Technology tree & Game eras

[GeoModder]

Erm, tell me again what your changes should show? I see no difference at first sight?

[woodelf]

Do you have TXT_KEY errors? You shouldn't.

Does the pedia say anything, does the strategy say anything?

[joelwest]

Originally Posted by GeoModder

Okay, here's a proposal for a beginning of the tech tree:

We use most of the 'future' techs from the civ4 tech tree. Composites, Fiber Optics, Ecology (perhaps rename this one), Genetics and Robotics.
Genetics could be the starting point for Low-G Medicine, Ecology+Composites for Hydroponics (glasshouses), Robotics for Lunar Mining and so on...

This to simulate our Earthly origins, and the solutions we find on an inhospitable moon with this technology as a basis.

I have proposed a to-do list that prioritizes mod updates based upon a series of mod revisions scaling up in complexity of changes that are needed.

this proposed a to-do list is post #3 in the Plans thread -

http://forums.civfanatics.com/showth...41#post5291741

under the framework I have proposed the revised tech tree can wait until version 0.23a is cleaned up enough to rekindle interest in this mod by the greater Civ 4 community.

implenting the changes I itemize just to fix version0.23a is going to take awhile. during that period of time the new era framework and tech its resulting tech tree can be worked on in parallel, but not intended for release in the mod until the major patch to 0.23a is completely finished.

[woodelf]

Deep down I think we always planned on "polishing" what we had done and then restarting using some of the old and a lot of experience from what works and doesn't.

We definitely need to rekindle some interest.

[GeoModder]

Guess it has to come out sometime, so why not now?

Joelwest, I have the impression you seem to think you'll just post your ideas and priorities around and expect us to follow them blindly, which seem to boil down on debugging the mod at present, and adding some of yours "wannahaves" like aliens and a religion based on some "alien progenitor" ideal.
I tell you here and now I have no intention to do such thing! In my view, this mod as it is, is a failure. It needs to be rethought for the most part simply because the original coders who based the already done part on their ideas are gone and we simply cannot know what the existing code is meant to become later on.

[joelwest]

Originally Posted by GeoModder

Guess it has to come out sometime, so why not now?

Joelwest, I have the impression you seem to think you'll just post your ideas and priorities around and expect us to follow them blindly, which seem to boil down on debugging the mod at present, and adding some of yours "wannahaves" like aliens and a religion based on some "alien progenitor" ideal.
I tell you here and now I have no intention to do such thing! In my view, this mod as it is, is a failure. It needs to be rethought for the most part simply because the original coders who based the already done part on their ideas are gone and we simply cannot know what the existing code is meant to become later on.

fine by me.

the priority list should be adjusted to indicate what we need to do and the order it needs to be done.

if you do not think it is correct or you have an entirely different vision, please post this.

my concern is not that my "vision" be used but that the more pressing work is done before the less pressing work, ie who is going to play traffic cop?

[AlazkanAssassin]

Hello guys, here are some thoughts on game eras and plot:

Era 1: Colonization

Why are we here?
Mining!

What do we do?
Attempt to control as much of the Resource as possible, and sell it to earth.
Focus on finding and exploiting mining opportunities.
Technology focuses on improving exploitation of the Resource.
Expansion is easy, but limited.

Victory is achievable in this era through conquest or near-monopolization of the resource

Most of the moons surface is useless at this point, as it is not near the Resource.

This resource is now VITAL to the advancement of Earthly nations and peoples and the activities on the moon have a profound impact on the politics on earth.

As time goes on, earth becomes more and more dependant upon the resource and they will war over control of it. Earth Stability is influenced by the balance of the resource getting to earth. Profits increase as stability decreases.

If the resource transport to earth is the same for all moon-colonies than earth will destabilize slowly. If there are unbalances in resource transport to earth it will destabilize quickly because of attempts to get more of the resource by nations/groups that get less. If the resource transport to earth becomes extremely unbalanced (monopolized) it will stabilize the earth again because one faction will be have all the power.


Era 2: Survival

Political destabilization on earth has caused a cataclysmic war, destroying the earth and stopping all trade with it.

Why are we here?
There is nowhere else to go!

What do we do?
Trying to survive without our main source of income, food

Focus on surviving the challenges now faced.
Technology focuses on self sufficiency, defense, exploiting other available moon resources. New tech tree Trunk opened up with ties to previous techs.

