Turn Discussion Thread II - Turns 51-100

Snaaty,
That all sounds about right to me. I guess there's a possibility we may still hear from Ragnar, but it does seem doubtful. I think a Construction-era war on, most likely, Q is the way to go here.
 
To be honest, I feel we should go IronWorking before Writing....

Anyway, I did pvm numerous people on their team. The fact that Ragnar finally logged in, but has ENDED-TURN tells me they are not interested in discussing any trades, or they wouldn't have ended-turn. I also recieved no official response from any of them. I only had one person finally return a pvm back and told me that it's posted on their forum we made contact (duh). But nothing else..... oh well, so 4v2... probably me and Snaaty should have used aliases when we signed up here?

Anyway well, despite 4v2, I can tell you right now the relations between Carthage and Ragnar have to eventually break down. They have cities culture pressing so close to each other... someone has to break somewhere down the road.

Worse case scenario for us is if they come to their senses and Ragnar gifts his city to Carthage. Let's keep our fingers crossed on that one.
 
I see now, Ragnar decided to refuse Open Borders with us. Even more wonderful....

Looks like we have no choice but to chop out that trireme now.... or we'll never be allowed to meet up with Pacal.
 
I agree with obsolete on Iron Working before Writing. We are settling now, so knowing the location of Iron is more immediately useful. It will still probably be a little time before we start getting Libararies up.
 
Turn 70 --> 1200 BC

  • We settle COPPER CITY (deception name)
  • Galley is returning with another warrior
  • Chopped 2 forests for wb
  • Capital switches to Settler
  • We tech IW as fast as is possible


 
Um, a suggestion, can we maybe tech writing quickly next, it would be nice to be able to utilise the mids... Also do we have any idea how far from contacting pacal we are and I noticed that we haven't had any form of contact with ragnar yet despite having met them last turn...
 
Um, a suggestion, can we maybe tech writing quickly next, it would be nice to be able to utilise the mids... Also do we have any idea how far from contacting pacal we are and I noticed that we haven't had any form of contact with ragnar yet despite having met them last turn...

We are using Mids - we're in Police State to get some units out pronto.
 
I fail to see how writing is more important than our immediate danger. We're stuck in a 4v1 without even metals yet, not even hunting. How much more do you think we can stall this?

Our cities which are capable of running specialists are busy whipping away pop so that defeats the point of libraries right now
 
Turn 71 --> 1160 BC

  • Capital re-works plots to get settler out 1 turn faster
  • SE Farm works a Gem to ensure tech pace is fast
  • Copper City works un-improved horses 1 more turn to get trireme out next turn

* Note: Carthage is researching compass for UB


 
Sorry, I didn't make my stance clear. I'm fine with teching IW first, I think that everyone agrees that that is our main priority. I just wanted to make sure that writing was coming in soon (or even next) and that we were committing to spend our stockpiled gold on techs now because there's no sense waiting for tech trades for obvious reasons...
 
Ragnar wont' accept open borders. This may block us from ever making contact with Pacal. We may have no choice but to DoW.
 
Turn 72 -- > 1120 BC
  • Workers try to road horses
  • Copper City works clam tile, build switches to granary

Note: Trireme is out the door and will head to opposite end of the world in shortest possible way.


 
At this point, going through diplomacy threads we see that currently there is 4 teams on one side and us and Pacal on the other (and we haven't even met Pacal) so it's 4v1v1 situation.

In order to go through this game, we need partners, and we need them bad, but so far no luck. When we were in position to offer trades, we did, but got stonewalled by almost everyone. We asked a lot of teams what do they want and made no specific demands nor threats. I think now is the time for one. I think that a message should be written and sent to all teams (maybe even in one email to make greater effect, but this is to be discussed). In this message demands should be made so clear, that it will give us an idea of how should we conduct our business. I also think that we should start making clear cut plans for who we will be attacking. I know that I advocated going after Q first, but I think we should maybe go for less obvious target, like Amazon or Sirius. I think that NO ONE in this game expect our attack, and if we can't win, let's make sure that one the favorites goes down with us. Our time-frame is limited and should be used as soon as possible since the game is still not in full swing. The email (I think) should go like this:

Dear (put team name in here),

Without wiggly words and beating around the bush, please hear what Mavericks has to say! In our attempt to make diplomatic relations with your nation we tried our best to offer a welcoming hand and give a lot of things which were in our hands at the time. But instead almost all of our offers fell into deaf ears. We got stonewalled from some of your (I think it is safe for us to assume at this point) allies and we do not appreciate this isolation set upon us with no particular reason. If some of our players made false remarks about some in-game events, have no mistake that those remarks were made only to provoke response from a team which did not answer us for days.

We understand that at the present moment we don't have anything to offer to you, but we would like to extend our offer to the future and make solid foundations to our plans, so we can coordinate future expansions and research so we don't step on each other toes.

The first offer would be signing NAP agreement effective immediately for next (30-50) turns. We will wait for your response 48 hours from the moment this email is sent. Should you don't respond to this email we will assume that your nation has hostile intentions towards us and we will choose how to act upon that.

We extend this offer to all teams that we currently know of, there is no back play to this offer.

Looking forward to your response.
 
Ragnar wont' accept open borders. This may block us from ever making contact with Pacal. We may have no choice but to DoW.

First of all why should we DOW? Why not Pacal find a way to find us. We can expect that they are backward a lot, so they wouldn't be of huge help anyway.

We should send ultimatum that I have put together, demand NAP and open borders, and if they don't respond sail through their territory.

Then no one can say that we back stabbed, it might give us leverage later on.

This game is far from being done. But I think it's time to show that we have some bal*s.
 
Pacal can never reach us because Cyrus and Carthage are sinking all his ships.

We have to dow or we won't be allowed to cross territory to reach them.
 
This game is far from being done. But I think it's time to show that we have some bal*s.

Damn straight! Just I think sinking galleys with triremes is going to be more effective than a mass message to everyone. We'll just be confirming to everyone that no one is in fact working with us and thus we lose any bluff leverage we may still have. Forcing the others to come to us and not the other way around is how we show we're not to be screwed around with. My opinion is the above proposed message you send will fall on deaf ears and ultimately backfire. They've obviously got allies and they're obviously working together with each other. To put it bluntly, they have no need for us, especially since MC is not a monopoly tech anymore. Sending the message to me gives the impression of desperation and may further any plans they have to aggressively move against us. They'll respond and accept the proposed NAP (not open borders - if they wanted to 'fake play nice' they would have opened them already), but don't expect them to actually keep their end of the deal, not when it's already 3 (maybe 4) v 1. They'll accept only to stall us. Our only actual leverage that we have is the DoW and you have to think they know this since they're all stonewalling us. Giving them time with a 30 turn or whatever NAP ultimately hurts us. Over time, we will lose ground to the 'idiot triumvirate' since I highly doubt we'll have anything to trade them to even start relations. So I think we play dumb, build up our triremes while expanding as much as we can to block Q, then go start sending some shipping to the bottom.
 
@BL, ok I guess it was fair to send them fair warning.

@obs, send them to the bottom.

Should we have a poll about this??
 
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