Great Prophet overpowered?

historix69

historix69

Emperor
Joined
Sep 30, 2008
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Last night a Great Prophet from the Iroquois converted my whole holy capital city. It was Size 38 and 100% my religion with about 28 pressure (marathon) and the next turn it was Iroquois religion with 32 followers of their religion and none of mine religion. My religion is present in about 20 cities while Iroquois religion was only present in about 3 cities.

I had to go back that turn and buy an inquisitor to prevent the conversion. (I had an inquisitor parked there for 500 turns and unfortunately used it on a city infected by spains religion a few turns before. Still learning G&K mechanics.)

A size 38 city is not a small village, it is like todays New York City or Tokyo. How can a prophet from a renaissance civilization convert a city with millions of people in one turn?

(I was lucky that I had not yet build CN Tower there because otherwise the Great Prophet eventually might have converted all my cities to his religion via TV.)
 
I agree with you on this one. It is very annoying and the AI does not get any benefit for converting the human player anyway.
 
Infantry#14 said:
I agree with you on this one. It is very annoying and the AI does not get any benefit for converting the human player anyway.
Click to expand...
Anything you deny your opponent is of benefit to you.

The AI denies you your faith in your city, removes any benefits you may have received from your faith being in that city and forces you to spend faith if you want to convert it back, delaying your next great person purchase.

All of these effects of conversion are costs and increased costs to you equals relatively lower costs to the AI, which is obviously of benefit to the AI.
 
You can do the same thing to the AI so the Great Prophet is not OP.

If you take the Messiah Enhancer Belief (Great Prophets 25% more powerful and cost 25% less faith) one Great Prophet can convert an entire four-city empire at the cost of a very minor diplo penalty. I've done this a few times and in those instances where I'd converted every AI city the religion that they founded did not recover sufficiently to convert back any cities.
 
I always take Messiah Enhancer Belief and go for Great Prophets and Pagodas all the way. Sometimes i get mosques as well.
 
TPQ said:
The AI denies you your faith in your city, removes any benefits you may have received from your faith being in that city and forces you to spend faith if you want to convert it back, delaying your next great person purchase.
Click to expand...

An exception here is if one of the followers belief you have is related to faith buildings . If the city is converted by another religion,those buildings won't go away because of that .
 
It's especially painful when the AI manages to get a prophet into your holy city before you could manage to spread it to a 2nd city.

Correct me if I'm wrong but after that you can't buy missionaries and inquisitors of your own religion anymore. Until your religion becomes the majority again which takes forever. A great prophet should work as well.

It might be a good tactic to use your 2nd great prophet for whiping out a holy city before it can spread instead of enhancing right away.

I'm not 100% sure if this is true though.
 
There's a workaround and that is to buy an inquisitor. It will 'freeze' the prophet and move them away.

If the GP is far away from a border, or if the AI really wants to convert your cities, it may hang around and shuffle to another city. So you want to be a little careful it doesn't convert another city instead. But I find an inquisitor can stop conversion of several cities in the area and you don't need 1 in every city.

I would buy one ASAP when they are cheaper even if you don't ever need it. It's better than rushbuying one for 600+ faith in the later part of the game.

That said I had complained about the fact that there are no diplomatic discussions around conversion. They should add this.
 
dexters said:
There's a workaround and that is to buy an inquisitor. It will 'freeze' the prophet and move them away.

If the GP is far away from a border, or if the AI really wants to convert your cities, it may hang around and shuffle to another city. So you want to be a little careful it doesn't convert another city instead. But I find an inquisitor can stop conversion of several cities in the area and you don't need 1 in every city.

I would buy one ASAP when they are cheaper even if you don't ever need it. It's better than rushbuying one for 600+ faith in the later part of the game.

That said I had complained about the fact that there are no diplomatic discussions around conversion. They should add this.
Click to expand...

This is all good and dandy but in my scenario, you can't buy an inquisitor because you've just founded your religion and don't have 200 faith.
You have to waste your 2nd prophet on converting back your capital which can take a while and during that time the enemy religion spreads to your other cities.

I had this happen to me once against Hiawatha and it's extremely annoying. Probably even worth a DOW because you are completely defenseless against this.
 
Then do it. Declare war on him, take his prophet and kill it. I find it very rare that the AI will be able to convert your holy city before you have enough faith to get an inquistor or have another city with it...
 
RealHuhn said:
This is all good and dandy but in my scenario, you can't buy an inquisitor because you've just founded your religion and don't have 200 faith.
You have to waste your 2nd prophet on converting back your capital which can take a while and during that time the enemy religion spreads to your other cities.

I had this happen to me once against Hiawatha and it's extremely annoying. Probably even worth a DOW because you are completely defenseless against this.
Click to expand...

You also can't buy Inquisitors until you enhance. You can only get Missionaries when you found until you enhance.

Yzman said:
Then do it. Declare war on him, take his prophet and kill it. I find it very rare that the AI will be able to convert your holy city before you have enough faith to get an inquistor or have another city with it...
Click to expand...

Haha unless you are like me in my one game where I only built a shrine for faith, and got my cities converted in the Industrial Era. At least I found out that does definitely wipe out your religion. Before Industrial, Great Prophets will be born in your holy city with your religion regardless of its current religion. However, in Industrial or later, you can only buy a Great Prophet in a city with your religion. I'm not sure if your holy city still exerts pressure on itself in Industrial or later since I think there were too many foreign religion cities nearby for it to even happen if it does.
 
ack @ not overpowered

even on immortal difficulty I always manage to convert the majority of the world to my religion,
you just have to really really watch out for the enemy prophets and don't be afraid of a quick conflict over this too (so you can kill him)

it's just like with that one sneaky settler that got past your lands and that you discover too late before he drops this really pain in the ass city near your much needed iron :D
 
IonTichy said:
ack @ not overpowered

even on immortal difficulty I always manage to convert the majority of the world to my religion,
you just have to really really watch out for the enemy prophets and don't be afraid of a quick conflict over this too (so you can kill him)

it's just like with that one sneaky settler that got past your lands and that you discover too late before he drops this really pain in the ass city near your much needed iron :D
Click to expand...

Do you use religious texts?

Both Tithe and Religious Texts are powerful but the AI don't beeline for either particularly. You can grab Religious Texts most of the time, and after Printing Press the pressure will just do the conversion for you.

You just need missionaries to convert a new area where there is no native pressure.
 
dexters said:
Do you use religious texts?

Both Tithe and Religious Texts are powerful but the AI don't beeline for either particularly. You can grab Religious Texts most of the time, and after Printing Press the pressure will just do the conversion for you.

You just need missionaries to convert a new area where there is no native pressure.
Click to expand...

Yes indeed, if I can get Religious Texts I get it. It has proven powerful even pre-Printing Press and if you add one or two missonaries you have at least your neighbourhood and surrounding under control religion-wise.
The exception to this rule can be handled by war ;)
 
If I see Jesus right now performing miracles you be dang right I will convert!
 
You can counter (e.g. block with units) and late game (since you city was size 38 clearly its not early :)) spending huge amounts of faith on a GP is a poor choice when you could be buying a GS or GE so I don't really thinks its OP

Your holy city will gradually return to its own religion also...
 
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