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Old May 26, 2008, 10:00 PM   #921
The13thRonin
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OOC: This is so much of a MY-E-MEMBER is bigger than YOUR-E-MEMBER kind of debate. I tire of it... You guys haven't exactly built up the best kind of environment to bring new players into your community, its sad to think that a person can be so consumed by their avatar that they will grief against other people for wanting to have some fun. If you're so knowledgeable, and I don't doubt you are Symphony D. and flyingchicken. How about you guys control Australia, Victoria, all of China's colonies and every other current open slot available. That way you won't have to deal with any new people at all. You'll have the game all to yourselves. Because that's what this is about isn't it, this is about you deciding that your actions nay, opinions are more plausible than another persons. As evidenced by the whole China/America/Russia ring of dominance we see going on. You're plausible when it suits you.

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Originally Posted by flyingchicken View Post
Like, you know, North Korea and Nazi Germany.
I see... That's why China helped defeat the Nazi's and North Koreans right? Oh hang on... Maybe China helped with Vietnam... No... Iraq perhaps... Not a chance... Oh what a shame...
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Old May 26, 2008, 10:05 PM   #922
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i'm new. no one made me feel any less welcome.
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Old May 26, 2008, 10:07 PM   #923
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Originally Posted by Velvet View Post
i'm new. no one made me feel any less welcome.
Congratulations, would you like one or two Chinese colonies?

Last post on the issue, I'm over it.
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Old May 26, 2008, 10:08 PM   #924
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We give our positions and our reasons, as strongly as we want. We don't decide anything--the moderator does that.
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Old May 26, 2008, 10:18 PM   #925
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Originally Posted by The13thRonin View Post
would you like one or two Chinese colonies?
no, thanks, I have a Brazilian colony to develop.

Last edited by Velvet; May 26, 2008 at 10:47 PM. Reason: embarrassment
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Old May 26, 2008, 10:21 PM   #926
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OOC: Unless anyone protests I'm beginning my orders for this turn.
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Old May 26, 2008, 10:22 PM   #927
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Quote:
Originally Posted by TerrisH View Post
OOC: Ah, I think I might be the reason they are lasting so long. still waiting from clarification for chad and my Tech PM from him though. so I might not be.
OOC: You cannot *possibly* be the sole factor propping him up. I know you like your grandiose plans terrisH, but seriously

Quote:
Originally Posted by TerrisH View Post
OOC: Way to many opportunities to profit from this... AAHHHRRGHH!! waiting is so hard when you have two pages of potinail Ideas ready. but I must not press the moderator.. I will wait.. calmly, and peacefully.
aahggh. must do something. Did anyone put a Claim on 151-056A in the Nu system LAST turn. I need to know if it is claimed as of last update, so I can know if I can use it in my plan, or if I should look for another planet in another system..
OOC: You know, if only out of sheer spite terrisH, I would say the system has been claimed. Stop talking about your plans!
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Old May 26, 2008, 10:42 PM   #928
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Quote:
Originally Posted by The13thRonin View Post
2. Oh and it's really realistic China, Russia and America sharing information like that. Heh... Real realistic and all...
OOC: I guess it just went right over your head. See that OOC tag in front? Yah? I don't "know" this in character. That's not the point. The point is your behavior is so ridiculous that countries whose players don't normally otherwise talk to one another except in the vaguest of terms out of character are willing to warn each other about it, because none of us like it.

Imagine that we are playing golf. You are basically our Happy Gilmore. We don't like what you're doing, because it doesn't fit in with what's been done. You are going against not just our wishes, but the mood, atmosphere and purpose of the game. We're not chewing you out because you're doing what you want. We're chewing you out because what you want doesn't make sense. It doesn't fit. It doesn't belong.

I am going to outline this clearly and simply: this game isn't about Earth. It isn't about who's Mr. Badass on the planet. It's about colonies. You aren't here, realistically, to become a superpower. Doing things to do that is pointless, because you won't make it. You don't have the population, you don't have the resources, you don't have the industry, and you don't have the economy. You never will. You will not be a top grade power. Aspiring to that by being sneaky and underhanded is therefore pointless and stupid.

The point here is to build colonies. It is to colonize space. You can't do that on your own. If we cut off your support, you will fail, even if we need take further steps to ensure such. And we will cut off that support if you go Rampant and decide to go against the purpose of the game, because from our nations point of view, that would be just flat insane.

That is exactly what you are doing. And that is why we don't like it. You are unnecessarily wandering off into the deep end for no damn good reason at all, just because you want to. That offends our sensibilities.

