Tomatekh's New Civilizations

So for just the CPP without the balance patch part would I need the original olmecs? Also I have been trying some other of the civs with cpp just because I like the civ 4 diplomacy add on, and was wondering if there were known issues. No problems with goths or champa so far.

Dracleath said:

So for just the CPP without the balance patch part would I need the original olmecs? Also I have been trying some other of the civs with cpp just because I like the civ 4 diplomacy add on, and was wondering if there were known issues. No problems with goths or champa so far.

Click to expand...

Yes; the CBP version of the Olmecs is for the CBP. If you're just using the core CP, you'd use the version that's here.

If you've been using them with the core CP, then there won't be any real chance of issues; if you're using the CBP, expect balance issues and irreglarities (unless Tomatekh supports the CBP...)

Okay, I've been hunting down a rather bizarre bug that crashes the game after "end turn" is clicked (well, on player 2's turn, but who they are is irrelevant). What's bizarre about it are the circumstances behind it. I recently added a few piecemeal things from the CBP to the CP (just some reworked UAs), but I did test this with a normal, untouched CP (latest version for both).

I don't know why, but with CP, More Luxuries, Shang, and Sioux, the game crashes. Removing any one of the four makes things work again.

Hmm, I'll have to look into it a bit more. Were both Shang and the Sioux in the game? Their lua doesn't seem to be running. The log shows the "check" print statement, meaning the mod loaded, but not the "scripts" print statement that fires if the civ is in the game (and which contains all of their abilities).

On a more general note, sorry for the lack of recent activity on my part. To be honest, I find the new civfanatics layout a little off-putting, but, really, I'm just a little frustrated with Civ VI at the moment. I just want to be able to release a version of HR for VI and the inability to add basic icons has kind of soured my modding mood of late. So, all my projects are sort of in limbo until my mood returns

I have no idea if either were in the game. I just loaded a tiny map with random civ. Sometimes I was Sioux, sometimes Shang, sometimes neither. But always there was a crash when those four mods were together.

Tomatekh said:

Hmm, I'll have to look into it a bit more. Were both Shang and the Sioux in the game? Their lua doesn't seem to be running. The log shows the "check" print statement, meaning the mod loaded, but not the "scripts" print statement that fires if the civ is in the game (and which contains all of their abilities).

On a more general note, sorry for the lack of recent activity on my part. To be honest, I find the new civfanatics layout a little off-putting, but, really, I'm just a little frustrated with Civ VI at the moment. I just want to be able to release a version of HR for VI and the inability to add basic icons has kind of soured my modding mood of late. So, all my projects are sort of in limbo until my mood returns

Click to expand...

Have faith sir, you do really good work!

Minor question: are the Olmec Colossal Heads supposed to connect strategic resources like other GP tile improvements? Because they weren't doing so in my game. I didn't want to rip up the UI and jungle just to get at some aluminum...

The Colossal Heads don't improve resources. I forget the exact reason why, but I believe it was a technical or display issue rather than something we did for balance.

Interesting, alright. I suppose it works out balance-wise in the end anyway since the Colossal Heads are so strong.

So, I finally released a version of HR for Civ VI. I'm going to try and get back to Civ V and hopefully post builds of my final mods in the near future. Similar to the Kuikuro and other civs I've posted early, the builds will be missing art but will be otherwise complete.

In an effort to actually release my final Civ V mods, here’s a build of... not Poverty Point

The Mississippi
http://www.dropbox.com/s/zypwqeyinsea0sv/The Mississippi (Brave New World) (v 18).civ5mod



Except for the unit model and civ map, the build is missing almost all art (using various replacements from the base game). Everything else including mod support should be there. Thanks to DJSHenninger for converting the UU model and to JFD and Sukritact for help with the interface code.

Various screenshots that somewhat but don’t really explain the abilities:



So, a little background. The Mississippi was sort of a side project I was working on; a final bonus civ to release alongside Poverty Point. I actually put together the civ rather quickly. After I had coded Poverty Point, I got into a discussion with some people with how surprising it was that there are almost no mods for the Mound Builder cultures. Coincidentally, a documentary on Cahokia also ended up airing on TV that same night. I was somewhat inspired and the next day basically put together and coded the entire civ. Then it sort of sat with the rest of my semi-finished Civ V stuff, then Civ VI came along, then etc.

Anyway, I should hopefully have a build for Poverty Point sometime next week.

