Great People Farms...help needed!

[jerVL/kg]

Ok, I'm something of a Civ newbie, although I'm learning fast. Played two games on Chieftan/Warlord, where I pretty much dominated everybody, and now I'm doing my first Noble game where I'm ahead on points & land area but struggling a bit to maintain a tech lead.

I've got a lot of the game down, but for the life of me I *cannot* figure out how to reliably create a Great People City!

The basics seem simple...focus building wonders & certain buildings in certain cities, like Hanging Gardens & Hagia Sophia in your Engineer City, and Great Lighthouse/Colossus/Statue of Liberty for Great Merchants. What I really need, though, is Great ARTISTS. I'm waging a severe culture war vs. Egypt (see this thread for more detail) and I'm desperate for culture bombs...but the only way I know to reliably create a Great Artist is to be the first to discover Music, but that chance has already come and gone.

I've tried adding Artist specialists, but you can only add 2 per city (with a Theatre) and worst of all, the stupid City Governor insists on adding Priest specialists while I'm not looking...so after all that hard work, I wind up with a bunch of useless Great Prophets.

Meanwhile, the AI seems to have no trouble. When I took over Orleans around 1200 AD, the city already had an Academy + two Scientist Super Specialists, and there was an Academy in Paris as well. How on earth did Louis generate 4 stinking Great Scientists when I've only been able to create one??

Suffice to say, I need some advice on this matter...

[TCGTRF]

Originally Posted by jerVL/kg

Ok, I'm something of a Civ newbie, although I'm learning fast. Played two games on Chieftan/Warlord, where I pretty much dominated everybody, and now I'm doing my first Noble game where I'm ahead on points & land area but struggling a bit to maintain a tech lead.

I've got a lot of the game down, but for the life of me I *cannot* figure out how to reliably create a Great People City!

The basics seem simple...focus building wonders & certain buildings in certain cities, like Hanging Gardens & Hagia Sophia in your Engineer City, and Great Lighthouse/Colossus/Statue of Liberty for Great Merchants. What I really need, though, is Great ARTISTS. I'm waging a severe culture war vs. Egypt (see this thread for more detail) and I'm desperate for culture bombs...but the only way I know to reliably create a Great Artist is to be the first to discover Music, but that chance has already come and gone.

I've tried adding Artist specialists, but you can only add 2 per city (with a Theatre) and worst of all, the stupid City Governor insists on adding Priest specialists while I'm not looking...so after all that hard work, I wind up with a bunch of useless Great Prophets.

Meanwhile, the AI seems to have no trouble. When I took over Orleans around 1200 AD, the city already had an Academy + two Scientist Super Specialists, and there was an Academy in Paris as well. How on earth did Louis generate 4 stinking Great Scientists when I've only been able to create one??

Suffice to say, I need some advice on this matter...

Did Louis have the Great Library?

There are Wonders that push the Artist limit--

The Parthenon, National Epic (Heroic Epic if you've had a war), and Notre Dame are all available by the time you've got Music.

Mid game, there's the Sistine Chapel, Taj Mahal, Globe Theatre and Hermitage.

Late game is where you get tons of possible wonders--Broadway, Hollywood, the Kremlin (is that a misprint?), Rock and Roll and Mt. Rushmore.

What did you use your early-game Great Artists for (if any)?

Tomt

[ionimplant]

Originally Posted by TCGTRF

What did you use your early-game Great Artists for (if any)?

Tomt

i believe it's for that cultural war

[Plutonium239]

The Caste System civic will let you run unlimited artists and is a great way to control great people production.

[Toshiro126]

I like to get Great Artists also. So I tend to put 2 national wonders and all my world wonders that create artists all in one city, usually my capital or second city. Any wonder that produces anything else will go in another city.

[jerVL/kg]

Originally Posted by TCGTRF

Did Louis have the Great Library?

As a matter of fact, he did. Is that the reason?

There are Wonders that push the Artist limit--

The Parthenon, National Epic (Heroic Epic if you've had a war), and Notre Dame are all available by the time you've got Music.

Mid game, there's the Sistine Chapel, Taj Mahal, Globe Theatre and Hermitage.

Late game is where you get tons of possible wonders--Broadway, Hollywood, the Kremlin (is that a misprint?), Rock and Roll and Mt. Rushmore.

