TheLastOne36
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- Joined
- Jan 17, 2007
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no, you just can't see quebec as an independent nation.
Again Silesia doesn't have independence, Ossetia doesn't, niether does Tibet or the Mayans, or the lapp, or the zulu or the australian aboriginees or abkhazia, or chechnya, and i could go on for quite a while... if my house declared independence from Poland, and succeeded would that be counted as a Political Nation?
no, you just can't see quebec as an independent nation.
An interesting random fact to add is probably that "Canada" and "Canadien" used to refer to the French people of North america before, but that has quite changed since then hasn't it.
What, you've never seen any of those Heritage Moments on CBC? Canada comes from the Indian word Kanata, which is Mohawk I believe, meaning village.
But when it started being used to designate a bunch of people, it was the "Canadiens francais".
I think you are confusing the issue a little bit. First of all, Willem understands the issues probably better than you do even as someone who went to school in Canada, just like you understand Polish nationalities/ethnicities much better than I do even though I was at the University of Lodz for a year studying Polish language. I would never dream of questioning whether Silesian is a nationality or not, so I don't think you should get involved directly in deciding whether Quebecois is an ethnicity or a nationality or simply the name for people who are of French extraction but live in Canada and want indepedence from the rest of Canada because they do not share the culture thereof. I think Willem and Simon have more right to pronounce on it than you do.no, you just can't see quebec as an independent nation.
Because they're not! Are you trying to explain to me the political nature of my own country now? If you don't know squat about how things actually work here, then you shouldn't be commenting. Like I mentioned, Quebec is no different than one of your own Voivodeships are, or the US state of California, or the Dutch province of Holland. They are not nor ever have been an independent nation. A cultural nation yes, but independant politically no.
I'm not going to argue that a Cultural Nation can't be a Political nation as you are pointing out because it is obviously wrong.
And as I have mentioned on several occasions now, this is a very sensitive issue in this country and I'm really beginning to resent you dragging this out. Perhaps I should return the favour by reminding you of your days as a Soviet puppet, or your complete failure to put up any sort of fight against Hitler. You've already brought in someone from Quebec on this issue which can only mean that this will become yet another thread that becomes bogged down in political discussion, when it's supposed to be about a game. Show enough discretion and common sense to drop the subject. Or am I going to have to put you on my ignore list as well?
I know it's sensitive, and i see that Emotion is getting in the way of actual facts, but all i'm saying is that Quebec should be an independent nation in the Game Colonization when france declares it "a colony" as should America or Canada be. And please don't comment on the Soviet puppet and Hitler when you obviously don't know a thing about Poland. For example, we were doing fine on our german front until the Soviets backstabbed us and attacked us in our other front. And don't say i don't know a thing about Canada, as i do, i had my education in here, and i've lived here from about half of my life. I still consider Canada to be my second home, and i have family in Canada.
The topic doesn't need to be dropped as it is about Colonization, and not about politics. Besides you'd agree with me that In real life, that if Britain never conquered Acadia and Quebec, they'd probably be independent nations by now.
I think you are confusing the issue a little bit. First of all, Willem understands the issues probably better than you do even as someone who went to school in Canada, just like you understand Polish nationalities/ethnicities much better than I do even though I was at the University of Lodz for a year studying Polish language. I would never dream of questioning whether Silesian is a nationality or not, so I don't think you should get involved directly in deciding whether Quebecois is an ethnicity or a nationality or simply the name for people who are of French extraction but live in Canada and want indepedence from the rest of Canada because they do not share the culture thereof. I think Willem and Simon have more right to pronounce on it than you do.I understand this part, Silesia is a nation, (although it is really close culturally to Poland that it doesn't really matter anyway)
What you are doing is mistaking ethnic nations (including the Silesians, who you would say are a nation...I would say ethnicity to remove all doubt about what you are talking; nationhood in my mind as a political scientist means you need a political unit for it to be so; I think you are translating "narodowosc" as "nationality" where actually IMO as a Polish speaker it should be translated as "ethnicity") for colonies/settlements created by other nations. Quebec is not the same as Ossetia because the Ossetians have an Ossetian ethnicity, whereas it is arguable that "Quebecois" means anything more than "person who comes from Quebec" which is like "Australian" meaning "person who comes from Australia", who might have a secondary ethnicity, e.g. there are a lot of Polish-Australians and Latvian-Australians as well as Anglo-Australians. So in this sense Quebecois could just be seen as Franco-Canadians, which would understate the case for separatism since are concentrated geographically and hence could be indepedent if they so chose. But that is not the same as being of, say, Ojibwa ethnicity, which is closer to being Silesian than being Quebecois is.
for the language part, remember i speak english as well. i also agree that it should translate to ethnicity. I also agree with you on the second part, as the Quebecois or French Canadians are nothing more then that. French Canadians..
...but all i'm saying is that Quebec should be an independent nation in the Game Colonization when france declares it "a colony" as should America or Canada be
Your comments had nothing to do with the game but were directed at the current political situation here in Canada. And just as I know nothing about Poland, you obviously know nothing about the political reality here in this country. You may have lived here for awhile but it seems plain to me that you didn't get to understand the country all that well, especially the issues between the French and the English. I'm guessing you spent most of your time in Quebec and didn't see much of the other side of the story.
I only had political comments because you made me go there, to continue the discussion.
Originally Posted by Willem
In the context of the game sure, but please don't refer to the real Quebec as a nation, as you seem to have been doing in your first post. It's not, nor ever has been one, as much as some of the Quebecois would like things to be otherwise.
Interesting, because when i lived and had my education in canada, it was always taught that Quebecois were a different people then the canadians, same with the acadians.
Quebecois are certainly constantly under pressure to redefine their identity.