Tomatekh said:

In an effort to actually release my final Civ V mods, here’s a build of... not Poverty Point

The Mississippi
http://www.dropbox.com/s/zypwqeyinsea0sv/The Mississippi (Brave New World) (v 18).civ5mod

Spoiler :

UA: Maize Economy: Your highest Population Cities form Regional Centers which increase Food and decrease Building Maintenance in nearby Cities.

Spoiler :

UU: Falcon Dancer (Longswordsman): If trained in a Regional Center, is significantly quicker to produce (+50%) and will begin with bonus XP equal to the City's Population. Does not require Iron.
UB: Mound Temple (Temple): Provides Faith and Science based on the latitude of the City. Centers the equator on the world map.

Except for the unit model and civ map, the build is missing almost all art (using various replacements from the base game). Everything else including mod support should be there. Thanks to DJSHenninger for converting the UU model and to JFD and Sukritact for help with the interface code.

Various screenshots that somewhat but don’t really explain the abilities:

Spoiler :

So, a little background. The Mississippi was sort of a side project I was working on; a final bonus civ to release alongside Poverty Point. I actually put together the civ rather quickly. After I had coded Poverty Point, I got into a discussion with some people with how surprising it was that there are almost no mods for the Mound Builder cultures. Coincidentally, a documentary on Cahokia also ended up airing on TV that same night. I was somewhat inspired and the next day basically put together and coded the entire civ. Then it sort of sat with the rest of my semi-finished Civ V stuff, then Civ VI came along, then etc.

Anyway, I should hopefully have a build for Poverty Point sometime next week.

Click to expand...

Good enough for me!

Wow, nice surprise and really neat idea!! Here's hoping the missing art will be found under the x-mas tree...

Tomatekh said:

UB: Mound Temple (Temple): Provides Faith and Science based on the latitude of the City. Centers the equator on the world map. No maintenance.

Click to expand...

Latitude?! How?!

FallenAesir said:

Latitude?! How?!

Click to expand...

The yields of the building are different depending on how far the city is from the center of the map:



Closer to the equator gives you more faith, closer to the poles gives you more science.

Continuing my effort to finish my Civ V stuff is... still not Poverty Point (I'm working on it).

However, the Cradles of Civilization Pack has been updated to include the Olmec!

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=616830495
http://www.dropbox.com/s/y5h7kklxrm9jblp/Cradles of Civilization Pack (Brave New World) (v 15).civ5mod

This also means that, at long last, the Cradles of Civilization Pack is finally complete!

The version of the Olmec included is also an updated version than the one currently posted here/on steam. It includes various balance changes, bug fixes, and mod support updates (JFDs Great Doctors will finally create Colossal Heads that give health). However, the most noticeable and useful change is an additional bit of interface:



Which will now show if you are currently in a Venus Cycle as well as how many unique technologies you currently have to generate tourism.

Since Leugi uploaded the mod, I actually can't update the standalone downloads. I will pass along the new version to Leugi, but, in case he never comes back, you can download the standalone version here:

http://www.dropbox.com/s/40j2l7mhm3vf17f/The Olmec (Brave New World) (v 30).civ5mod

Please let me know if you encounter any problems with the updates to either the Cradles Pack or the Olmec. It's been a while since I touched either mod (or Civ V stuff in general) and was feeling a little rusty, so I might have made some careless mistakes

Great stuff! Gave it a test-run and it all plays really well! Haven't found any big bugs, but just a few (primarily aesthetics) comments below:

Olmec:
- UI: Indeed, the Greact Doctor works and provides health. However, I use all of JFD gameplay mods and noticed that Great Scout is unable to create CH (only Great Person not able to, I think). Perhaps it can also gain Golden Age points? For the Great Dignitary/Magistrate this works fine, but would be neat if Golden Age points show on map as yields?
- The 'button' for the 'venus cycle' remains visible on-screen, also when in city screen for instance. Not sure it adds value there and looks bit messy, so perhaps opportunity to only show when in normal/map view? The icon is of Colossal Heads but possibly the Olmec icon would look better/make more sense?
- The 'button' for the 'venus cycle' only occurs during AI/game processing. 2 examples: I discovered calendar through bonus science from the UU, but didn't yet get the 'button' on-screen. Also, when loading the game after having discovered calendar already, the button is not on-screen, but only when ending turn and processing starts.
- In culture screen, the 1 tourism for technology shows as tourism for buildings.

