Glitch in mutual protection packs

[Schmek]

Hi,

it has been a while since i played Civ 3. So now my exams have ended and i started up a game.
You probably have this to. Every other country is at least annoyed with you or they are furious for some unknown reason. So they start mutual protection packs (against you). In the past this didn't bother me because i like to build my empire and didn't conquer much. But it has been a while so i marched my troops around a lot, occupied some cities to teach those whom i had conquert what an macnificant country i have.
Only problem is sometimes my newly acquierd cities revolt against me. So in order not to lose my troops i kept them outside (I couldnt starve the population to death quick enough). I believe this is a common tactic.

Now the problem.
Those cities often border with another country. Let's say the Inca They have an mutual protection pack with the Persians. And my city Delft is empty and bordering Inca territory. They go to Delft declare war against me and take the latest pearl of my empire.
Clearly they are the agressor. But when i attack them, their protection pack with the Persians activates. Now i am at war with two countries. Which is the end for my glories world. In this example i didn't have war with the Inca or Persian. Only the Dutch.

Now it could just be me... But isn't it strange to activate an protection pack when you want your city back. This way i cannot attack the Inca. In order to avoid a war on two fronts (There is a Persian side and a Inca Side in my empire). Which i am losing

[warpstorm]

You attacked them. Even though it was in retailation, you attacked them on their land (even though it was yours before). It has nothing to do with who is the primary aggressor.

Make you own mutual protection pacts and use them against your enemies.

[Padma]

I don't se a glitch - I see a MPP working exactly as designed.

Yes, technically the Inca are the *initial* agressor. They took your city of Delft (which I assume you took from the Dutch, and left empty! - that is an open invitation to attack). BUT, they have MPP with the Persians. An MPP kicks in when you attack one partner in their territory. Since they took Delft, it was *their* territory, so when you attacked, the MPP kicked in.

[Chieftess]

The AI is too dumb to know that. All it knows is:

"Civ1 attacked (or had units in the territory -- as of Civ3 Conquests) a civ I have a MPP with, so declare war on that civ.". What you could do is sign an MPP with the civs the enemy has an MPP with, and let them attack a unit in your territory, then you can enter theirs.

[CoolioVonHoolio]

i do that agaisnt the AI all the time. ill sign an MPP with a neighbor of my enemy, send a settler to my enemys territory and when my enemy takes my newly found city, the neighbor must declair war on my enemy. so i have someone else fighting my wars.

[RegentMan]

It might not be too bad. Now you have another AI to stomp into the ground...

[el toro loco]

i had a glitch w/ mutual protection pact the other night. at least i think it was a glitch. after 20 turns, i didn't receive option to cancel mutual protection pact. so i had a pact w/ one computer ai for the rest of the game. it was a bumer because i was democracy and i couldn't stop being in a war. the friendly ai only signed one peace treaty but the turn he did the enemy ai attacked me and he was at war again. it was a vecious cycle. luckily i was far enough ahead where it didn't really matter.

[Doc Tsiolkovski]

The really ugly thing is (in C3C):
You ar at war with Civ A.
You've reached your goals in that war, and only wait for them to talk. Now, A signs MPP with B; and by no means you want to fight B. No problem, it seems; after all, you don't plan to attack A any longer.
Then, a city flips back to A - and you suddenly have units in their territory - and suddenly B declares .

[Twonky]

el toro loco: there is a way to renegotiate expired deals. When you´re talking to your MPP-partner, click on "active" in the bottom part of the screen and select the MPP. You can now renegotiate - including canceling it.

[el toro loco]

cool thxs twonky, i did not know that. but from reading some of these post, i'm starting to realize there is a lot of things in this game that are left to be learned.

[Twonky]

Truth be told, I learned it here, too.

[N3pomuk]

well one could always pay off their MPP partner to have a mPP with you and thein wait for the agressor to atack you on your territory... unless you are poor, backwards, and weak in wich case your civ deserves to be purged by the rightious inca

[xiaoafei]

Use your diplomatic skill to prevent such thing. You can sign MPP with other AIs, or make them fight each other before they make such an ally. Another thing is, MPP lasts for 20 turns. Once it expires, you can do whatever you want.

[Pentium]

Or they leave it running. I doesn't always expire.

[Schmek]

Thanks for all the replies.

But truth is i attacked them on my country. (defending it) Only thing i can do in such a case is make a wall of superior units. Position them in front of their units so that they will attack my units eventually get killed.

Unfortunately they where the only two countries left on the MY continent (which it has become meanwhile). I am not counting the dutch since i don't think a mutual protection pack would not go well if they are furious with you.

[Schmek]

Oh and Doc,...

That is another Doom senario, I don't even want to think about.
It makes you think there is a god pulling the strings in this game and I don't mean you behind your keyboard. Brrr,.... culture.

Well guess this is how wars happen in real life to.