TAM 1.99B released

Laurino · Jul 11, 2007, 04:52 AM

Get it!

Including many new graphics, new Salt ressource, a new normal map, new Smithy event, new promotions, and various balancing adjustments, this version is the ground work for TAM v2.0, wich will be the final Vanilla release, and will include new civics, new techtree, and much more.

Spearthrower · Jul 11, 2007, 05:30 AM

Wow... exciting!

So pleased to see a new version up and more to come!

woodelf · Jul 11, 2007, 05:56 AM

This is good news. Thanks Laurino.

Laurino · Jul 11, 2007, 11:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by woodelf

This is good news. Thanks Laurino.

My pleasure, but I was not alone working, our whole team is back on the mod, with also many new members, be sure to check the loadscreen

Now here's the changelist:

IMPROVEMENTS

- Windmills are gone from TAM
- Farm can now be built on hills, but hill farms don't carry irrigation

RESSOURCES

- Stone revealed from the start
- Timber revealed from start
- Salt Ressource added, used by building to improve commerce
- Bananas removed

ACTION

- Forest chopping moved to Copper Working
- Imperial Roads now added, working a bit like Vanilla Railroads

PROMOTIONS

- Navigation promotions availavle from start to naval units
- Navigation III promotion added, giving +2 movement

GFX

- 100% working GameFonts
- New boat models
- New Falxman model
- New building/wonders models
- New Static movies for TAM wonders
- New animated Leaderheads

TEXTS

- All main tags correctly linked
- Italian translation improved
- French translation improved

CITIES

- City graphics scale boosted

UNITS

- Scouts moved to Hunting
- Armored Javelineers moved to Wood Working, still requires Bronze Working

BUILDINGS

- Lighthouse moved to Boat Building
- Great Lighthouse moved to Boat Building, still requires masonry
- Pallissades moved to Copper Working, requires Wood working
- Caravan house now with Urbanization, still requires Currency
- Winery now 10% commerce, no more GP points

SOUND

- All units linked to "proper" group language
- New MainScreen music
- Correctly linked diplomacy music

MAP ADJUST

- 3 Mediterranean maps with Salt

SOLVED BUGS

- All units linked properly
- Tech icons displaying right
- Religion Tech Icon fixed
- Unit Combat icons linked properly

