LK119 - 6CCC - Rome, prince, pangaea

[LKendter]

http://www.civfanatics.net/uploads11/LK119BC-2000.zip


Our random civ turns out to be cruel - Rome. Expansive and organized are lousy traits for a small empire.


4000 BC
I decide to move 1 tile west as that will bring a flood plains tile into Rome territory.


3960 BC
I found Rome and start working a lake tile. Can you sense the path I am heading for research?


3640 BC
We meet up with Cyrus.
(IT) Our borders expand, so I swap to the flood plains tile for faster growth.


3160 BC
Now here is trouble - Asoka. I am starting to hate him after seeing him as my first run away civ in LK117.


3000 BC
(IT) We are the Roman Hindus.


2800 BC
Add Arabia to the list of opponents.


2680 BC
Oh goodie, I love finding Mansa on the map.


2520 BC
Add Mao to the list of troublemakers.


==========================

Summary:
We need to be very careful with city placement.
1) We need one coastal city to build ships, especially if a small island is out there.
2) We need to claim the maximum possible land, especially with colonies gone. Later game resources could become a real challenge.
3) City overlap is very bad. If you question the reason why, read #2 again.

We need to get the ability to spread our religion quickly. The ability to play our foes against each other is going to be very important. Trying to take on the world with just 6 cities solo is crazy. MOW is the way to go.


Signed up:
LKendter
Greebley (currently playing)
Jabah (on deck)
Maquis
Tatran


Remember 10 turns per round. STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to complete.

Win target: Conquest. This is a 6 CCC after all.

[LKendter]

The northern lands and the city site I really want.
It has gems, corn and ivory.
It has some hills for production.
It has a river for income.

[LKendter]

This is the southern part of the map.
Yellow dot is marginal, as it only gains sheep.
It is intentionally away from fresh water to avoid overlap with Rome.

Blue dot looks like our best bet for a coastal city.
It has cattle and 2 more luxuries.
It does have one ugly desert tile, but I can live with it.

[Greebley]

Ok, I got it. Agree the white dot is best - that is where the settler will go.

[Greebley]

We popped a hut and got a free scout

After Iron Working I started research on Wheel.

Our settler is a turn away from its position.

I chopped a forest to get another worker quickly.

No Iron anywhere we have explored! There are a few unexplored areas near us that may still have a chance, but it isn't looking good (most land near us is owned). We may want to go for 5 towns and fight a war for Iron (assuming there is some close enough to fight for)

I would continue to chop trees to get our settlers out faster. I would like to grab the good spots before the AI.

We may want to send an explorer to the NE. If there is iron there we want to know about it. Once we have open borders, I would explore all lands near us.

I would grab the copper next. The cities in Lee's dotmap are more likely to be available longer.

Here is a picture of the resources:

[LKendter]

Summary:
Do we need iron for our UU, or will the visible copper work? I haven't played Rome before.

Which copper are you looking to grab? The one SW of will be an ugly spot. IIRC correctly that puts us in point blank range of Asoka capital and a heavy flip risk.

I am not sure how our cities will be set for shields. Lets keep the forest chops to a minimum. A 6CCC game really needs production to have a chance.

Signed up:
LKendter
Greebley
Jabah (currently playing)
Maquis (on deck)
Tatran


Remember 10 turns per round. STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to complete.

Win target: Conquest. This is a 6 CCC after all.

[ChrTh]

lurker's comment:
Rome sadly (cf CTIV-6) needs Iron for the Praets

[Tatran]

This is an ugly start,only 2 hills and 1 resource.
Why those 5 coast tiles instead of some more hills or resources?
We should focus on the best lands with resources and not founding
cities because we need to get our quotum.Asoka looks to be the first
target.We can't deny that gold,silver and wine in his area,not to mention
to prevent spreading the Buddism disease.
Also it looks LK loves to play against Alexander,the last civ.
Keep an eye on Mao.He's just like Alex a sneak attacker.(Pleased.)

I had a problem with Greebley's save.See picture.Anyone?

[Jabah]

Got it. Probably can play tonight but not early.
At work, so can't check the save.

Easiest copper might be to move yellow dot 1NW, it will still have the sheep and will be next to fresh water (and with no overlap with Rome). Of course it is quite close to Asoka (?), but not overlapping.

