Where to buy Civ 1 for Dos?

Greetings fellow Civ players. Can anyone tell me where I can buy Civ 1 for Dos? I have a dos emulator for Pocket PC and want to see if I can make it work.

All help is apprecited!

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-Melmouth the Conqueror

[stormerne]

In my opinion, your best bet is to buy Interplay's "Ultimate Strategy Archive" which includes CivI and a whole load of other stuff.

DGames is still advertising it for less than $10.
Seems to be out of stock at GreenBayCD .
Beware: some other stores are charging nearly $40!



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<IMG SRC="http://www.anglo-saxon.demon.co.uk/stormerne/stormerne.gif" border=0>

[GenghisK]

He he, it happens that I've bought this excellent compilation too. It includes among other things: Conquest of the New World, MAX, Railroad Tycoon (from Sid Meier too), etc etc. Only legendary hits.

And btw, Melmouth, contact me via email, I think I can help you

[SvenSlayer]

Couldn't you just download it from an abandonware site? I know a few great abandonware search sites. The best one is <FONT COLOR="blue">******* moderator edit ********</FONT c> so go there!

<FONT COLOR="blue">Civilization Fanatics Center does not allow people to post the URLs of such websites.</FONT c>

[This message has been edited by stormerne (edited September 02, 2001).]

[SvenSlayer]

What's going on? Abandonware's not illegal! No-one is even trying to close down abandonware sites. Once in a while a company does ask an abandonware site to take off a game the company's selling, and it's happily taken off.

[TTG]

Abandonware IS illegal. If nobody were trying to shut them down, then that would not mean it wasn't illegal. It would just mean that, hey, the games are abandoned so the sites can get away with it. It is really quite illegal.

The IDSA is trying to shut down the Home of the Underdogs. Fortunately, the site has remained online by removing hundreds of games which belonged to members of that organization.

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Civilization I Master of masters and webmaster of Civilization III Arsenal
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[This message has been edited by TTG (edited September 07, 2001).]

[SvenSlayer]

Let's just say for a moment that abandonware IS illegal. Wouldn't the gaming companies whose games are on these abandonware sites be able to take these abandonware people to court? For instance, a couple of Warez guys have been taken to court. (I have never been to a Warez site, just if you were wondering.) Shouldn't the same thing be done to abandonware people? This doesn't make sense. Perhaps the legal system in America is too complicated for me to understand.

[TTG]

They don't take anyone to court because they don't actually care, they just say they care. It creates a really strange legal situation. Of course, it's still illegal, but nobody gets charged. Really wierd.

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Civilization I Master of masters and webmaster of Civilization III Arsenal
<IMG SRC="http://www.strategyplanet.com/civilization3/images/ani_swordsman_thumb.gif" border=0>

[Melmouth]

Greetings -

Thanks to those of you who have taken the trouble to answer my original question.

For anyone who wants to know, you can buy Civ 1 as part of the Interplay's "Ultimate Strategy Archive" which includes CivI and a whole load of other stuff. DGames is still advertising it for less than $10. Seems to be out of stock at GreenBayCD. Chips & bits has it too.

It is also is available as "abandonware" if you take the trouble to run a couple of seach engines. To download a copy when you don't already own one would probably be illegal in the US.

Interesting philosophical point though - unless the Library of Congress has a copy, don't these creative works of art run the risk of being lost to humanity if they are not archived by selfless individuals on the web? Perhaps Congress should pass a mandatory software copyright license act granting individual the non-commericial rights to share software which has been out of print for 5 years or more? The owner of the copyright could reassert their commerical rights by bringing it back on the market.

Maybe I should start another topic?

[GenghisK]

Well, I'm sure what I'm gonna say is really mystic and not easily understandable but Civ1 for DOS is nearer each CFC members than you could ever imagine... Right TF? <img src="icon12.gif" border="0"> <br />Now guess!

[Dimension]

People who have no idea how copyright law works shouldn't just cast judgement and start deleting posts.

Let's talk a little about United States copyright law.

Fact 1:

Any work created after Jan 1, 1978, once "fixed in a tangible medium of expression," does not pass into the public domain until 70 years after the author dies (up to a maximum of 120 years after creation).

