Sword of Islam: Strategy discussion

Speed is the essence of War--Sun Tzu.

I've never cut it this close to a UHV (playing it for the first time of course). There's really no time to waste. Capture Jerusalem, Acre and Sur first (working from Egypt and Damascus, respectively). Acre and Sur build harbors ASAP (because the Genoans and Venetians will be there--I almost didn't make it for the Venetian Quarters in Sur), while all Egyptian cities build units (catapults and fast units--hook the horse up near Tabuq quickly after capturing it from the "Kingdom of Acre").
Zengids then need to be dealt with at once after KoJ is dead (Antioch was theirs and they were quite strong), but the major campaign is BUILDING ROADS TO YEMEN! Madinah and Mekkah are easily captured. Tabuq and Madinah build catapults (since there's no time to get all of them all the way from Egypt). Cairo should just build lancers and horse archers from now on, until all 3 Yemeni cities are captured.
I almost thought I lost because I didn't get Mukallah, but thankfully it's in Hadhdramaut, so I vassalized Yemen. Then Makuria voluntarily vassalized.
The 1500 goal is probably just a piece of cake--now it's building stability and infrastructure during the golden age.

Spoken too soon--I forgot about the Mamluks.
So recalled nearly ALL troops from my empire and sat around Sinai. I stupidly built the Heroic Epic in Cairo so I had to build another one in Jerusalem to churn out catapults.
First order of business--recapture Cairo at all costs. And it was costly (half of my army of veteran lancers and trebuchets died getting it). Then Lower Egypt and work my way down. Vassalized them in the end (but they are unstable) and exchanged some techs. Now hopefully they'll stay stable and not respawn.

And the Mongols--Damascus (my new capital) had to fend for itself by building lancers so couldn't spare much effort in Egypt.

And my vassals all collapsed.

Finally, I built my stability from collapsing to stable--lots of mosques and courthouses.

Now it's weathering the next 200 years. I've never been so excited playing Civ up till now--not even RFC.

So the Mali gold event basically made my research nil for quite a while--I had to build all kinds of wealth-generating buildings and put a hold on my empire expansion for good. (It essentially makes maintenance too expensive for conquering another city). Was that intended? I didn't get it with the Mamluks.

Still, in the end, I got to the Taj Mahal, and was generating extra gold with 80% research and very solid stability (100+). Thankfully the Ottomans were taking their good time expanding so never got to me at all, and no war after the Mamluk revolt.

All this for a Neville Chamberlain.

I would really suggest letting the Mali gold event go away after about 20 turns(in fact it was only 12 years per wikipedia):

Mansa Musa’s crowning achievement was his famous pilgrimage to Mecca, which started in 1324 and concluded with his return in 1326. Accounts of how many people and how much gold he spent vary. All of them agree it was a very large group (the mansa kept a personal guard of some 500 men),[42] and he gave out so many alms and bought so many things that gold’s value in Egypt and the near east depreciated for twelve years.[43] When he passed through Cairo, historian al-Maqurizi noted "the members of his entourage proceeded to buy Turkish and Ethiopian slave girls, singing girls and garments, so that the rate of the gold dinar fell by six dirhams."

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AnotherPacifist said:

Now it's weathering the next 200 years. I've never been so excited playing Civ up till now--not even RFC.

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I totally agree, Ayyubids is one of the most fun civs to play together with KoJ.

You got really unlucky with that Mali event. I might have even rage quitted after it..

Jusos2108 said:

I totally agree, Ayyubids is one of the most fun civs to play together with KoJ.

You got really unlucky with that Mali event. I might have even rage quitted after it..

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Believe me, I almost did when my research went from 30% to 0% with -87 gold/turn after that Mali gold dump! (I had also 3-4 resources run out on me, and a flood plains turning to desert because of overfarming)

Patience (?addiction) won the day...and now I'm sleep deprived.

Can somebody answer this question: if the Sultanate of Rum is solid, will the Ottomans still spawn?

AnotherPacifist said:

Can somebody answer this question: if the Sultanate of Rum is solid, will the Ottomans still spawn?

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No they will not spawn. The Sultantae of Rum needs to have already collapsed (become the Karaminds) OR they SoR needs to be shaky (in the negatives)

Fairly straightforward...found Konya, cities flip to you (very unhappy cities too so draft some archers), capture all the way to the Black Sea and Trebizond, make peace with Armenia for now. Settler goes to Kaysun (has iron and horse, very strategic location to nerf Armenia and PoA). Make peace with Byzantines, because the PoA shows up. I killed most of their units, vassalized them after razing Sis and Edessa, then demanded all of their incense for Sufi Shrines. Traded away some Venetian/Genoan stuff but probably not necessary.
Capture remaining rebel cities (e.g. Tarsos) before taking on Constantinople.
Ankara builds Heroic Epic early and churns out trebuchets promoted to knock city walls down (5-6 of them will knock the Theodosian Walls down to 0% in 3 moves), then capture Constantinople.
Once Byzantines collapse, proceed to capture all the rest of the rebel cities (I actually razed some of them to found better ones).
My research was basically directed towards Music Theory, and I saved a great engineer to build the Tomb of Mevlana in Constantinople. Didn't build a single Han for attracting the Sufi but oh well.
Then built lots and lots of lancers and horse archers, paired with suicide catapults in anticipation of the Mongols. I almost underestimated how deep they would penetrate Asia Minor (as far as Ankara, in sets of 4 and 6) in the 1240's.
Now it's 1330 and I'm just slowly expanding my empire towards Mosul and the former Georgian cities. Patronage/wonder-monging.