The Mississippi:
- Same as for the Olmec, the 'button' for regional screen only shows up during turn processing (e.g. when loading game it doesn't show in your first turn). Also, stays visibile in lower right corner in city screen.
- On the Regional Centers: what does 'administration level' do and how is it calculated?
- Falcon Dancer: what is the exact production bonus in Regional Centers? Felt like +50% production speed or something, but was using JFD gameplay mods and with the happiness adding to production was difficult to single out.
- As mentioned, hopefully you will be able to make 'full' civilization out of this with unique art, since really cool concept. Do you expect this to happen? Related to this, will you put it on Steam too?

Cradle City-States Pack:
- A very weird one, that I actually haven't been able to re-produce in the last few games: there seemed to be a conflict with this and the gameplay mods I use (all JFD's, EE, E&D, RER, CP, HR) in the sense of screwing up the the city banner in the normal map view (so where it shows city name, turns till growth, production, etc.). Basically, all the icons/text don't appear inside the city banner anymore, but only half.. Singled this mod out by testing loading/unloading mods until this one seemed to be offender on multiple occasions. Seemed so weird to me, that I didn't immediately post about it. Realize this is not much to do investigation on, so will post screenshot etc. when occuring again.


Finally, as I use all of your civ mods incl cradle CS, would it be better to load the full Cradle pack instead? If you make updates to individual mods, will these automatically flow into the Cradle pack?

Thanks for all the great work!

Stef09 said:

I use all of JFD gameplay mods and noticed that Great Scout is unable to create CH (only Great Person not able to, I think).

Click to expand...

I'd argue that this is by design - the Great Scout differs hugely from the other Great People, to the point where it barely counts as one imo.

Stef09 said:

The 'button' for the 'venus cycle' only occurs during AI/game processing. 2 examples: I discovered calendar through bonus science from the UU, but didn't yet get the 'button' on-screen. Also, when loading the game after having discovered calendar already, the button is not on-screen, but only when ending turn and processing starts.

Click to expand...

This is presumably because the Venus Cycle stuff is set up to work on PlayerDoTurn; if there's a way to get round this, it's probably more effort than it's worth.

Stef09 said:

In culture screen, the 1 tourism for technology shows as tourism for buildings.

Click to expand...

Welcome to Modding, where all your traits are secretly buildings

Stef09 said:

A very weird one, that I actually haven't been able to re-produce in the last few games: there seemed to be a conflict with this and the gameplay mods I use (all JFD's, EE, E&D, RER, CP, HR) in the sense of screwing up the the city banner in the normal map view (so where it shows city name, turns till growth, production, etc.). Basically, all the icons/text don't appear inside the city banner anymore, but only half.. Singled this mod out by testing loading/unloading mods until this one seemed to be offender on multiple occasions. Seemed so weird to me, that I didn't immediately post about it. Realize this is not much to do investigation on, so will post screenshot etc. when occuring again.

Click to expand...

Lua log?

Stef09 said:

Finally, as I use all of your civ mods incl cradle CS, would it be better to load the full Cradle pack instead? If you make updates to individual mods, will these automatically flow into the Cradle pack?

Click to expand...

I believe the Cradle pack may be more up-to-date than the individual mods; should probably let Tomatekh settle that one though, rather than put words into his mouth.

Stef09 said:

Stef09...

Click to expand...

Great Scouts: Yeah, Great Scouts don't count for the great people abilities in any of my mods (Olmec, Poverty Point & Shang). This was intentional when I first added these type of abilities with Shang (as I wanted to reduce the number of sacrifices), and I chose to keep it consistent in my later mods.

Interface: Same thing, all my mods that have some sort of extra interface (Olmec, Poverty Point, Shang & Xia) will only update at the start of a turn. In almost all cases, the bonuses these interfaces show are consistent throughout the turn (and can only change at turn start) so there's no need to have them dynamically update mid-turn. Updating each to dynamically change mid-turn would require a ton of extra checks in lua at the various city-screen open, tech researched, unit moved, city conquered, building built, etc. hooks that I don't really consider it worth it for a minor aesthetic issue that doesn't affect gameplay.

The interface still showing in the city screen is something I hadn't noticed, though. JFD, in his infinite greatness, has actually already provided a fix, so I will update the mods in the near future. Thinking about it, my mods that use Sukritact's City Info Stack probably also have this issue, but, again, this should only be aesthetic and not affect gameplay.

Tourism: Blame Firaxis. Tourism isn't technically a real yield, so we have to cheat to get it to count as one.

