Exploration Continued Expanded (Obsolete)

shaglio · Feb 11, 2015

JFD said:
I think people still want to keep their Scout-Archers, but IDK. It would be easy enough to disable the effects for starting units, I just wanted to get some practical feedback on the matter before doing anything about it.

In the game I was playing last night, my Scout popped a ruin and became a Scarcher. My initial reaction was, "Noooo!" Much different from my old reaction.

janboruta said:
Yeah, exactly. Like they would get a randomly chosen promotion each turn (with Mild Breeze occurring most often):

Opposite Winds - -2 movement points
Calm - -1 movement point
Mild Breeze - no change to movement points
Good Winds - +1 movement point
Gale - +2 movement points, takes 15 HP damage

Shouldn't "Calm" and "Mild Breeze" be switched on that list? Calm means no breeze at all.

Fedatur · Feb 11, 2015

shaglio said:
Shouldn't "Calm" and "Mild Breeze" be switched on that list? Calm means no breeze at all.

Calm - no wind at all, so no power for sails.

janboruta · Feb 11, 2015

Fedatur said:
Calm - no wind at all, so no power for sails.

Yeah, that was my reasoning.

Fedatur · Feb 11, 2015

Must say I like Jan's idea more than 10 triremes lost

Natan35 · Feb 11, 2015

I'm going to play this mod as soon as its expansion will continue...
(Got it?)

Natan35 · Feb 11, 2015

(Sorry to DP)
Okay, feedback:

Attrition is cool. Scurvy isn't. Scurvy is unplayable.

Suggestions:

• Limit scurvy to ocean tiles\remove dissapearing chance in coastal tiles, and reduce damage from scurvy to 10 HP.
• Increase disease chance for civilian units, reduce for non-civilian.

janboruta · Feb 11, 2015

Natan35 said:
Limit scurvy to ocean tiles\remove dissapearing chance in coastal tiles, and reduce damage from scurvy to 10 HP.

Completely agreed.

Natan35 · Feb 11, 2015

janboruta said:
Completely agreed.

I don't care too much about colonies. I want trade.
(Do i have to use the community patch? Why? It makes AIs annoying...)
Please make updates not break saved games. Please?

DoctorMcGann · Feb 11, 2015

I agree with what Natan said. 10HP is also how Scurvy's done in Conquest of the New World.

shaglio · Feb 11, 2015

Fedatur said:
Calm - no wind at all, so no power for sails.

Yeah, duh, I don't know what I was thinking. My only excuse is that I posted that early in the morning. I must have thought he meant a minor breeze in the wrong direction rather than at your back.

pyroflare77 · Feb 11, 2015

If you want to limit early naval exploration, then scurvy on coastal tiles should only effect galleys/triremes/galleasses. I could deal with that. For ships in the Renaissance and beyond, I'd rather scurvy just be on the ocean. It sort of makes sense in that time passes faster in the earlier turns. The slight hit to scurvy damage also sounds good.

I don't think being lost at sea should apply to coastal tiles. Kind of ridiculous that I lost a tongiaki right next to shore (unless that's exceedingly unlucky). I could understand a coastal tile that's surrounded by water, but not one that's next to land.

Maguyver · Feb 11, 2015

For sss64sss, TranquilSilence, and anyone else that may still be having a TXT_KEY issue; the problem is probably related to the Piety and Prestige balance patch. Delete the "Terrain," folder which contains duplicate text entries for resources that will also be included in ExCE.

Also, for what it's worth I think Natan and Jan's ideas for scurvy would be a big improvement.

DoctorMcGann · Feb 11, 2015

I just realised this is the first time one of Natan's ideas has been universally applauded.

JFD · Feb 11, 2015

Bonci said:
Snip

Unfortunately, I've no idea. Are they all the mods you're using? Others have used P&P, CulDiv, and ExCE together fine. Your database log might shed some better light.

TLhikan said:
Does the Woodman promotion give immunity to Thick Forest instant loss? And does the scurvy immunity apply only to regular Polynesia, or is there compatibility for the More Civs Polynesia pack (or is that their job )?

Awesome looking mod, I can't wait to try it out!

