No Cheat Mode or No Mods

[superslug]

• All independent mods have now been banned from Hall of Fame play for 1.52 games.
• Use of No Cheat Mode is mandatory.
• A Hall of Fame Megamod is in development (release date uncertain) that will allow players to use select versions of mods approved by us for Hall of Fame play in No Cheat Mode.
• When the first version is released, I'll open a new thread for mod requests for future versions.
• Mods may continue to be used for 1.09 games in progress, however all future Hall of Fame starts need to be done unmodded under 1.52.

Original post:

Spoiler:

It's become recently apparent that 1.52's No Cheat Mode means no use of mods, including "benign" ones like BlueMarble and Autolog.

I think it's too drastic to say this is a permanent problem, as I'm sure there will be future patches and possible ideas on how to enable No Cheat Mode but still allow a limited number of acceptable mods.

However, for now, for Beta HOF, what do you think and which should we choose?

I'm discussing this over with the Staff and hope to have a decision soon.

[ainwood]

My initial thoughts on it were that the signatures of approved mods could be stored in a database, and then checked when the save was uploaded. That way, you could verify that it was played with the approved mod and only the approved mod.

The problems are:

1. Maintaining the list, and ensuring that (legitimate) changes to the mods are included.
2. Handling combinations of mods - and the exponential growth in checksums that would need to be stored. Perhaps the 'megamod' solution avoids this?

[Pentium]

I voted for Allow mods. I think ainwood said enough, there should be a database, but if it could become too big, and we certainly don't want to overload the staff.

BTW, if you put a mod like the clock mod in the original folder instead of CustomAssets, does it work with "No cheating" checked?

[Dianthus]

I've voted "No cheat mode". If it's a case of one or the other I would rather be sure that the games haven't been played using World Builder or with "custom" python/xml changes.

[Dianthus]

Originally Posted by Pentium

BTW, if you put a mod like the clock mod in the original folder instead of CustomAssets, does it work with "No cheating" checked?

It does, but would lead to extra work for the HOF staff as we would detect that your installation was non-standard and have to contact you to find out what was different.

[Pentium]

Originally Posted by Dianthus

It does, but would lead to extra work for the HOF staff as we would detect that your installation was non-standard and have to contact you to find out what was different.

So you detect a non-standard installation only when original files are overwritten or when there are mods in the CustomAssets folder? IIRC, many people couldn't open GOTM saves because of that mods.

[Dianthus]

When the admin password is set or the no cheating option is used the custom assets folder is not used. With 1.09 the custom assets folder was still used when the admin password was set, this changed in 1.52.

This means that in order to use mods with the admin password set or the no cheating option on you need to either:
a) Change the original game files under C:\Program Files\Firaxis Games\Sid Meier's Civilization 4\Assets
b) Create a new mod with the required changes under C:\Program Files\Firaxis Games\Sid Meier's Civilization 4\Mods

It might be possible, and easier for us to manage, to create a HOF mod that contains all of the mods support by the HOF in some configurable manner, which would mean the "No Cheat Mode or No Mods" question would no longer be an either/or.

[LeSphinx]

I vote "No Cheat mode" selected.

But as I like to play with autolog mod and blue marblle mod, it would be great to have a special GOTM/HOF mod made by CFC staff (validate and check)...
I know it more job for you guys but....

[Pentium]

Originally Posted by Dianthus

It might be possible, and easier for us to manage, to create a HOF mod that contains all of the mods support by the HOF in some configurable manner

If it doesn't mean too much work for you, I think this is the best solution. There will be people who will want to use one mod and not another, but it's still far better then no mods at all.

[Smirk]

What is the means of confirmation of modification of the base files? I have a couple hand rolled changes I made to the base set which I will not play without. One was to disable the blinking end of turn text (in MainEvents file maybe?) and the other was a modification of the default settings for a custom game, notably checking No Barbs and recently No Cheats, if thats irony enough for ya.

[Dianthus]

Originally Posted by Smirk

One was to disable the blinking end of turn text (in MainEvents file maybe?) and the other was a modification of the default settings for a custom game, notably checking No Barbs and recently No Cheats, if thats irony enough for ya.

Could you send me those changes to hof@civfanatics.net? Those should be easy enough to put into a mod. Which directory did you make these changes in? Directly to the game files, or to copies in the My Documents dir?

[Methos]

Originally Posted by Dianthus

It does, but would lead to extra work for the HOF staff as we would detect that your installation was non-standard and have to contact you to find out what was different.

I would rather leave it in the CustomAssets folder anyway. When I first used the Autolog mod I put it in the Assets folder and it caused more trouble than it was worth. Works great in Custom Assets.

I chose allow mods as the autlog mod is a great addition to both the HOF and IVOTM games. Taking notes and keeping track of everything is so much easier with the autolog mod. Prior to it SG’s were tough as I kept track of my turnset with pen and paper. I would hate to have to do that with IVOTM.

Doubt I’ll ever submit a HOF game but figure that HOF/IVOTM will use the same mod.

[syneris]

What all does No Cheat Mode really do? Aside from most likely disabling world builder, does it prevent reloading an earlier save? What other ways to cheat are left other than edited gamefiles.

[Moonsinger]

I voted for "No Cheat Mode" and "No mod". Let keep it simple! The less mod the better. Currently, I'm playing the game "as is" out of the box with patch 1.52 without any mod.

[superslug]

• All independent mods have now been banned from Hall of Fame play for 1.52 games.
• Use of No Cheat Mode is mandatory.
• A Hall of Fame Megamod is in development (release date uncertain) that will allow players to use select versions of mods approved by us for Hall of Fame play in No Cheat Mode.
• When the first version is released, I'll open a new thread for mod requests for future versions.
• Mods may continue to be used for 1.09 games in progress, however all future Hall of Fame starts need to be done unmodded under 1.52.

[Craterus22]

anyone know how to make "no cheat mode" set all the time? Everytime I start a game I have to re-check the box...

[Methos]

Just curious on something. If I go into the EventManager.py and change autosaves to every turn will that be considered as tampering by the security measures?

It is in effect altering the main files.

[Dianthus]

Originally Posted by Craterus22

anyone know how to make "no cheat mode" set all the time? Everytime I start a game I have to re-check the box...

Thanks to Smirk the new HOF mod will do this. Coming soon to a website near you!

Originally Posted by Methos

Just curious on something. If I go into the EventManager.py and change autosaves to every turn will that be considered as tampering by the security measures?

It is in effect altering the main files.

No need to change .py for that, just edit the CivilizationIV.ini file. The following are the two you are most likely interested in, MaxAutoSaves being new for 1.52:

; The maximum number of autosaves kept in the directory before being deleted.
MaxAutoSaves = 5

; Specify the number of turns between autoSaves.  0 means no autosave.
AutoSaveInterval = 4

[playshogi]

I know autolog is disabled with no cheat mode on, but the log generated by this mod still shows up on submitted games under player log. So... I'm happy! Voted, no cheat mode, check!

[TLHeart]

I miss my blue marble terrain, and the civ scale tool....Makes the games more enjoyable for me. Please included them.