Civ IV Intermediate Tactics and Gambits

I forgot to mention... You can get the new unit on the very turn that you get a new tech (but not a new resource), you don't have to wait for the next turn. The turn before you get the tech, order your unit to finish building. On the next turn, your tech will come in, and the unit will automatically switch to the upgraded form before being completed. This way, for instance, you can get a maceman in each of your cities on the very turn that you discover machinery.

Of course, this doesn't work when you need a new resource connected, because it doesn't get connected at the begining of the turn, but rather sometime later during the turn, when the worker gets his turn.
 
Of course, this doesn't work when you need a new resource connected, because it doesn't get connected at the begining of the turn, but rather sometime later during the turn, when the worker gets his turn.

Curious - I would expect the resource to be available as soon as the tech is discovered, if it happens to be connected (copper appearing in a connected mine, or under a connected city).

Anybody know off the top of their head what determines whether the warriors get converted to Axemen or Spearmen?
 
After staring at the code for a while, it looks to me as though...

1) The magic conversion should only work if the unit you are training becomes obsolete. For instance, Bronze Working alone doesn't convert your warriors - you need Hunting as well

2) It is done on a city by city basis. So you can found the city and start training a warrior, knowing that before it is finished your city will be connected and the warrior hammers will go to something useful.

3) The unit that your warrior will upgrade to is going to be the last one that appears in Civ4UnitInfos.xml - normally that means the one that is last when ordered alphabetically. I'm not sure what happens if a unique unit which replaces the last unit in the list comes before an alternative.
 
Curious - I would expect the resource to be available as soon as the tech is discovered, if it happens to be connected (copper appearing in a connected mine, or under a connected city).

Anybody know off the top of their head what determines whether the warriors get converted to Axemen or Spearmen?

Always spearman. This is why i prefer doing this with Alexander (Phalanxes), because i find normal spearmen quite useless most of the time (not playing Warlords).

Yes, you could hope for the resource to be already connected, but that's not a good move. Chances are it won't be, and then you'll complete a useless warrior instead of your spearman. Better to be safe than sorry, and not call for the warrior to be completed until you're sure that it will be obsolete before the beginning of your next turn.
 
I don't know whether anyone has mentioned this, but I thought this might be useful to add to the guide.

The AI places less value on techs that you have partially researched, meaning you can often trade for a tech they weren't originally willing to trade to you when you've researched part of it (how much of the tech you need to research may vary in different situations). This, however, means you have to invest at least a few turns of research in that tech before being able to get it from the AI. Here's how you can trade for it immediately: If the tech is sufficiently expensive beaker-wise (eg. Industrial techs), you can use a GP to lightbulb part of the tech (should shave off a few turns) and then try to trade for it again. Now that you have gotten part of it researched, the AI is more willing to trade that tech to you. If the AI still refuses, well, just continue researching it yourself. This can be considered the extension of a lightbulbing-intensive strategy (especially if you are playing an SE), allowing lightbulbing to remain relatively useful when it no longer yields enough beakers to make much difference on its own. The downside is you can only do this with techs that the GP can lightbulb.

For an example of this, refer to the EMC 4 thread, where I lightbulbed part of Physics so that I could get it from Huayna immediately.
 
Thanks, aelf! I'm going to look for an opportunity to do this in my current ALC game (and off-line too, if I have time). Then I'll look into writing it up.

I'm just curious, though, as to how the AI knows that you've researched part of a tech, since without spies, I can't tell what they're researching.
 
Thanks, aelf! I'm going to look for an opportunity to do this in my current ALC game (and off-line too, if I have time). Then I'll look into writing it up.

I'm just curious, though, as to how the AI knows that you've researched part of a tech, since without spies, I can't tell what they're researching.

the same computer plays the AI and calculates what it costs
now how on earth can it know?:D

This is something I use to see how close to a tech an AI is :
try to trade it to him at different moments.
When the price drops ridiculously you can say it is going to have it really soon.
No need to hang on that tech any longer, go trading.
 
I'm just curious, though, as to how the AI knows that you've researched part of a tech, since without spies, I can't tell what they're researching.

I don't know, but since this works, it doesn't really matter, does it?

Happy to help :)
 
Thanks for some great tips.

I have a question regarding the Gambit.


1. The Oracle/Metal Casting/Pyramids Gambit
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Because the 2nd city’s GP generation has to play catch-up, the most critical part of this gambit is to build the forge in the second city within 6 turns of finishing the Oracle. This is no mean feat. This is why you will build a barracks or obelisk in the city, but stop building it when you’re one turn from finishing. You want to whip this building to completion so that the overflow of hammers goes towards the build of the Forge (and in the capital, towards the Oracle).
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Why the forge needs to completed within 6 turns of finishing the oracle?
Is there something specific that suppose to happen when it is finished in 6 turns?
 
