 Culture Victory

Not very peaceful science victory T210. I wanted to try out a couple of ideas after originally getting a T246 DomV on this map.

fimbul said:

Not very peaceful science victory T210. I wanted to try out a couple of ideas after originally getting a T246 DomV on this map.

Spoiler :

Went for a 5 city lib NC with pyramids along the way. Other workers came from Hiawatha and CS to north. Thanks to lucky barb camp outside of Culture CS i got 198 influence and quick lib finish.

Machinary on T90 and took Hiawatha 2 city (~T100) and Venice Cap (~t112). Started conquest a bit too early, cities were under developed with shrines and temples only but at least venice had HG.

Edu around T110 but missed oracle so couldnt use early mercant + pillage repair GC to make up difference.

Morroco wiped out Hiawatha so I revived him, then fought against Shoshone to liberate 2 CS. Sci Theory T152 and 1x bulb for Plastics T180, won WF and Shaka declared against me. Lost 1 CS ally but no pain otherwise.

Even with 3x GW bulb I was a bit culture blocked with procurement on T206. I failed to reach radio in time for 2nd WC so no IG to help out.

1 GS left over on T210 so I guess i should have bulbed radio and saved oxford for plastics in order to get radio on time. I was very happy starved before Ideo so I think this was the critical mistake. No need for any loan from the AI for the 11k gc required.

Social policies: Full Lib, comm 3, Full rat, Freedom 6.

Wonders: pyramids, big ben, Taj mahal, LOTP, PT, SOL. Captured HS,HG, Lighthouse.

WC: WF, scholars.

Rel: Mother Earth, RC, Tithe, swords, RT. I missed pagodas by 2 times since prophet was late spawning.

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Hey thats great. Deity liberty win with early science and large expansion also bring in good science once NC is out. Keeping it penalty free and little opposition are both good starts.

T189 SV

T267 SV



I think I got a great start. Rushed for Petra and got Hanging Gardens on the way . Captured 4-5 workers from Hiawatha and reached Edu on turn 96. Then I got distracted and made several mistakes.....

1st to build 2 more cities in order to protect my capital from the schoschone and the other to grab the luxuries to the west. I had to support those cities which took resources from the main cities.
2nd I bulbed the GS too late. At the end I got too much techs and had to wait until I built the spaceship - and I had some lack of aluminium too...... That resulted in about a 10-15 turns delay.....

I always bribed zulu to attack the schoschone so that I was relatively secure from that side. At the end I got somewhat demotivated (as I felt that my middle/late game was pretty bad) and just wanted to finish so that I lost jaroslav to the schoschone which didn't really make a difference.

I went full tradition, then full rat and 2 in commerce. I took freedom to get statue of liberty, civil society and buy space ship parts with gold. However, this also delayed me somewhat as byzantine went order and I had to invest a lot in happiness.... (Thats another thing I have usually trouble with.... If I go for SV, I really fall of in culture and tourism and by that I get happiness problems if another player takes order or autocracy...)


I think my start is now more or less ok, however I always loose a lot of time in the middle game.... Have to work on that ^^