Barbarians begin now, as refugees fleeing the Earth from earth orbiting stations and from the planet itself. Debris, rocks and radioactive debris rain down onto the moon from earth orbit.

New ways to utilize the resources are developed and expanded. new areas of the surface become useful as they contain resources now desired. Still large areas Unusable, unexplorable.

Conquest/domination remains as only victory condition, aided by the likely destruction of several unfit opponents by barbs and disasters.


Era 3: Civilization

Society has passed a threshold and is no longer struggling for survival, methods of food production and distribution are available and in place. Societies can concern themselves with less urgent needs.

Cultural achievements begin to be useful. Numerous wonders available.
Cultural and diplomatic victory conditions come into play.
Deep mining of the moon is in full force and most of cities is deep underground to protect from radiation/meteor.

With survival behind, man's thoughts turn again to greed.
Most of the useable surface will be built-up and resources on the moon will begin to look scarce.
Wars for monopolization of the moon's limited resources scale up.
International conflict is essential to this era.
Weapons capable of scarring the surface (planet busters) are produced again.

Era 4: Invasion!
Powerful aliens attack the moon to destroy what is left of mankind, which they see as a sort of parasite destroying worlds. (We did destroy earth after all) The escape of man onto other bodies becomes possible as well, with Alien technology. Man must spread out onto other planets/systems so we don’t get exterminated by them.
Space race victory enabled.
Triggered by some level of ecological destruction on the moon. terrain improvments, planetbusters, population, etc.
New tech tree Trunk based on Alien technology opened up with ties to previous techs.
Technological breakthroughs allow unheard of abilities.


Alternative Era 4: Transcendence
The No Aliens option.

It is discovered that the Moon can, like the earth before it, Die.
Either through mans folly, stressed placed on it by earths destruction or premature expansion of the sun into red giant, or whatever we want. The escape of man onto other bodies becomes paramount.
Space race victory enabled.
New Technological "save the moon" victory also enabled via tremendous research and acquisition of key resources and location on the moon.
Technological breakthroughs allow unheard of abilities.

[woodelf]

Damn AA, that sounds like what we want to do with this mod.

I'll have time to really read it later on, but I'm glad to see you here man!

[woodelf]

This is really, really what we want to look into for the BtS version. Very nice layout AA.

[frenchman]

Originally Posted by woodelf

This is really, really what we want to look into for the BtS version. Very nice layout AA.

I propose to you this first era picture:



I will continue to release all the eras... My idea is to represent a terraforming of the moon through the eras...

[GeoModder]

Hey Frenchman, nice pictures but could you keep in mind that the Moon has no atmosphere?

[frenchman]

Originally Posted by GeoModder

Hey Frenchman, nice pictures but could you keep in mind that the Moon has no atmosphere?

That's right... I imagine that the terraforming will re-create the atmosphere... ? So first picture without atmosphere and more and more atmosphere with wind and dust... etc..

[AlazkanAssassin]

I'd say there's an important design decision here:
Will we terraform the Moon,
or do we live in pressurized buildings and vehicles?


My opinion is that we would not attempt to terraform the moon at all until the very last era of the game. We simply wouldn't have the resources to do it.

[woodelf]

Nice pic frenchman!

My thoughts exactly AA. Terraforming comes late in the game if at all for now. We could keep adding eras if we have to because of the potential this mod has.

[GeoModder]

Originally Posted by frenchman

That's right... I imagine that the terraforming will re-create the atmosphere... ? So first picture without atmosphere and more and more atmosphere with wind and dust... etc..

Frankly, the Moon will never be able to hold an atmoshpere. Its gravity is too low for that.

[AlazkanAssassin]

We can come up with ways around silly phisical reality.
Buried gravity generators, orbital antigravity satilites, EM forcefields, a giant glass greenhouse around the whole moon, whatever we want.

The main question is if we want terraforming or not.

[frenchman]

Originally Posted by GeoModder

Frankly, the Moon will never be able to hold an atmoshpere. Its gravity is too low for that.

I agree with Alazkan... Even if Geomodder is totally right... It would be funny to terraform moon, adding forest and other nature things, progressively during the game..

[woodelf]

Technology will allow these things if we so choose.

[frenchman]

Originally Posted by woodelf

Technology will allow these things if we so choose.

New era picture added without atmosphere... Little bit sad...

[woodelf]

Originally Posted by frenchman

New era picture added without atmosphere... Little bit sad...

The first era won't be happy frenchman. That pic looks great.