""Why the forge needs to completed within 6 turns of finishing the oracle?
Is there something specific that suppose to happen when it is finished in 6 turns?""

You want to have great engineer from that city before your oracle city creates prophet. If you wait more that 6 turns your forge city can´t beat oracle city
 
Of course, this doesn't work when you need a new resource connected, because it doesn't get connected at the begining of the turn, but rather sometime later during the turn, when the worker gets his turn.

This is wrong. It is only a bug. After the road is made, enter the city screen then exit. Re-enter and you will be able to produce the axeman/spearman.
 
You don't understand what i'm saying. Of course you can produce axemen AFTER the road is made. That's what i said. But you can't produce them the turn before, or at the beginning of the turn where the road WILL be made.

However, you can produce them at the beginning of the turn where you discover a new tech. That's not a bug, and it makes perfect sense.
 
You don't understand what i'm saying. Of course you can produce axemen AFTER the road is made. That's what i said. But you can't produce them the turn before, or at the beginning of the turn where the road WILL be made.

However, you can produce them at the beginning of the turn where you discover a new tech. That's not a bug, and it makes perfect sense.

oh sorry, i misunsderstood. I though you were talking about this bug that occurs when the copper just get connected :

http://i139.photobucket.com/albums/q306/kiershar/copper_warrior_bug.jpg
 
Hey,

I absolutely don't agree about the trade tactics expressed in the article. First and foremost I think that even getting 1 Gold per Surplus Resource is better than having it piled up idle somewhere.

In the beginning when there's hardly any inflation 1-2 gold coins from each of a few opponents matter a lot. It gives you an edge.

+Relations
+Money (for Tech Race or similar)
+Causes others to depend on you.
+Could rule out other third party trade treaties.


-AI gets additional benefits.

+But we assume it's common that most players have standard military resources like iron. If you supply another player with iron he'll increase the total war costs (destruction) generated by him and his enemy.

You might argue that the other player will get an edge too. Yes he will compared to the other players (not you, as you're trading a surplus resource and getting money for it). BUT, if you do deals with multiple players your edge will be a lot bigger. In the end you could end up receiving 100 gold for maybe 6-7 resources. The nice thing is that these resources are spread out on multiple civilizations while you amass loads of money alone.

By using this technique I usually get more money from foreign countries than my own country would generate itself.

This is pretty much an implementation of neo-liberal economics. But as someone wrote above one has to learn to distinguish game and real life actions and morals.
 
Hey,

I absolutely don't agree about the trade tactics expressed in the article. First and foremost I think that even getting 1 Gold per Surplus Resource is better than having it piled up idle somewhere.

In the beginning when there's hardly any inflation 1-2 gold coins from each of a few opponents matter a lot. It gives you an edge.

+Relations
+Money (for Tech Race or similar)
+Causes others to depend on you.
+Could rule out other third party trade treaties.


-AI gets additional benefits.

+But we assume it's common that most players have standard military resources like iron. If you supply another player with iron he'll increase the total war costs (destruction) generated by him and his enemy.

You might argue that the other player will get an edge too. Yes he will compared to the other players (not you, as you're trading a surplus resource and getting money for it). BUT, if you do deals with multiple players your edge will be a lot bigger. In the end you could end up receiving 100 gold for maybe 6-7 resources. The nice thing is that these resources are spread out on multiple civilizations while you amass loads of money alone.

By using this technique I usually get more money from foreign countries than my own country would generate itself.

This is pretty much an implementation of neo-liberal economics. But as someone wrote above one has to learn to distinguish game and real life actions and morals.
Well, it really comes down to the situation in the game.

Say I'm building military because I plan to take on Rome in a few turns. Caesar has 2 GPT to offer me; the only surplus resource I can offer him is iron.

Does it really makes sense to trade iron to him in those circumstances? So he can build better units (Praetorians) that will, in turn, cost me far more in the long run? I'll lose more hammers through additional unit losses and encounter higher war weariness resulting in lost production, commerce, and research. All for, say, 20 gold (2 GPT over 10 turns minimum).

Another factor is wonders. Would you trade a surplus marble resource to another civ for a couple of GPT when you're trying to build the Great Library and they also possess knowledge of Literature? Clearly you run the risk of missing out on the wonder.

So, as is often the case in Civ, it depends.

That being said, if there's no other danger, I'll often trade a strategic resource to a distant civ that poses no danger to me. One of my favourite resources to trade away is any and all copper I have provided I have iron, especially in the long era in between the Colossus and the Statue of Liberty. The AI will pay through the nose for copper, even if it has iron. Though frankly, that sometimes feels like a bit of an exploit.
 
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