For blue dot, I suggest moving it 1N, there will be 1 overlap with Rome, but excluding this tile, we will exchange (2coasts+1sea) for (2 desert-hills) that we will be able to work (with farm on the lake+bonus food) for a high production city. (but there might be better place than blue dot to start with).

Jabah

[Jabah]

Here is my revised dotmap



For cities 5 & 6, we should wait until we know better, but Asoka land with wine, silver & gold could be an option.

We also have to keep in mind that our cities will have culture and therefore some bonus could be outside their 21 tiles and still be ok as long as AI are not rying to steal.

Jabah

[LKendter]

1750 BC unzipped and loaded perfectly for me.

Are you using Winzip to unzip it? The built in windows unzip sucks and often screws up files.

[Tatran]

I'm sorry for the complaint.There's indeed nothing wrong with
Greebley's save.It was probably too early and I didn't see it was zipped.

[Greebley]

I think we need the yellow dot. If we don't have spear, axes in addition to no Praetorians, we will be in a very tough spot. I would make that the next spot.

Not so sure on the light blue dot. I don't think we can use those extra hills until biology - there doesn't look like enough food. I would almost prefer the sea squares for the commerce. I can't see the individual terrain though - we could count it out for both pre-biology and post-biology vs the lower spot. The lower spot also gives the capitol that grassland.

I would make exploring the squares near us (that we cannot yet see) as a top priority. If one of those squares has Iron it makes a huge difference to us. Praetorians can help with some early progress against the AI. It would even be worth an early war to get I think.

[Jabah]

For light blue, we don't need biology, we will need calender (suger) to work all hills, but even before we could do:
+ city (+2f), cow (+3f), 3 farmed grass by lake (+3) -> 4 desert hills.
+ with sugar (+2f) -> 5 desert hills.

This city will be production only.

We will need to specialist a lot. Rome should be cottage-ville, with (Oxford and Wall Street ?), city by gems, ivory and river should be commerce as well.
We then need production centers. Yellow will have 2 hills + copper and could be mixed production/commerce depending on the needs. So only light blue is a real production center.

There are still some dark area (fog) quite close which could hide nice surprise.

Jabah

[Maquis]

I agree that finding (and hooking up) iron should be our priority. I have found that an early war using Praetorians can really help, especially here if we can take out one AI early...

[Jabah]

T0 - 1750BC
We can't see any Iron, because we don't know how to find it (tech not learnt)...
BTW I hope everyone knows we are playing on Epic speed because I didn't until I checked the building prices, working tasks ...
It is turn 60, so I guess I play 20 and not 10 like what is on LK copy-paste formula. (10t at this stage on Epic seems very short, sorry if you really mean 10t right now).

T1 - 1725BC
Rome worker-> warrior in 5t (same as growth)
workers going to mine the river hill as production is pathetic.

T2 - 1700BC
Found Antium (start obelisk). Not the most amazing city right now in the middle of the jungle with exactly 1 correct working tiles (forrested grass).
Asoka has founded quite close as well, I think he might well be our first victim.

T4 - 1650BC
Wheel->Hunting (we have Ivory to "camp")

T6 - 1600BC
Rome Warrior->settler (in 11t, less with chop).

T7 - 1575BC
Judaism FiDaL

T9 - 1525BC
Hunting-> Animal Husbandry (want to see horse, and we will have animal to "pasture")

T10 - 1500BC
Meet Alex of the Greek in the "Far West"

T13 - 1425BC
Rome settler->worker
There are barbarian warriors all around, and our woodmansII finishes next to 1 in the open... and dies.
The one fortified on hill for the next city manages to win.

T15 - 1375BC
Rome worker-> barracks

T16 - 1350BC
Cumae founded on the other lake for Copper and Sheep (start obelisk)

T19 - 1275BC
Animal Husbandry->Archery (see below)
Closest Horses are already under Cyrus controle in Pasargadae (5N of Rome).

T20 - 1250BC
I queue a worker in Antium as the forrest chop has brought an extra 40hammers.