Fact 2:

Copyright law gives the owner exclusive rights over a work to reproduce, distribute, prepare derivative works, display publicly, perform publicly, and to perform publicly by means of digital audio transmission.

Fact 3:

You are not required to register a copyright to have copyright protection.

Fact 4:

Commercial copyright violation involving more than 10 copies and a value over $2500 is a felony.

And now the obvious conclusion:

Parts of copyright law (like almost any area of law) are so ridiculous that we can't just look at the law itself, but at precedent of what is and can be enforced. In today's legal system, it is much better to demonstrate precedent than simply attempt to prosecute under any restrictive law that is subject to interpretation.

example:

Technically, having a stereo on in a public place, rolling down your car window so that another person can hear your stereo, or even singing, whistling, or humming a song in public is breaking the law unless the author of the song has been dead 70 years. Obviously, nobody is getting arrested for humming a song. The truth is that copyright law is so loosely enforced that the creator of Napster sold his company for $2 million, even though he should be in prison for felony copyright violation.

Some references:

U.S. Copyright Office
http://lcweb.loc.gov/copyright/

Copyright and Public Domain Information Links
http://www.bf.org/copylaw.htm


So, since there is a difference between what technically violates copyright law and what is legitimately illegal, let's look at enforcement.

No legitimate web site lets you download a new game that isn't shareware/freeware/GNU or just released into the public domain. Certainly you can argue that "warez" sites are everywhere, but people know they are illegal, and they are in no way associated with legitimate websites or attached (knowingly) to corporate sponsorship. Conversely, there are many up-front sites that let you download old games. Whether you want an emulated version of Asteroids or an old Commodore 64 game, you're not going to have much trouble finding it. These things are on public web sites that are in no fear of being shut down.

So, why is that? Let's just use some common sense for a second. Why can you just download a copy of Pong without feeling guilty about it? Is it because nobody renewed the copyright and it became public domain? No. Nolan Bushnell (the author of Pong, although he later admitted he stole the idea from Ralph Baer's prototype Odyssey 100 system) has certainly not been dead for 70 years.

People do not prosecute simply for "copyright violation." To have a case, you have to demonstrate that you were hurt financially by the violation. Copyright violation becomes a felony if it is proven that you have caused $2500 in damages, but if the software isn't even being produced anymore, it is worth nothing, and you can't be prosecuted at all.

You see, people don't often go to the trouble to limit their copyright or release things into the public domain. They just stop making it if it's not bringing in money, and if it's not bringing in money, nobody's going to get sued for copying it.

If you want an old game that is no longer produced, your only options are to copy it or go buy a used copy of it (and unless we're talking about cartridge-based games, you can bet that the original purchaser made a "backup" themselves before selling the game). And if you see a game in some collection of 15-year-old games, do you honestly thing they're paying royalties to the original developers?

So why doesn't someone get Sid Meier on the phone and ask him if he gives a damn about people downloading Civ 1. I'll bet Civ 3 is a little bit better than Civ 1, and chances are he'd love for everybody to get addicted to Civ 1 then go out and spend $49.99 on his new game.

[stormerne]

Be that as it may, it is still the policy of this website not to allow the publishing of sources for Civilization downloads.

As Civ1 moderator it is my job to enforce that policy. If that means the deletion or editing of posts, then so be it.

It is, however, not my job to create the policy. If you want to influence that policy, you could contact the site's Adminstrator, Thunderfall, by private message.

[bvd]

Many of these antiquated DOS games, Civilization included, are only marginally playable and may have trouble functioning on newer systems, so it would be very unscrupulous to market them as “classics”. I support Abandonware, though Civfanatics’ hosts do not; would it be possible for me to post slightly cryptic links? If anyone’s interested, I can forward the DOS versions of Civilization (with my own little editor) and Colonization if you contact me via private message. Good games, but you can think of the former as a scaled-down version of Civ II and the latter as a redundant, overcomplicated one.



Dimension:
Two years ago, when I first had internet access, I played a copy of Civ I procured on a website titled "Software Sucks" - and was soon enslaved, impelled to buy both Civ II and SMAC...

[stormerne]

No links please bvd, cryptic or otherwise.
Whatever you supply by private messaging is of course your own business.

[Genghis Janeway]

I got Civ and Colonization DOS and Windows version at the local Best Buy for $10.00.