Yes, Thick Forest and Jungle are treated as the same, so Woodsman gives immunity to both. More Civs should probably add Scurvy immunity to the Tongan UU.

TranquilSilence said:
Would it be possible to grant the civs that gain the pacific island bonuses in CulDiv scurvy immunity for their starting units as well. I can imagine the loss of that starting scout and warrior to scurvy would be a tad annoying.

It also seems that at least the Sacred Groves belief is not granting the appropriate yields to Oak and Cedar tiles. No idea if this affects the other belief however.

Will take a look at the Sacred Groves belief. And I can do that with Pacific.

shaglio said:
In the game I was playing last night, my Scout popped a ruin and became a Scarcher. My initial reaction was, "Noooo!" Much different from my old reaction.

Oh, interesting. I can fix that.

Natan35 said:
(Sorry to DP)
Okay, feedback:

Attrition is cool. Scurvy isn't. Scurvy is unplayable.

Suggestions:

Limit scurvy to ocean tiles\remove dissapearing chance in coastal tiles, and reduce damage from scurvy to 10 HP.
Increase disease chance for civilian units, reduce for non-civilian.

1) It actually is only supposed to apply only to Ocean. Notwithstanding the fact that it obviously isn't working as intended, do people not pay attention to specifics?

Scurvy: Naval Units have a 50% chance to take 15 damage in Coast or Ocean. 5% chance that Naval Units will instantly disband in Ocean.

2) Reasoning behind this idea? I'm curious.

Natan35 said:
I don't care too much about colonies. I want trade.
(Do i have to use the community patch? Why? It makes AIs annoying...)
Please make updates not break saved games. Please?

Don't ask of me what only Firaxis can - and won't - give.

janboruta · Feb 11, 2015

JFD said:
1) It actually is only supposed to apply only to Ocean. Notwithstanding the fact that it obviously isn't working as intended, do people not pay attention to specifics?

But limiting Scurvy to ocean, apart from the disappearing chance, would still be for the best.

There's been a lot of suggestions and a bit of feedback lately. I wonder which route you would take in an update to naval movement and attrition? The uncertainty of this section is the only thing keeping me from updating to this version of ExCE.

But I guess that's because I'm biased by my interest in all things naval, and the desire to have the most enjoyable (and historically correct, where applicable) experience with naval exploration in Civ.

I mean no disrespect in any case.

sss64sss · Feb 11, 2015

After the update, things seemed to start working fine, (and thanks for the tip on the terrain file), though I'm still experiencing a fair amount of glitches and eventually crashed. I can't really tell how much of it was ExCE and what wasn't though. Should I send a log? (Database, right?) The last time I tried, it was too big to copy-paste or upload.

pyroflare77 · Feb 11, 2015

My game also thinks cedar and oak are luxuries, and they appear as such on a civ's trade screen. So I'm going to guess ginger counts as one, too. And taking a glance at the civilopedia shows that all added bonuses are counted as luxuries.

Bonci · Feb 11, 2015

JFD said:
Unfortunately, I've no idea. Are they all the mods you're using? Others have used P&P, CulDiv, and ExCE together fine. Your database log might shed some better light.

Here:

Spoiler :

I've also enabled civ4 diplomacy and the other one for city states from the community patch page (thank you for making me discover them btw XD).
Maybe there is a problem between these and Piety and Prestige now that I think of it...I just supposed they had to be compatible just for being part of the community patch blob XP

Now I'll try without them! (but they work with ExCE alone)

EDIT: No ok, scrap that. I had already tried to disable everything else, the logs are from a game with only your two mods active.

pyroflare77 · Feb 11, 2015

Aaaand that's 1 for 1 for every tongiaki I've sent out getting lost at sea. Only one actually managed to get somewhere more than a few tiles away from their home city. I doubt I'm that unlucky (I've had better experiences with scurvy, which is allegedly ten times as likely to happen), and even if I am, this annoyance is too much to continue the game at this rate.

Fedatur · Feb 11, 2015

Well soon there will be no bonus luxuries at all (other then Tribes)

Exploration Continued Expanded (Obsolete)

The Prince of Dorkness

Warlord

Artistriarch

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Mayor of St. Natansburg

Artistriarch

Mayor of St. Natansburg

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