So, if you actually do what you're supposed to--that is, focus on development of your rock--and don't act like a crazy, maybe there wouldn't be problems.
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Old May 26, 2008, 10:45 PM   #929
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I quite like being compared to Happy Gilmore. Apart from that I can assure you that henceforth I will attempt to not 'rock the boat'.
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Old May 26, 2008, 10:46 PM   #930
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OOC: Unless anyone protests I'm beginning my orders for this turn.
After reading your previous posts (as well as the rest of the debate), I kind of feel like protesting that. Though I guess Chandrasekhar won't allow things to get out of hand here...
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Old May 26, 2008, 10:51 PM   #931
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Quote:
Originally Posted by das View Post
After reading your previous posts (as well as the rest of the debate), I kind of feel like protesting that. Though I guess Chandrasekhar won't allow things to get out of hand here...
Keep in mind that I am in constant contact with Chandrasekhar and he invited me to join the NES. As you said he wouldn't allow anything crazy. I think he means to hone my understandings of how NES' work. And true to form any time Chandrasekhar asks me to leave the game I'm out as fast as you can say "bananawaffles".
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Old May 26, 2008, 11:12 PM   #932
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Quote:
Originally Posted by alex994 View Post
OOC: You cannot *possibly* be the sole factor propping him up. I know you like your grandiose plans terrisH, but seriously



OOC: You know, if only out of sheer spite terrisH, I would say the system has been claimed. Stop talking about your plans!
OOC: Actually, I have no clue WHY I would be the primary reason, other then I maybe selling him supplies from earth. all I got from chad was something about a great opportunity concerning them.
And It's just my corps first colony I'm planing. no grand plans really. It's just I have a story half written.
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Old May 27, 2008, 01:42 PM   #933
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OOC: Libertarian... yeah. *President Stoiber hides his swastikas*

Anyway, the stinker in my inbox makes me want to clarify that I wasn't defending Ronin. I just believe that it is the job of the mod to realistically deal with poor decisions, and not the job of the players to browbeat another into doing what they want. Elementary schools have lectures and special assemblies to deal with that.

I'm starting to draft this turn's set of questions to Chand, though I'll probably wait for the last of the stats to go up before finishing them
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Old May 27, 2008, 02:13 PM   #934
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Shadowbound View Post
I'm starting to draft this turn's set of questions to Chand, though I'll probably wait for the last of the stats to go up before finishing them
As you should - I won't outright reject orders sent this early, but after I complete the colony stats, and send out tech report PMs, some players may wish to take some notable public actions. This, in turn, may affect other players' orders.
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Old May 27, 2008, 11:57 PM   #935
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Browbeating helps, though, doesn't it?
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"Her Majesty has terrible dreams. She sees England as a small country that lives in peace, and no one at the court dares tell her that Rome started out the same way. His Catholic Majesty was once content with ruling half the world; I am afraid we will have to take all of it." - Humphrey Gilbert
"I am not at all a friend of humanity, Viscount replied. I am the enemy of its enemies." - S. Vititsky, "The Search for Designation, or the Twenty Seventh Theorem of Ethics".

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Old May 28, 2008, 07:55 AM   #936
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Yes... Yes, it does.
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Old Jun 02, 2008, 07:00 AM   #937
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Midway Point


Turnwise, this Pre-NES is halfway to its destination. We have six more updates to go - together, they will cover 30 years, putting the start of the main NES at the year 2165, over a century after the Stigma event. This last update will probably have been the most difficult of the lot. All the future ones will cover just five years each, so they should hopefully be easier to deal with.

That said, I feel like passing out some awards to compensate for the long delay this time. Considering the nature of this Pre-NES, these awards will not focus so much on nation absolutes (greatest economy, greatest military, etc.), but will instead be granted based on what each player has done with the nation or colony they've picked.

Awards


Greatest Rise to Power: Symphony D., Russian Federation - Symphony took a middle-tier power, Russia, and handicapped it with a difficult recent history to better suit the situation. Despite this, he's managed to use diplomatic leverage to make it a contender among the top powers, capable of competing with the rest. Toltec deserves an honorable mention here - rising from nothing at all to where Bacchus is now is certainly a great improvement.

Greatest Loss of Power: Fuschia, Islamic Confederation - The concept of an Islamic Confederation was a tough one to work with, but Fuschia was well set to become a victorious underdog before World War III broke out. Though some may criticize his handling of the war itself, historians have begun to speculate that the IC may have been doomed before it began...

Most Insidious Plot: Head Serf, United States of America - Though Head Serf's departure from the Pre-NES was less than honorable, his actions early on were certainly well placed. As soon as it was clear that Indonesia and a possible confederation of Islamic states might pose a threat to American interests, Head Serf put in motion some clever plots to end the threat before it began. This particular spot has a couple of runner-ups worthy of mention, but none of their plots have reached the point where I can speak of them.

Most Unfortunate Nation: Lord Iggy, European Union - This is not a result of any animosity on my part for the nation, nor can it be attributed to any incompetence on Lord Iggy's part, but Europe has really faced a lot of misfortune during this Pre-NES. From the secession of Bacchus to the recent pirating event, these pacifists have had their tempers tested quite often.

Most Aggressive Colonization: Lord Iggy, European Union - The Europeans' rate of colonization may be unsustainable in the long run (and arguably in the short run as well), but it certainly deserves mention. Even the PRC hasn't been so prolific as the EU in this regard.

Least Aggressive Colonization: Head Serf, flyingchicken, United States of America - For the moment, the US seems to be quite content with just its extrasolar colony on Carmenta. In-system, Mars has far outstripped that, but even counting Mars, America's rate of colonization has been less than that of any other power - Russia has gotten a late start, but in that short time it has been more active than America.