Well, I'm building Versailles in the city with the National Epic (hopefully I'll make it...got a Great Engineer on standby just in case!) and I'll probably put the Globe Theatre there, too. That city seems the best candidate for my Great Artist Farm, if it works. Unfortunately I missed out on the Parthenon, Sistine Chapel, Notre Dame & Taj Mahal -- damn India went on a Wonder-building spree!! -- and I'm going to use The Hermitage in a city I just took over to keep Egypt's borders at bay.

What did you use your early-game Great Artists for (if any)?

In this game, I've yet to create a single one. In earlier games, they were always for culture-bombing...

[Artanis]

Originally Posted by jerVL/kg

As a matter of fact, he did. Is that the reason?

Probably, yeah.

Great Library gives you two free Scientists in that city. That means a LOT of Scientist points. It also puts out Scientist points of its own.

Long story short, Great Library = 8 Great Scientist points per turn

[IrishBornKiller]

Globe Theater is what you need in your artist farm. It will allow you to make 3 more additional Artist specialist (along with the +1 GPP) and is realitively cheap.

[jerVL/kg]

Originally Posted by Artanis

Great Library gives you two free Scientists in that city. That means a LOT of Scientist points. It also puts out Scientist points of its own.

Long story short, Great Library = 8 Great Scientist points per turn

Yeah, I seem to have no problem creating Scientists & Engineers. It's artists that I need...

Caste System sounds like a great idea. I've got one city way up north that exploded in population, even without any wonders. I wound up putting 1 Engineer, 3 Merchants, 2 Scientists and 2 Artists in it, since that was the limit...so it's kinda like pot luck as to what I get from them. But with Caste System, does that mean I can make ALL of them Artists??

[jerVL/kg]

Originally Posted by IrishBornKiller

Globe Theater is what you need in your artist farm. It will allow you to make 3 more additional Artist specialist (along with the +1 GPP) and is realitively cheap.

Ahhh, sweet. I was actually wondering, since that city has National Epic already, whether I should wait until I get West Point or The Red Cross, but if Globe generates that many artists...Globe Theater it is!! Thanks!

[genjiboy]

Originally Posted by jerVL/kg

Caste System sounds like a great idea. I've got one city way up north that exploded in population, even without any wonders. I wound up putting 1 Engineer, 3 Merchants, 2 Scientists and 2 Artists in it, since that was the limit...so it's kinda like pot luck as to what I get from them. But with Caste System, does that mean I can make ALL of them Artists??

It sure does. Change to Caste System today!

[Rameau's Nephew]

The best way to make a versatile GP farm is not to rely on wonders (besides the national epic). Why? Because you can't count on getting the great wonders on higher difficulties, and even on the lower ones, if a city has enough production capacity to be a wonder-producer, you want to keep those citizens in the mines, not as GP generating specialists.

So, find a city that can generate large food surpluses, but isn't much good at anything else. In my current game, I have a city surrounded by mostly desert, but with 4 floodplains and 3 river grasslands (only other useful tile is one rivered grass-hill). Irrigate everything. Run slavery for a while so you can whip yourself a granary, national epic, and any improvements that allow more specialists. (Caste system is nice, but you'll need the improvements for when you emancipate.) Get the population up to your happiness limit, and then switch everything but subsistence farming to specialists.

[AngryPants]

Originally Posted by Rameau's Nephew

The best way to make a versatile GP farm is not to rely on wonders (besides the national epic). Why? Because you can't count on getting the great wonders on higher difficulties, and even on the lower ones, if a city has enough production capacity to be a wonder-producer, you want to keep those citizens in the mines, not as GP generating specialists.

You won't want the engineer in the mines once you can build a forge. He'll give you production and GPP.

[Artanis]

Originally Posted by AngryPants

You won't want the engineer in the mines once you can build a forge. He'll give you production and GPP.

Maybe in his GP farm. What he's saying is that he won't be able to have many (if any at all) Great Wonders in his GP farm because the only places with enough production to actually build them will already be tasked with building troops and stuff rather than Great People. In order to fulfill their entire reason for existance, those big-Hammer cities will be maximizing production, which means Mines instead of Engineers.

[jerVL/kg]

Originally Posted by Rameau's Nephew

The best way to make a versatile GP farm is not to rely on wonders (besides the national epic). Why? Because you can't count on getting the great wonders on higher difficulties, and even on the lower ones, if a city has enough production capacity to be a wonder-producer, you want to keep those citizens in the mines, not as GP generating specialists.

Hmm, ok. So you're saying I should put the Globe in the city that's already got over 5 specialists in various fields? That does sound like a better idea...esp. since it's given me the most problems with unhappiness...

Probably would've been a good idea to put the Heroic Epic there too, but I already built that elsewhere.