Jet · Jul 11, 2007, 02:04 PM

~~~~~

woodelf · Jul 11, 2007, 02:14 PM

The link at the top is bad. I'll check the main thread.

edit - works now

Laurino · Jul 11, 2007, 02:39 PM

Just uploaded the link, we had some adjustments to make. All is workin fine now

woodelf · Jul 11, 2007, 02:40 PM

I edited as you posted. Thanks.

fabmp · Jul 11, 2007, 03:22 PM

That's really good new. TAM is one of my favourite mod. I think CIV really suit the ancient times.

Thank you all

Fiend777Fits · Jul 11, 2007, 11:04 PM

i hope this isnt the final vanilla tam version. a nice flashy scenario but very boring. i never see any wars and everybody pretty much stays cautious or annoyed with you the entire time. ive lost interest in this mod fast due to this duldrom.

Laurino · Jul 12, 2007, 01:38 AM

2.0 will be the last Vanilla release, and real scenarios will come afterwards. Once BTS work starts, we can always make adjustment to Vanilla, but no bnig worked will be devoted to it.

attackdrone · Jul 15, 2007, 03:31 AM

Thanks for the update! This has been since the early days of Civ3 and continues to be one of my favorite modifications!

rapiduser · Jul 15, 2007, 07:51 AM

hi,

i´m happy to see that this Modu continues.
I have uploaded it to rapidshare...
So it´s alway available

http://rapidshare.com/files/43031485/TAM_v1.99b.exe

Seidrik_The_Gray · Jul 18, 2007, 09:17 AM

I had a chance to try out the new version. Very nice!

I'm happy to see that you incorporated much of my additions to the Normal map.

I haven't checked the huge map yet, but that already had some of my recommendations in it.

I love the new graphics and the new leader heads! I usually choose single unit graphics, but these are so nice, that I've left them on. The six phalanx formation for the Greeks is very representative.

As for this mod being boring...what??? I just started a game as the Romans (primarily since they are in the heart of the region where most of my recent recommendations were made) and on the Monarch setting, with raging barbs, this is not boring my friends! I am currently at ~1500 BC. Teuta has been at war with either or both Decebal and Agamemnon the whole game so far. Vercingetorix and Arminius have also already been at war most of the game. It's early on, true, but that's allot of combat!

Also, as the Romans, I've expanded to capture all of the Northern Italian peninsula and settled the city location SE of Rome (near the ankle of the boot if you will). My economy is slowing down, but still around 60-70% research. I'm on Epic, have completed stonehenge and am working on building a great engineer at another city to get the Sphinx as well. I fully expect to be in a Naval war with Agamemnon and/or Dido shortly. I can also fully expect to be at war with Vercingetorix at some point.

Once those wars are won, and once I have all of the Italian Peninsula and possibly Carthage and a city on the Island of Sicily, then it's off to conquering the rest of the cities on the Med.

Hardly expect that to be boring, a rather decent challenge even in this Mod on Monarch.

Whitefire · Jul 18, 2007, 07:18 PM

Babylonian Archers are overpowered and should have their +15% vs. cities removed.

I know it's a bit drastic but hear me out. I recently played 3 games as Babylon in order to test this out, and every test came to the same conclusion. In the first 100 Turns, the Babylonian UU is unequaled in power. The only reasonable counter is a Spearman unit, but the AI (and players) will hold off on that tech until ones such as Wheel, Animal Husbandry and Agriculture are finished.

Now, the Babylonian UU get +1 Strength and +15% vs. city attack over standard archery units. This is essentially a vanilla Archer with +15% vs. cities. That's not bad, but you have to factor in two other things:

1) They also receive a free Drill I
2) Warriors do not receive a +25% city bonus

The balance in Vanilla civ is that a fully fortified Warrior receives +25% from being fortified and +25% for being in a city. This means that, without promotions, an Archer attacking a Warrior in a city is a coin flip on who will win.

Adding a +15% to this isn't game breaking per se, since it should only bring the odds up to around 57-43 in the attacking Archer's favor. However, in TAM, warriors lose the 25% city bonus and the Babylonian Archer receives 2-3 First Strikes without any promotions. This shifts the odds to roughly 70%-30% in favor of the attacking Babylonian Archer. Javileneers are only slighty better since Archery units receive a bonus vs. Skirmisher units.

Now, applying this to a Mediterranean world map, which is the point of this mod, the smart player will do the following.

1) Beeline to Archery
2) Build Hero, take Persepolis and any other Persian cities. This eliminates their nasty UU before they can grab it.
3) Conquer Media
4) Conquer Phonecia, only keeping their coastal cities. The inland cities usually suck.

Now, Babylon controls the entire fertile crescent with Hittites and Kolchians being a minimal nuisance in expansion. This is even worse in the provided Huge map, since conquering those 3 civs essentially gives Babylon 20% of the entire map to expand into with only Barbarians to worry about. The fix is to remove the +15% vs. city attack, which leaves the odds in favor of the Babylonian Archer but not overpoweringly so.