Most Inquisitive Player: Symphony D., Russian Federation - Here I can only say that Symphony has made thorough usage of his intelligence agencies, forcing me as the mod to flesh out this world beyond the simple stats. Needless to say, this is a useful attribute for a player. Honorable mention here goes to Toltec, for probing the limits of technological advancement within the NES.

Most Historical Single Action: Toltec, Planetary Republic of Bacchus - America under Head Serf was a close contender for this spot, having played such a big part in instigating World War III, but Toltec deserves this one for single-handedly cultivating a revolutionary spirit in Bacchus, and then fulfilling it, shaking up the frontier of interstellar colonization like nothing else.

Best Stories: Symphony D., Russian Federation - This award belongs to Symphony, hands down, as you might have been able to predict by the number of excellent stories in the last several pages of the thread. Take a hint, other players. Honorable mention goes to Haseri of the American Colony of Infinitas for the stories he's contributed as well.

Most Adroit Use of Force: Niklas, People's Republic of China - Aside from a solid showing overall, Niklas managed to use a well-timed military action to virtually secure half the map for the People's Republic - and without even provoking any retalliation. The kicking out of all foreign colonists from Damen during World War III was one of my favorite orders to read.

Deepest Diplomacy: Symphony D., Russian Federation - From the tense negotiations of World War III, to the drafting of CAUST, to the marshalling of ASTRIS's resources, Symphony D. easily snags this award as well. Diplomacy has been highly important in this NES, and should continue to be in the future.

Best Colonial Governor: Shadowbound, European Colony of Olympia - This award was a close one. Toltec might've secured it for Bacchus had he not seceded from the EU, and alex994 was just limited by the innate potential of Damen. Olympia, to contrast, has become Europe's most prized colony, and will likely remain that way for a long time, even after Tyrelia begins to flourish. Shadowbound has certainly capitalized on an already good situation.

---

Now for the commentary on the map and stats.

Firstly, I've ironed out a few errors that were initially in the stats, so you may want to look them over again before drafting your orders. You'll also notice that my "overhaul" wasn't terribly dramatic. Hopefully you'll appreciate the addition of an actual population stat, instead of the generalized order-of-magnitude thingie that was there before. Notice that the stat number is on a logarithmic scale, the exact specifications of which may be tweaked over time. It may be a bit too sharp as-is. I'd welcome commentary on this point.

Also note that I've replaced the somewhat useless "Infrastructure" stat with an "Industry" one. This is relative to the economy of the system in question. Damen's stat of "Unstoppable" indicates that its industrial capacity far, far outweighs what one would expect from a colony with two EP to spend. Brazil, with its stat of "Underdeveloped," can still greatly out-produce it.

I have also considered adding a stat for the number of cities a colony has. This would act rather like a "size" stat in other NESes, representing how much living space each colony has. By comparing this to a system's population, an idea of its population density can be approximated. Less cities would indicate a more crowded colony, while more cities would mean that the population was more dispersed. Obviously, the hospitability of each colony's environment would affect this as well - Olympia might have some sprawling suburbs outside the cities, but Damen certainly doesn't. What would you, the players, think of this?

Finally, the map is below. I should probably notify you now, just in case you're curious, that the scope of the map is growing to encompass the Orion spur, with the Sagittarius arm to the right of the map, the Perseus arm above it, and the Void between the Orion spur and the Perseus arm in the lower-left. The exact proportions might not end up matching that closely with the real Milky Way galaxy. This is fine, as we're already pretty much making up all of the stars beside Sol.

Players can now feel absolutely free to send in their orders. I'll let some time pass before setting the deadline. Players can also still join as governors, independent states, and private organizations, of course. Lastly, if you're expecting a PM from me, bug me again about it. By my tally, I've sent out all the messages I've been asked to.
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Old Jun 02, 2008, 07:26 AM   #938
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Interesting writeup.

Quote:
Damen's stat of "Unstoppable" indicates that its industrial capacity far, far outweighs what one would expect from a colony with two EP to spend.
High-five, alex!

Quote:
What would you, the players, think of this?
Useful.
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"I am not at all a friend of humanity, Viscount replied. I am the enemy of its enemies." - S. Vititsky, "The Search for Designation, or the Twenty Seventh Theorem of Ethics".

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Old Jun 02, 2008, 06:37 PM   #939
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OOC: My patience grows exceptionally thin, flyingchicken.
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Old Jun 02, 2008, 07:03 PM   #940
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the Sonty Corporation hereby announces it plans to establish a automated solar power plant and mining facilities on and in orbit of the the planet "151-056A" in the Nu system. Several of our freighters have already made trips to it, and we have deployed several Artificial life platforms to it's surface for pre-development of the facilities. This effort is not aimed at long term habitation of the planet, but more to build future industrial.
Should a nation of the world which to colonize this planet, please contact us first so we may coudernate our actions, along with the warding programs and equipment for any surface facilities.
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