Best UB for OCC?

[Jaaboo]

Reading the unrestricted leaders thread made me wonder about an OCC - if you were going to play an unrestricted OCC, which Civ would you choose, and would you choose based on the unique building?

Some that come to my mind:

* Salon - yeah I know, its an artist, but a specialist is a specialist and GPP is GPP. And you're going to build an Observatory anyway.
* Forum - more GPP, but a market isn't an common build in a OCC (it can be helpful in upgrading units, I guess).
* Baray - Not sure about this but an Aqueduct is on the build order anyway and more food = more specialists
* Research Institute - Comes so late though...

[r_rolo1]

The Korean UB may be helpful too. Extra 10% in research is quite useful.

[Soirana]

Garden? Two extra health.

[TheMeInTeam]

Possibly apothecary is worthwhile for health too but probably the baray is most consistently best?

[nanomage]

baray is 1/2 spec.
salon gives you 1 whole spec, and russian lab 2 specs.
they are later though.

[BARBEERIAN]

I'd go for the Korean UB too, since the extra research is nice. The Baray is a close second.

[michmbk]

Some of the ones mentioned earlier would make sense to me too. SOme other alternate thoughts:

Depending on your win condition - if going space, maybe the shale plant for production or a levee if you're working 5-6 water tiles?

If you're trying for a beat down and have horses, maybe ger for extra experience for horses (of course, I'm so partial to Mongolia in general for the joy I get playing them). I need to try an OCC with Mongolia with horse in the BFC to see if it works.

[Jaaboo]

I should have added a poll. I forgot about Korea's university. So... let's see if I have my numbers right in rough order of techs;

[Mathematics] Khmer Baray: +1 (1/2 a specialist)
[Currency] Roman Forum: +25%
[Construction] Babylonian Garden: +2
[Education] Korean Seowon: +10%
[Guilds] Persian Apothecary: +2 (= +4 ?)
[Astronomy] French Salon: +3 and +3?
[Superconductors] Russian Research Institute: +12 and +6

Of those, each of those buildings you'd normally build in an OCC except the Market and the Colosseum. The Lab comes veeerrry late in the game but probably at a point when every last is appreciated trying to grind out a space ship.

I dunno looking at when these come in, the Apothecary and Garden look nice - health is a limiting factor - right up until you get Biology. I'd have to say the Seowon or the Salon are the winners. I suppose with a high food start and a leader like Peter of Persia you could forgo the Park.

[JammerUno]

10% extra science vs. 2 specialists until biology? Give me the health buildings any day.

The madrassa deserves consideration as well (as does the monument) since you can run 4 specialists from writing onward, and you're not forced to take CoL early. That in turn lets you take the aesthetics, lit, drama, music path earlier.

[Joshua368]

Why wouldn't you want to build a market in an OCC?

What, you never get Great Prophets?

[michmbk]

I was thinking the same as josh - at some point markets cost like 3-4 turns to build in an OCC, and I often have 1-2 settled prophets since I take more of a wonder approach in those. The extra gold helps for US rush buying later, which can be huge in an OCC under many victory conditions.

[Matthew5117]

What about the Dike? On water maps that would be ridiculous considering you can have 5 wonders of whom some of them can drastically factor your production.

[popejubal]

Sacrificial Altar.

Even in an OCC, I'm going to when the time is right.

[mirthadir]

The Mint/Brokerage/Mall are all useful as well. An early shot at Confucianism can lead to a nice shrine. Mounds of gold come in useful for rushbuying things and for getting trades with the AIs.

My personal vote:
Seowon for the early game
Shale for the late

I like the NP/Nat Epic/Oxford shot for OCC so early game I'm not going to have stupendous amounts of spec slots required. Seowon gets me to Biology faster, this is good.

Shale let's me power sooner and have bonus hammers.

[Jaaboo]

Well the market isn't on the top of my list to build. I suppose that's pretty dumb because building it sooner means more upgrade cash later on.

[pi-r8]

i'd go with the health buildings... i always have trouble getting enough health in a OCC

[mirthadir]

Originally Posted by pi-r8

i'd go with the health buildings... i always have trouble getting enough health in a OCC

That is the wonder of going NP in OCC. You get a metric ton of specs, you have no health worries between the NP itself and your masses of forests. Going Rep/Enviro gives you extremely good research. The only downsides are a slow early game, the loss of some of the IWs bonus, and the extra techs needed to power the place.

[JammerUno]

The shale plant doesn't require coal either, does it stll work when you have the NP in your city?

[popejubal]

Originally Posted by JammerUno

The shale plant doesn't require coal either, does it stll work when you have the NP in your city?

It absolutely does. Shale + Factory + National Park =

Being able to actually use all of your production because you're not being drowned in is a wonderful thing.

[Agramon]

Why does the madrassa get so little votes? 2 GS + 2 GP for writing, isn't that supposed to be helpful?