GA Points on Map: This would require a DLL edit, which would then make the mod incompatible with other DLL mods. However, the Olmec mod is consistent in that there is only one head type that doesn't have an extra visible yield (so any head without additional culture/faith/gold/production gives GA points). The golden age tooltip on the top panel does also update (and dynamically mid-turn, no less) to show how many GA points you are currently earning from heads.

Administration Level: This value is static and correlates to the distance the city is from the regional center. Essentially, the closer a city is settled to a regional center, the more food & maintenance reduction it can earn. I believe the only way I implemented to enhance this effect is with one of the civ's decisions when using Sukritact's E&D mod.

Falcon Dancer: It's a bonus 50% production modifier applied when the unit's production is calculated at turn end

Full Release: No idea. If they ever do get art they will be posted on Steam. Otherwise, at this point, I'm satisfied just having posted the build.

Cradle City-States Pack: That shouldn't be happening, as all my mods should have JFD support. I'll look into it, but it might be the general mod issue that happens where sometimes Civ V doesn't completely unload a mod from a previous game, so then ID order and font icons are all messed up when you start a new game. I'd suggest to try it with the full Cradles Civ Pack (which also includes the city-states) and see if it still happens.

A General Note on JFD Mod Compatibility: As said, all my mods should be fully compatible and updated for JFD's mods. The big exception is the Kuikuro and ExCE. Whatever CP DLL change allows blocking movement in jungle before optics, also blocks building any non-route improvement in jungle (even if a unit should be able to) before researching optics. This also extends to the Olmec, in that great people can't build heads in jungle before optics. There's nothing I can do about this. I suggest giving an AI Kuikuro the optics tech with IGE at game start, if you still want to have them in ExCE games.

Chrisy15 said:

Chrisy15...

Click to expand...

Thanks for the help!

Stef09 said:

Finally, as I use all of your civ mods incl cradle CS, would it be better to load the full Cradle pack instead? If you make updates to individual mods, will these automatically flow into the Cradle pack?

Click to expand...

Chrisy15 said:

I believe the Cradle pack may be more up-to-date than the individual mods; should probably let Tomatekh settle that one though, rather than put words into his mouth.

Click to expand...

Actually, I've been a good uploader and the versions in the Cradles Pack and standalone are identical So, yes, if you use all the mods, there's no reason not to use the pack.

(The Olmec are the one exception, as only Leugi can upload the standalone version, but the version in the Dropbox link I provided is identical to the one in the pack. The pack also has an SQL file which allows you to set individual civs as playable/unplayable, if you only wanted to use 4 out of the 5 civs, etc..)

Tomatekh said:

Administration Level: This value is static and correlates to the distance the city is from the regional center. Essentially, the closer a city is settled to a regional center, the more food & maintenance reduction it can earn. I believe the only way I implemented to enhance this effect is with one of the civ's decisions when using Sukritact's E&D mod.

Click to expand...

Thanks for all the feedback. Will have a second look at Administration Level: believe a city 4 tiles away had 100% and a city 5 tiles away 33% with some impact on the bonuses, but couldn't quite figure out how it worked... Think 1 of the decisions unlocked an additional +1 ring for a Regional Center, not sure about Administration Level though..

Tomatekh said:

A General Note on JFD Mod Compatibility: As said, all my mods should be fully compatible and updated for JFD's mods. The big exception is the Kuikuro and ExCE. Whatever CP DLL change allows blocking movement in jungle before optics, also blocks building any non-route improvement in jungle (even if a unit should be able to) before researching optics. This also extends to the Olmec, in that great people can't build heads in jungle before optics. There's nothing I can do about this. I suggest giving an AI Kuikuro the optics tech with IGE at game start, if you still want to have them in ExCE games.

Click to expand...

Perhaps I should be asking in the ExCE thread, but do you think this could be solved in ExCE? The issue of not being able to improve in jungle before Optics also applies to regular improvements like plantations or mines, so it's not unique issue for your civ-mods it seems.

A unit with Immunity to Jungle Attrition is able to move into the Jungle. Don't have any knowledge of all the logic involved, but perhaps the same way that Immunity allows a unit to move into Jungle, it could be expanded upon to also unlock improving? In the civ-mods, you would then only need to include Immunity as part of the UA by default.

From wiki:
Jungle Jungle 5 damage per turn. Cannot heal. Cannot cross until Optics[2]. May lose or gain movement when a turn begins.