Comments
+ Workers are cutting tree outside our borders (ands possibly within opponent's future borders.
+ Stonehenge would be nice (for Prophet point) but without stone is far too long.
+ I researched Archery, because our pathetic warriors are not going to be any good much longer, and we will need quite a long time before copper is within our border and mined.
+ Next research could be Iron Working, but that is 24t right now.
+ We should also research pottery and start cottaging around Rome.


Jabah

Spoiler:

----------------------------New entries----------------------------
Turn 60 (1750 BC)
Rome finishes: Worker

Turn 61 (1725 BC)
Rome begins: Warrior
Warrior defeats (0.98/2): Barbarian Lion

Turn 62 (1700 BC)
Antium founded
Antium begins: Obelisk

Turn 63 (1675 BC)
Tech learned: The Wheel

Turn 64 (1650 BC)
Research begun: Hunting

Turn 65 (1625 BC)
Rome grows: 4
Rome finishes: Warrior

Turn 66 (1600 BC)
Rome begins: Settler
Judaism founded in a distant land

Turn 67 (1575 BC)

Turn 68 (1550 BC)
Tech learned: Hunting

Turn 69 (1525 BC)
Research begun: Animal Husbandry

Turn 70 (1500 BC)
Contact made: Greek Empire

Turn 71 (1475 BC)

Turn 72 (1450 BC)
Rome finishes: Settler

Turn 73 (1425 BC)
Rome begins: Stonehenge
Rome begins: Worker
Warrior loses to: Barbarian Warrior (0.40/2)

Turn 74 (1400 BC)
Rome finishes: Worker
Warrior defeats (1.32/2): Barbarian Warrior

Turn 75 (1375 BC)
Rome begins: Barracks

Turn 76 (1350 BC)
Cumae founded
Cumae begins: Obelisk

Turn 77 (1325 BC)

Turn 78 (1300 BC)
Tech learned: Animal Husbandry
Antium grows: 2

Turn 79 (1275 BC)
Research begun: Archery

Turn 80 (1250 BC)
Antium begins: Worker

[Maquis]

Ok, i got it. I will wait to find out, should I be playing 10 or 20? I would think 20 in an epic game, as Jabah said, can't really make much progress in 10...

[Greebley]

We can't see any Iron, because we don't know how to find it (tech not learnt)...
BTW I hope everyone knows we are playing on Epic speed because I didn't until I checked the building prices, working tasks ...
It is turn 60, so I guess I play 20 and not 10 like what is on LK copy-paste formula. (10t at this stage on Epic seems very short, sorry if you really mean 10t right now).

Apologies. That was stupid. I thought we were researching it when I took over the game. It was bronzeworking. That makes a lot more sense. Didn't mean to make a big fuss over nothing. I feel like an idiot for not making sure we had the tech before making such claims.

[LKendter]

(10t at this stage on Epic seems very short, sorry if you really mean 10t right now).

I really did mean 10. I am usually pretty clear if I don't want 10 such as the OCC I just did.

Stonehenge would be nice (for Prophet point) but without stone is far too long.

Then we bettle snag the Oracle. With a lousy 6 cities we *need* shrine income.
We also need the ability to get the plus from spreading our religion.
I don't want Asoka religion to pollute our potential allies creating a diplomatic mess.


Signed up:
LKendter
Greebley
Jabah
Maquis (currently playing)
Tatran (on deck)


Remember 10 turns per round. STRICT 24 hours got it, total 48 hours to complete.

Win target: Conquest. This is a 6 CCC after all.

[Jabah]

Originally Posted by LKendter

I really did mean 10. I am usually pretty clear if I don't want 10 such as the OCC I just did.

In that case, I am sorry. But Epic speed + starting on turn 60, made me believe we had played (40t+20t). To make things "worst" the computer with civ4 has no connection to the net right now (and I can have only 1 working at the same time), so checking was not an option once I started.
I had a save after 10t, but there was absolutely nothing happening (like the injured scout spend 80% of his time resting, mining was 6t...

Originally Posted by LKendter

Then we bettle snag the Oracle. With a lousy 6 cities we *need* shrine income.

Asoka already has marble connected, it probably would be easier to get Stonehenge with lots of chopping, than try to race for Oracle (that also need techs we don't know). That is for Prophete purpose only (because Stonehenge is not that hot with our obeliks already there).

Jabah