EDIT: Please realize this will be even worse in any BTS adaptation of the mod. The player will take Persepolis and use it's stone to build the Great Wall, making them immune to Barbarians.

EDIT 3: I also forgot to mention Collateral Damage which makes the cumulative efforts of the archers much worse.

Whitefire · Jul 18, 2007, 07:35 PM

Heros should be more expensive. I find that I sacrifice them often since I know it's cost is not balanced with the promotions they receive and their relative strength.

Spearthrower · Jul 18, 2007, 08:58 PM

I'm hoping to see Heroes become something different in the future. Good feedback on Babylon.... I'll go give it a try.... but it seems like you'd end up crashing your economy if you did as outlined above. I personally found that I always take out Babylon too quickly playing as Media or Persia.

Whitefire · Jul 18, 2007, 09:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Spearthrower

I'm hoping to see Heroes become something different in the future. Good feedback on Babylon.... I'll go give it a try.... but it seems like you'd end up crashing your economy if you did as outlined above. I personally found that I always take out Babylon too quickly playing as Media or Persia.

On Monarch and lower difficulty, crashing your economy in the first 300-400 turns (on Epic speed) doesn't matter since you can carve out a very specific tech path in order to facilitate tech trade and backfill.

One other thing, the Briton's stone needs to be more accessible. They are always beaten to Stonehenge, and the historical inaccuracy annoys me.

Whitefire · Jul 18, 2007, 09:23 PM

TAM needs a settlers map like RFC has. I am willing to help out with the creation of one. However, I will not take responsibility for the entire project.

Whitefire · Jul 18, 2007, 09:49 PM

Can you remove the limit on how many XP points a unit can receive from Barbs?

Jul 11, 2007, 04:52 AM	#1
Laurino Warlord Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Montréal Posts: 158	TAM 1.99B released Get it! Including many new graphics, new Salt ressource, a new normal map, new Smithy event, new promotions, and various balancing adjustments, this version is the ground work for TAM v2.0, wich will be the final Vanilla release, and will include new civics, new techtree, and much more. __________________ TAM... That's all there is to say... Last edited by Laurino; Jul 11, 2007 at 02:38 PM.

Jul 11, 2007, 05:30 AM	#2
Spearthrower Thrower of spears Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Bangkok Posts: 1,602	Wow... exciting! So pleased to see a new version up and more to come! __________________ Reality is what you bump into in the dark.

Jul 11, 2007, 02:04 PM	#5
Jet No, no, please. Please. Join Date: Mar 2006 Posts: 2,145	~~~~~ ~~~~~

Jul 11, 2007, 02:14 PM	#6
woodelf Bard Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Gallery Posts: 15,035	The link at the top is bad. I'll check the main thread. edit - works now Last edited by woodelf; Jul 11, 2007 at 02:39 PM.

Jul 11, 2007, 02:39 PM	#7
Laurino Warlord Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Montréal Posts: 158	Link all good Just uploaded the link, we had some adjustments to make. All is workin fine now __________________ TAM... That's all there is to say...

Jul 11, 2007, 05:56 AM	#3
woodelf Bard Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Gallery Posts: 15,035	This is good news. Thanks Laurino.

Jul 11, 2007, 02:40 PM	#8
woodelf Bard Join Date: Jun 2003 Location: Gallery Posts: 15,035	I edited as you posted. Thanks.

Jul 11, 2007, 03:22 PM	#9
fabmp Chieftain Join Date: May 2007 Posts: 10	That's really good new. TAM is one of my favourite mod. I think CIV really suit the ancient times. Thank you all

Jul 11, 2007, 11:04 PM	#10
Fiend777Fits Social Parasite Join Date: Sep 2006 Location: Agrasse Knoll, Texas Posts: 303	i hope this isnt the final vanilla tam version. a nice flashy scenario but very boring. i never see any wars and everybody pretty much stays cautious or annoyed with you the entire time. ive lost interest in this mod fast due to this duldrom.

Jul 12, 2007, 01:38 AM	#11
Laurino Warlord Join Date: Jan 2006 Location: Montréal Posts: 158	2.0 will be the last Vanilla release, and real scenarios will come afterwards. Once BTS work starts, we can always make adjustment to Vanilla, but no bnig worked will be devoted to it. __________________ TAM... That's all there is to say...

Jul 15, 2007, 03:31 AM	#12
attackdrone Chieftain Join Date: Apr 2007 Location: San Diego, CA Posts: 85	Thanks for the update! This has been since the early days of Civ3 and continues to be one of my favorite modifications! __________________ Quantity has a quality all its own. -Josef Stalin, on tanks

Jul 15, 2007, 07:51 AM	#13
rapiduser Chieftain Join Date: Oct 2006 Posts: 67	hi, i´m happy to see that this Modu continues. I have uploaded it to rapidshare... So it´s alway available http://rapidshare.com/files/43031485/TAM_v1.99b.exe

Jul 18, 2007, 09:17 AM	#14