Question: since the Byzantines are dead, does that mean that there won't be a Venetian Crusade (it was supposed to be in 1202-4)?

Finished it in 1460--Zengids collapsed but I vassalized the Ak Koyunlu (their horse archers are formidable but no match for my numbers) after recapturing Mosul and another city he flipped, plus their capital.

When I played as the Sultanate of Rum and conquered Constantinople (Constantinople doesn't get renamed as Istanbul when conquered by the Ottomans....), the Venetian Crusade never happened (for me anyway).

On a different note, has anyone been successful in fending off and ultimately destroying the Ottomans? I just played my first Ak Konyolu game and while I can and did repeatedly fend off the Ottoman attacks, the 3 or so stacks of doom that keep on coming every few turns or so is really annoying. I never got the time for the 3rd UHV and I was not going to fight two superpowers on my borders (and I had to keep an eye on the Mamluks).

I was Shia, got all of Mespotamia and Northern Syria, and in the tech lead (I LOVE Baghdad and the great spies it spawns every 10 turns or so).

Kostantiniyye is historically correct. "Istanbul" just means "the city" (correct me if I'm wrong) which it was only colloquially referred to until Kemalist Turkey made it the official name.

I found Telavi (1E of starting so you can get the copper) and Gori (1SE of iron).

Switch to Theocracy/Vassalage(first)/Agrarianism/Empire later on. Barracks for both cities and churn out catapults. Build XP fighting barbs initially, play nice with Armenia and Byzantines. Then strike at Armenia capital and city SW of Gori (to be renamed Dvin and Qarsi after capture). Capitualte Armenia but continue building troops because Manzikert will likely become rebel when Armenia collapses. Trebizond can be captured with the leftover troops, make peace ASAP with Byzantines for trading health/luxury resources. I found Poti on the coast just to be a barrier against barbs coming from the NW. Baku is captured--I really wanted to raze it, but to counter the Mongols I need a stopping barrier city there.

Research towards Engineering and Castle Building (although I went for other stuff and just traded for Castle Building). I built Bagrati Cathedral and Narekavank just for fun.

Gori has a mountain pass 2E/1N of it which has a forested hill--set some archers and spearmen there with Woodsman II. Build a fort there when you know Castle Building.

Cities just build monasteries and churches, and walls were prebuilt so that castles can come online ASAP.

Then LOTS of lancers to counter the Mongols. I actually overdid it since I was so scarred from the Rum experience...in the end there were only 3 stacks of 6 Mongols and some stray horse archers from the north, easily countered by Baku and the forested hill fort near Gori.

Wait for the Mongols to destroy Rum, then capture all their cities in Lesser Armenia (renamed Karin and Malatya). I also refounded Sivas and Samsoni just to deny them to the Beylik of Karaman and Byzantines. When the Mongol threat was gone, I founded 1 more city SE of capital and 1 next to all the flood plains west of Baku.

Zengids will likely declare war, just destroy their stack when they try to cross into Lesser Armenia around Manzikert.

The AI Georgia can also be quite impressive:

That's almost exactly my Georgian empire! I didn't even capture Mardini (didn't want to waste units on the Zengids).
(Except for Tbilisi I founded 1E and I also had Malatya and one more city between capital and Maragheb)

So here's this Kingdom of Jerusalem game.

This is actually my first time Playing SoI, so I hope it will certainly be a blast. So, as far as Egypt goes, do the Ayyubids have a conditional spawn that spawns them when the Fatamids are eliminated? Or will they rise up anyway?

If so, is it worth it to go after Mecca, or should I focus my forces more to the north?

Ayyubids will spawn if the Fatimids aren't stable enough, so it is in your best interests to keep them alive and well, however, sometimes the spawn can't be avoided. Are you going for UHV or playing just for fun?

Going after Mecca is a good choice.

Going after Mecca is good alone for the fact that it's on the way to Yemen whose incense you want

Jusos2108 said:

Ayyubids will spawn if the Fatimids aren't stable enough, so it is in your best interests to keep them alive and well, however, sometimes the spawn can't be avoided. Are you going for UHV or playing just for fun?

Going after Mecca is a good choice.

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Going after the UHV, so I guess if, as Leoreth said, if Mecca is on the way to Yemen, who had Insence, then I had better go southward.

What if you raze Cairo? Would Ayyubids still spawn?

I think so. Haven't tried it though.

The Ayyubids are centred in Dimashq anyway. As far as I know, the only way to avoid them is to keep Fatimids alive and stable, which is why I never push further into Egypt even if they provide no resistance (Ayyubids taking Damascus and attacking from two sides is ugly). There's no way to avoid the Mamluks though.