Seidrik_The_Gray Seidrik The Gray Join Date: Jun 2006 Posts: 1,115	I had a chance to try out the new version. Very nice! I'm happy to see that you incorporated much of my additions to the Normal map. I haven't checked the huge map yet, but that already had some of my recommendations in it. I love the new graphics and the new leader heads! I usually choose single unit graphics, but these are so nice, that I've left them on. The six phalanx formation for the Greeks is very representative. As for this mod being boring...what??? I just started a game as the Romans (primarily since they are in the heart of the region where most of my recent recommendations were made) and on the Monarch setting, with raging barbs, this is not boring my friends! I am currently at ~1500 BC. Teuta has been at war with either or both Decebal and Agamemnon the whole game so far. Vercingetorix and Arminius have also already been at war most of the game. It's early on, true, but that's allot of combat! Also, as the Romans, I've expanded to capture all of the Northern Italian peninsula and settled the city location SE of Rome (near the ankle of the boot if you will). My economy is slowing down, but still around 60-70% research. I'm on Epic, have completed stonehenge and am working on building a great engineer at another city to get the Sphinx as well. I fully expect to be in a Naval war with Agamemnon and/or Dido shortly. I can also fully expect to be at war with Vercingetorix at some point. Once those wars are won, and once I have all of the Italian Peninsula and possibly Carthage and a city on the Island of Sicily, then it's off to conquering the rest of the cities on the Med. Hardly expect that to be boring, a rather decent challenge even in this Mod on Monarch.

Jul 18, 2007, 07:18 PM	#15
Whitefire Emperor Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 1,178	Babylonian Archers are overpowered and should have their +15% vs. cities removed. I know it's a bit drastic but hear me out. I recently played 3 games as Babylon in order to test this out, and every test came to the same conclusion. In the first 100 Turns, the Babylonian UU is unequaled in power. The only reasonable counter is a Spearman unit, but the AI (and players) will hold off on that tech until ones such as Wheel, Animal Husbandry and Agriculture are finished. Now, the Babylonian UU get +1 Strength and +15% vs. city attack over standard archery units. This is essentially a vanilla Archer with +15% vs. cities. That's not bad, but you have to factor in two other things: 1) They also receive a free Drill I 2) Warriors do not receive a +25% city bonus The balance in Vanilla civ is that a fully fortified Warrior receives +25% from being fortified and +25% for being in a city. This means that, without promotions, an Archer attacking a Warrior in a city is a coin flip on who will win. Adding a +15% to this isn't game breaking per se, since it should only bring the odds up to around 57-43 in the attacking Archer's favor. However, in TAM, warriors lose the 25% city bonus and the Babylonian Archer receives 2-3 First Strikes without any promotions. This shifts the odds to roughly 70%-30% in favor of the attacking Babylonian Archer. Javileneers are only slighty better since Archery units receive a bonus vs. Skirmisher units. Now, applying this to a Mediterranean world map, which is the point of this mod, the smart player will do the following. 1) Beeline to Archery 2) Build Hero, take Persepolis and any other Persian cities. This eliminates their nasty UU before they can grab it. 3) Conquer Media 4) Conquer Phonecia, only keeping their coastal cities. The inland cities usually suck. Now, Babylon controls the entire fertile crescent with Hittites and Kolchians being a minimal nuisance in expansion. This is even worse in the provided Huge map, since conquering those 3 civs essentially gives Babylon 20% of the entire map to expand into with only Barbarians to worry about. The fix is to remove the +15% vs. city attack, which leaves the odds in favor of the Babylonian Archer but not overpoweringly so. EDIT: Please realize this will be even worse in any BTS adaptation of the mod. The player will take Persepolis and use it's stone to build the Great Wall, making them immune to Barbarians. EDIT 3: I also forgot to mention Collateral Damage which makes the cumulative efforts of the archers much worse. Last edited by Whitefire; Jul 18, 2007 at 07:26 PM. Reason: i before e except after c

Jul 18, 2007, 07:35 PM	#16
Whitefire Emperor Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 1,178	Heros should be more expensive. I find that I sacrifice them often since I know it's cost is not balanced with the promotions they receive and their relative strength.

Jul 18, 2007, 08:58 PM	#17
Spearthrower Thrower of spears Join Date: Mar 2003 Location: Bangkok Posts: 1,602	I'm hoping to see Heroes become something different in the future. Good feedback on Babylon.... I'll go give it a try.... but it seems like you'd end up crashing your economy if you did as outlined above. I personally found that I always take out Babylon too quickly playing as Media or Persia. __________________ Reality is what you bump into in the dark.

Jul 18, 2007, 09:23 PM	#19
Whitefire Emperor Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 1,178	TAM needs a settlers map like RFC has. I am willing to help out with the creation of one. However, I will not take responsibility for the entire project.

Jul 18, 2007, 09:49 PM	#20
Whitefire Emperor Join Date: Jan 2006 Posts: 1,178	Can you remove the limit on how many XP points a unit can receive from Barbs?

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